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 Post subject: Parallel route to M62, for Bradford / Leeds / York ?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 15:13 
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To quote another poster, elsewhere on this site, the M62 J25-30 'has congestion day in day out 5 days a week for about 9-10 hours. It is, in a word, awful'.

- I was wondering if there had ever been any thoughts on relieving this stretch by developing a parallel route that runs: M1/J44 to M621/J7 to M621/J1 to A6110 to A647(Pudsey Bypass) to Central Bradford - all to continuous D2 / D3, and GSJ's all the way

- So this would, in effect, be a Bradford / Southern Leeds / York route, and all independant of the M62 . .


Last edited by AtoB on Fri Feb 17, 2012 11:32, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Parallel route to M62, for Bradford / Leeds / York ?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 16:32 
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Couldn't we just finish the M67? :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: Parallel route to M62, for Bradford / Leeds / York ?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 16:36 
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There have been plans in the past for the Flockton Link, cutting off the corner between the M62 and M1 past Dewsbury.

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 Post subject: Re: Parallel route to M62, for Bradford / Leeds / York ?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 23:43 
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Interesting idea...

There is most definitely a need to resolve the West Yorkshire traffic problem. It's a nightmare. I'm not sure that this is the best way, and (as Peter says) the Flockton link would be a good idea.

IMHO the big problem is the M62/M621 junction (rather like M60 J13 causes the vast majority of NW problems), especially the approach from the west - so a solution to it would have to link to the M62. Chris Marshall came up with the idea of a motorway from the northern point of the M606 to a (redesigned) M62/M621 junction, and I rather like that idea. Bradford needs to be better served from the east, and so a raft of motorway building around this area would probably alleviate the problem much better than the current managed motorway situation between J25-J30 of the M62.


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 Post subject: Re: Parallel route to M62, for Bradford / Leeds / York ?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 09:56 
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stu531 wrote:
Interesting idea...

There is most definitely a need to resolve the West Yorkshire traffic problem. It's a nightmare. I'm not sure that this is the best way, and (as Peter says) the Flockton link would be a good idea.

IMHO the big problem is the M62/M621 junction (rather like M60 J13 causes the vast majority of NW problems), especially the approach from the west - so a solution to it would have to link to the M62. Chris Marshall came up with the idea of a motorway from the northern point of the M606 to a (redesigned) M62/M621 junction, and I rather like that idea. Bradford needs to be better served from the east, and so a raft of motorway building around this area would probably alleviate the problem much better than the current managed motorway situation between J25-J30 of the M62.


Agreed - I think that the Flockton Link would be the logical 'first step' in improving the general situation in W. Yorks, and should have been implemented decades ago - compare the density of the motorway network in W. Yorks to that in NW England, as a comparison. The Flockton Link would have the effect of 'dragging' traffic (going from Bradford & west of Bradford to southern destinations) to the Link, thereby alleviating the mentioned section of the M62 . .

. . And the suggested new link 'from the northern point of M606 to the M62/M621 junction' is also a good idea, and may initially be a good 'quick fix'

Eventually some serious inter-urban Bradford / Leeds DC's need to be considered, which would have the additional effect of 'dragging' some of the Bradford / Leeds traffic that would've used the M62, northwards to a better and more-direct route . .


Last edited by AtoB on Fri Feb 17, 2012 10:50, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Parallel route to M62, for Bradford / Leeds / York ?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 10:22 
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as a regular commuter from the Keighley/A629 area to Leeds, i'd welcome a D2 that would mean i don't have to use the M62. There are other viable routes, i regularly use the A650 to Shipley, the A657 to the Leeds Ring Road & then follow the ring road East to the M621, but this is only viable around 7am, any later & it would be queued up most of the way. The D2 section of A6110/A6120 actually copes well most of the time but the 'ring road' is a confused mess & doesn't even have priority over minor roads crossing it, causing uneccessary queues


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 Post subject: Re: Parallel route to M62, for Bradford / Leeds / York ?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 11:11 
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hat wrote:
as a regular commuter from the Keighley/A629 area to Leeds, i'd welcome a D2 that would mean i don't have to use the M62. There are other viable routes, i regularly use the A650 to Shipley, the A657 to the Leeds Ring Road & then follow the ring road East to the M621, but this is only viable around 7am, any later & it would be queued up most of the way. The D2 section of A6110/A6120 actually copes well most of the time but the 'ring road' is a confused mess & doesn't even have priority over minor roads crossing it, causing uneccessary queues


