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 Post subject: Possible change to toll on Portugal's A22?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 06, 2010 12:26 
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I noticed the following story in the Portugal News while I was in the Algarve recently. www.theportugalnews.com/cgi-bin/article.pl?id=1066-2

I know the traffic levels are not what we would expect in the UK on the Algarve, but having driven on the A22 and the EN125 I would hate to see most of the traffic switching to the EN125 unless it was upgraded.


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 Post subject: Re: Possible change to toll on Portugal's A22?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 08, 2010 21:54 
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When I was there I was led to believe it was (unusually for Portugal) a free motorway for the sole reason that they wanted to get as much traffic off the N125 as possible, because it had been such a busy and accident-prone road for so long.

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 Post subject: Re: Possible change to toll on Portugal's A22?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 09, 2010 06:20 
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ok. Long story coming:
the socialist party in powerwithout majority, due to lack of money, was going to put tolls in the 3 free motorways around Oporto (A41/A42, A28, A29). As it is pretty much impossible to put traditional toll plazas on those roads they decided that all the cars in the country would need to have an electronic tag for toll charging (to the delight of the tollway companies on the rest of the country that this way could get rid of an expense called tollman.
Everybody was against the obligation of use of device, so the obligation got suspended by the parliament. Meanwhile, the biggest opposition party leader, the social democrats, who dreams in turning Portugal in a liberal country (a very dim wannabe version of Baroness Thatcher) said that, if alternate methods of payment were found it would support the government but only if it introduced tolls on all non tolled motorways...
(i remind you that this was a demand of the biggest opposition party, who clearly wants to loose the next elections)
So, we end up with a proposal that will toll not only the referred motorways but 4 more, at least 2 of them absolutely essential for the country:
A22 in the Algarve, which as said previously, was built as an alternativa to the EN125, a very busy and accident prone road, wich soon will again be requalified, gaining a grand total of 84 roundabouts in around 150 km. Drivers not wanting to pay tolls, will have the privilege of traversing towns like the region capital, Faro and it's near by Tavira!
A25 linking Aveiro to the border, built over the old IP5 (an A9 upgraded to motorway for safety reasons which is our link out of this hole and it is used by lots of lorrys, which will revert to the old winding road if tolled).
Then we have the A23, which connects the A1, 100 km north of Lisbon to the A25, near the border(it goes east and them north along the border).
Lastly we have the motorway linking the A25 near Viseu, north to Vila Real, crossing the douro in Regua. This link was needed but not necessarily as a dual carriageway in an empty region! Tolls there won't even pay the maintenance of the revenue collecting equipment!
Going a bit back, the big problem regarding the A28 and the A29 is that both run parallel to tolled motorways (A3 and A1 respectively) and naturally the owner doesn't like it...

Ignore the IP#, IC# and E# road names as they overlap with the A (motorway) designation and note that the 3 roads being tolled have a near by cousin tolled... (this ones are going forward on the 1st of august, the rest of them probably only next year)
http://maps.google.pt/maps?hl=pt-PT&ie= ... 25604&z=10

This is the result of PPP when money runs out!


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 Post subject: Re: Possible change to toll on Portugal's A22?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 01:06 
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It'll be a disaster if the N125 is used heavily again - I believe it was the worst road in the EU for quite some time?


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 Post subject: Re: Possible change to toll on Portugal's A22?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 22:42 
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I'm already imagining Trucks thru the city of Faro (it hasn't got a bypass having instead a large avenue almost at the city limits wich does the trick with trafic lights and roundabouts as most traffic goes thru the a22)


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 Post subject: Re: Possible change to toll on Portugal's A22?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 31, 2010 17:08 
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As a regular visitor to Portugal I have to say the N125 isn't great - it's twisty, passes through several places and has quite a lot of roundabouts. Sadly, for the most part it's not even a particularly interesting road. Also, there's a bridge on it over some marshes in a river near Portimao, and the smell from the marshes is awful. The A22 is further north and away from the stench!

I did once see a map which suggested a dual carriageway link from the A22's present western terminus towards the north but I don't know much else about this plan, or whether it was over optimistic.

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 Post subject: Re: Possible change to toll on Portugal's A22?
PostPosted: Tue Aug 03, 2010 02:07 
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lots of roundabouts? Rotfl...
The works on the en125 requalification (fancy name for downgrade), plan 84 roundabouts! (not bad for 150 km).


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 Post subject: Re: Possible change to toll on Portugal's A22?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2011 22:51 
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I see the charging will start on the A22 on 15th April, although all of the details, most importantly the pricing is yet to be worked out.


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 Post subject: Re: Possible change to toll on Portugal's A22?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 15:34 
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I've had a look at this because I'm going to be going away to the Algarve at the end of April.

It all seems to be a complete mess to be honest. The options for a foreign registered vehicle (like my Gib registered car)

You can pre-pay on the ctt website (but its all in portuguese and i'm going on holiay - how do I know how much i'm going to use?)

You can post pay by going to a post office within five days (great!)

