...to be activated next week.

Can anyone who lives in London (or anywhere else with this system) tell us whether the cameras are obvious, like speed cameras, or more covert?

I understood that in London they're actually in the buses themselves, so that a bus driver following an unauthorised vehicle can press a button and nab the offender.

However, I may have got completely the wrong end of the stick.

Is there any form of discretion?

I can understand nabbing those who drive and park in the bus lane, but there are times when you are keeping to your own lane, you have to put a wheel or the car into the empty bus lane, such as when a delivery lorry is parked on the other side of the road, forcing traffic into your lane. To get nabbed for that would be a bit unfair.

I have heard talk of in bus cameras too. IIRC there was a discussion in the press bout using the CCTV in buses in Edinburgh - but that came to nothing. The only footage I have ever seen quite clearly came from fixed CCTV cameras. Indeed I believe that in some parts of London they use what are basically standard CCTV casings - so they are to all intents and purposes "hidden".

The Scottish ones are all at fixed locations that will be published in accordance with the Scottish Governments transparency policy towards camera enforcement. The Scotsman published this image:



but I have not seen one in the flesh yet - so I don't know if it is the real deal or not.

If I'm near "Jewel" I'll keep an eye out for it! (I guess it's not the real deal.)

Often the most annoying place is at the end of the bus lane where Lane 2 might be queuing but the only way to get into clear non-bus lane part of Lane 1 to turn left is briefly use the last few yards of the bus lane which of course can result in a penalty.

In most (all?) areas taxis are allowed to use bus lanes and I can never understand how this is justified.

The one and only time I've been stopped and cautioned by the police was for changing lanes into a bus lane a few metres before it ended. No fine, thankfully.

In Oxford they look like this: -

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=oxford& ... 2,,0,-8.84

Quite why they need them thirty foot high in a sensitive street scene is beyond me, but I suppose the sort of person responsible for these schemes probably doesn't really understand aesthetics.

Big brother is watching you

Taxis are public transport too.

Was just reading an article

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-17722416

Apparantly in London village, public hire taxis can use bus lanes, but private hire "minicabs" can't.

As I understand it the position in the legislation is that "taxi" means hackney type only. Private hires is a distinct class that needs their own specific exemption if the LA sees fit - with the policy on that varying over the country.

When the bus gates and lanes were brought in in Glasgow they were originally hackney only. This caused a bit of a fuss as private hire usage is quite high in the Glasgow area - the council's concern was that it would make enforcement hard as PH vehicles only had tiny plastic plates and so were hard to idnetify from a distance. After a campaign they were permitted but to aid identification they had to agree to carry magnetic plates on the door that advertised the operator/hire association they were affiliated with. I had a rather talkative friend who had recently taken up a PH license so I remember getting a blow by blow account of the whole process! I also seem to recall there was questions about the exemption applying to local PH operators - or if they could also apply to out of area drivers - I never did hear what the outcome of that question was.

The appropriateness of allowing taxis is an interesting question. On one hand they are public transport, on the other the lack the advantage that a bus has in terms of carrying a large number of people so the "many benefit" argument of speeding up buses at the expense of other road users does not really apply. The cynic in me thinks that the fact that taxis have to pay substantial amounts to the council in terms of license fees might have a role to play in the decision making process.

On the other - presumably the idea is that many taxi users will use them only occasionally when a bus does not meet their needs, so by making taxi travel more attractive in journey time terms it indirectly supports (mass) public transport usage.

I'm not too hot on legislation, but isn't there something about 'Hackney Black Cabs' being allowed to be hailed from the street whereas Private Hire Cars need to be accessed by booking them or getting them from a taxi rank ??

As most bus lanes are adjacent to the pavement, I would have thought there would be considerable safety issues to expecting people to cross a live traffic lane to get into a Hackney cab.

IIRC you can't even get on a PHC from a taxi rank; they have to be booked.

Certainly in Belfast, Private hire taxis have to be prebooked.
Which can be a pain at closing time when every firm is booked up!
There are though "solo" operators who may pickup from the kerb.
It is only within the last 10 years or so that private hire taxis here have had taxi licence plates.

Meanwhile in London, the oft mentioned Addison Lee prove their worthiness as a decent business yet again:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-17722416

That one is in Aberdeen and it is the real deal. They were installed circa 2003 so are a few years old now. Current cameras may be different. What you can't see in the photo is that they have the same reflective coating on the back as Gatsos do.

It used to be the responsibility of the police to monitor the images and prosecute however they didn't actually bother (maybe the £30 fine was too low... better off with speed cameras!). I believe that there is now new legislation which allows councils to run them. Aberdeen's cameras are being switched back on shortly as a result.

This is correct as I understand it only licensed taxis (aka hackney cabs) can be engaged at the roadside. Private Hire cars (technically not taxis at all as I understand it) can only be by advanced booking (if even by calling up to book on the spot).

I found a site that claimed to have photos of the Glasgow ones. The first two looked like standard CCTV units, but given their third "camera" was actually a microwave traffic light sensor - I suspect that they don't actually know what they are!

Glasgow City Council certainly doesn't know what the latter are!

I saw a bus with an advert on the back about these new cameras, and just above the ad was a hemispherical blister which looked like a CCTV camera housing. I hads thought that was the bus lane enforcement camera, but it appears I was wrong.