Thanks Hat, appreciated - you have provided real first-hand evidence that even the over-worked M62 in W. Yorks provides a more viable route than the supposedly more-direct Bradford / Leeds routes! Gosh, I wonder what the calculated Cost / Benefit ratio of the route I've described actually is? - especially since it would need only approx. 7 miles of route-improvement along the route: M621/J1 to A6177/A647 at Laisterdyke :shock:

I may well call my route 'the M647' :P


Last edited by AtoB on Fri Feb 17, 2012 12:44, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Parallel route to M62, for Bradford / Leeds / York ?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 12:14 
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My vote would be for an M65 eastward extension, along the route of the A6068 from Colne to Cross Hills, then along the route of the A629 to Keighley and the A650 through Bradford to meet the M62, with possibly a Leeds spur to avoid the M62 for northeast-bound traffic.

This would remove a large amount of long-distance traffic from the M62 (all the traffic heading to and from anywhere north of Preston), as well as local Bradford/Shipley traffic. It would free the M62 up for basically Manchester and Liverpool traffic only.

The only difficulty is that it would be a ridiculously complex construction scheme (if the 3 mile Mottram bypass is too complicated to resolve then what hope for this 25 mile corridor?). Well actually parts of it wouldn't be too hard, after all much of the A650 and A629 are dualled anyway. A new urban motorway through the heart of Bradford, along the A650 route, would possibly be feasible.


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 Post subject: Re: Parallel route to M62, for Bradford / Leeds / York ?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 12:48 
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a1adam wrote:
My vote would be for an M65 eastward extension, along the route of the A6068 from Colne to Cross Hills, then along the route of the A629 to Keighley and the A650 through Bradford to meet the M62, with possibly a Leeds spur to avoid the M62 for northeast-bound traffic.

This would remove a large amount of long-distance traffic from the M62 (all the traffic heading to and from anywhere north of Preston), as well as local Bradford/Shipley traffic. It would free the M62 up for basically Manchester and Liverpool traffic only.

The only difficulty is that it would be a ridiculously complex construction scheme (if the 3 mile Mottram bypass is too complicated to resolve then what hope for this 25 mile corridor?). Well actually parts of it wouldn't be too hard, after all much of the A650 and A629 are dualled anyway. A new urban motorway through the heart of Bradford, along the A650 route, would possibly be feasible.


its a route thats been debated many times - probably because on paper it looks the obvious way to go, but as always the devil is in the detail. The bits that need joining up along this route are the M65 at Colne through to the existing D2 A629 at Kildwick & then finding the elusive route from Saltaire/Shipley to the M606 or M621. If the existing roads could be improved & prioritised for flow then this is feasible


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 Post subject: Re: Parallel route to M62, for Bradford / Leeds / York ?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 22:17 
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I'd welcome an M65 extension.

Call me crackers, but my current commute is Harrogate to Warrington. Yes. So I hit the M62 first thing in the morning, but return (mostly) via the M6/A59 route. It's because of Colne that the M65 isn't really a viable route, save for school holidays when it's just about manageable.

The dependency on the M62 being the single route over the Pennines is ridiculous. The Flockton Link would most definitely help though.


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 Post subject: Re: Parallel route to M62, for Bradford / Leeds / York ?
PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2012 17:02 
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stu531 wrote:
I'd welcome an M65 extension.

Call me crackers, but my current commute is Harrogate to Warrington. Yes. So I hit the M62 first thing in the morning, but return (mostly) via the M6/A59 route. It's because of Colne that the M65 isn't really a viable route, save for school holidays when it's just about manageable.

The dependency on the M62 being the single route over the Pennines is ridiculous. The Flockton Link would most definitely help though.


the M65 should really have followed a route along the A56 to join up the A59 west of Skipton, & the A59 Dualled all the way to the A1. In fact, it would be better following the A59 line all the way from the M6


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 Post subject: Re: Parallel route to M62, for Bradford / Leeds / York ?
PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 21:45 
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Indeed. However, not only would this be a controversial route, but you're right in the middle of NIMBY country. It does make sense though.

Alternatively the other route - instead of following the A59, to follow a general route following Airedale, then Wharfedale and the A659 would mean you've got a better route to Leeds Bradford airport and to pick up much of the north Bradford & Leeds area traffic, which is currently poorly catered for.


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 Post subject: Re: Parallel route to M62, for Bradford / Leeds / York ?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 09:05 
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I seem to recall a while back seeing on here a mock up of a route which would effectively have been the A64M from Leeds heading east. An extension of that would be much of the Leeds northern bypass to follow to the west with GSJs along the entire route rather than roundabout after roundabout. This would definately help with traffic flow, especially for through traffic and therefore providing a faster alternative to the M62 for traffic going from Bradford and surrounds to York/A1M north.


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 Post subject: Re: Parallel route to M62, for Bradford / Leeds / York ?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 13:12 
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Rillington wrote:
I seem to recall a while back seeing on here a mock up of a route which would effectively have been the A64M from Leeds heading east.


Around 1990 when the A6120 was still trunk from the A660 to the A63, there was a proposal to grade separate the A660/A61 junction, dual the A6120 east to around Roundhay Park Road, then bypass the A6120 to what is now the NE part of M1 J46.


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 Post subject: Re: Parallel route to M62, for Bradford / Leeds / York ?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 13:54 
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hat wrote:
stu531 wrote:
I'd welcome an M65 extension.

Call me crackers, but my current commute is Harrogate to Warrington. Yes. So I hit the M62 first thing in the morning, but return (mostly) via the M6/A59 route. It's because of Colne that the M65 isn't really a viable route, save for school holidays when it's just about manageable.

The dependency on the M62 being the single route over the Pennines is ridiculous. The Flockton Link would most definitely help though.


the M65 should really have followed a route along the A56 to join up the A59 west of Skipton, & the A59 Dualled all the way to the A1. In fact, it would be better following the A59 line all the way from the M6


You've just described the 1949 Plan for Lancashire's original transpennine route. See M65 History for details: http://www.sabre-roads.org.uk/wiki/inde ... 65_History

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 Post subject: Re: Parallel route to M62, for Bradford / Leeds / York ?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2012 22:50 
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wrinkly wrote:
Rillington wrote:
I seem to recall a while back seeing on here a mock up of a route which would effectively have been the A64M from Leeds heading east.


Around 1990 when the A6120 was still trunk from the A660 to the A63, there was a proposal to grade separate the A660/A61 junction, dual the A6120 east to around Roundhay Park Road, then bypass the A6120 to what is now the NE part of M1 J46.


This should have been done.

From what you described, would there have been a brand new road built from the A58 to J46 - ie to the east of the A6120?


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 Post subject: Re: Parallel route to M62, for Bradford / Leeds / York ?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2012 23:25 
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Yes, it would have diverged from the present A6120 somewhere near Roundhay Park Road, as far as I can recall, and then been on a new alignment to the M1, with 2-level roundabout junctions with the A58 and A64.


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 Post subject: Re: Parallel route to M62, for Bradford / Leeds / York ?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2012 00:09 
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The call for the M65 to be extended towards Leeds and York is great.
It I want to for instance join the M1 or A1 from the Burnley area I either have to go via the M65, A56, M66 and M62 which can add a lot of an additional 30 miles or go the Bradford way along the main roads which can be very busy at times when they are congested.

Therefore, having the route as suggested would make life a lot easier and faster because there are generally a lot of delays on the M62 between Manchester and Leeds

Hal


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 Post subject: Re: Parallel route to M62, for Bradford / Leeds / York ?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2012 01:02 
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From looking At a map, extending the M65 would look logical. I imagine the terrain though would case some engineering difficulties.

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 Post subject: Re: Parallel route to M62, for Bradford / Leeds / York ?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2012 11:15 
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The terrain is easier than much of the M62 to be honest. The villages might object to the large earthworks needed though!

I would suspect an all-purpose route like the Haslingden Bypass would be built instead of motorway given the existing A650.

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