You can rent a tag from a motorway services and pre-load the tag - again how you know how much you are going to use (its all non-refundable). Also how do you get to the services to get the tag without breaking the law. And coming back i will be on the wrong carriageway so how do I take the tag back.

Just badly thought out. Looks like I will be on the EN-125


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 Post subject: Re: Possible change to toll on Portugal's A22?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 20:57 
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chaps... It's an utter mess for foreigners! The identifiers though valid for ALL motorways are a rip off (by what i know you can rent them for 25e plus 50e of minimum balance but when you return them they will only return the 25e of the rent. The remaining balance is not returned and even the balance itself is only valid for 3 months...). I advise you to check the expats portugal forum as they will probably be more helpfull (my identifier rips me of by direct debit!)


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 Post subject: Re: Possible change to toll on Portugal's A22?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2011 05:46 
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i just tried to find official information about the new toll roads and payments etc... i didn't find anything official... absurd!

edit: ahhhhhhhh..... after some more digging (with a JCB...) here are the enlightenned words of our road department:

http://www.estradas.pt/portagensestrangeiros

(the words KEEP OUT spring to my mind...)


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 Post subject: Re: Possible change to toll on Portugal's A22?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2011 05:52 
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Also, for further enlightenments plz do send an email to:

duvidas.novasportagens@estradas.pt

(certainly they'll find someone who speaks macarronic english to answer you...)


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 Post subject: Re: Possible change to toll on Portugal's A22?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2011 22:14 
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I just hope our car hire company will have worked out what is best to do by the time I visit again in June. We have used the A22 not only to get to/from the airport but on many trips to Portimao, AlgarveShopping etc from Silves. Using the EN125 would be a nightmare we would rather not contemplate.


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 Post subject: Re: Possible change to toll on Portugal's A22?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 26, 2011 00:02 
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i doubt... the government just went down...


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 Post subject: Re: Possible change to toll on Portugal's A22?
PostPosted: Thu May 05, 2011 14:28 
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Now unlikely to start before elections on June 5th.

http://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/ShowTopic- ... garve.html


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 Post subject: Re: Possible change to toll on Portugal's A22?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 03:24 
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Tolls will probably start to be charged in September!


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 Post subject: Re: Possible change to toll on Portugal's A22?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2012 11:04 
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Time for an update. I'd love to know how a tourist returning a hire car at Faro Airport, and flying out a few hours later, is supposed to pay the toll!

http://www.theportugalnews.com/

The Portugal News wrote:
Toll and trouble; 14/1/2012

Little over a month has passed since the introduction of tolls on the four previously free motorways, including the A22 in the Algarve. But time appears to have done little to solve a series of doubts and problems that have arisen since 8 December. Some certainties have however come to the fore; the EN125 has become a traffic congestion nightmare, even in low-season, more accidents have been reported, commuters are spending more time behind the wheel and companies have been forced to lay-off workers. The A22, on the other hand, has seen traffic drop by at least 60 percent according to early and generous estimates, with the government so far collecting very little from tolls.

-------

Commuters in the Algarve were dealt a serious blow this week when the Loulé Fiscal and Administrative court ruled against an injunction filed against the charging of tolls on the Algarve’s A22. The complaint was lodged in early December by the Commission of A22 Road Users, stating that tolls on the motorway were unconstitutional as they had not been approved by a parliamentary majority. The Commission further argued the A22 had been incorrectly classified as a motorway, as a large stretch of the road was built with EU funds. But the court was not convinced, and set a precedent by ruling tolls on the A22 were perfectly within the law. “This decision is important, as had the court ruled in favour of the injunction, the agreement between A22 concessionary Euroscut and the Government would have been rocked to its very foundations”, explained the PLMJ law firm which represents Euroscut. The Commission has meanwhile said it will continue to find new ways of contesting tolls, explaining it will not surrender its cause until the A22 is declared a free motorway once more.

But with tolls set to become a fixture for the foreseeable future in the Algarve, a series of growing pains have emerged which seem far from having an easy solution. Since last year, The Portugal News has been inundated with requests from readers abroad seeking clarification on how to pay for tolls when hiring a car during an intended visit to the Algarve. A problem which emanates from the fact that none of the car rental firms have fitted their vehicles with electronic transponders. The official line is that foreign tourists using the A22 in a hired car can pay for their trips at a CTT Post Office after 48 hours of using the motorway, but within five working days. However, a tourist who spends four days in the Algarve, arriving Friday and leaving the next Monday morning, is impeded from paying his dues.

Motorway operators Brisa and Euroscut, both explained to The Portugal News this week that what happens when five working days have elapsed and payment is yet is to be received, a payment request for the overdue tolls, along with an administration fee, is sent on to the registered owner of the vehicle, in this case, the car hire company. The particular car hire firm then supplies the motorway operator with an electronic copy of the rental contract, and the address of the person who hired the vehicle. A notification is then sent to tourist’s address abroad. It is unclear what time limit is given to pay for these tolls, and what payment methods are used. Both the Euroscut and Brisa help lines said their inability to explain these intricacies was a result of the procedure still being new. The owner of a large Algarve-based car hire firm, who preferred to remain anonymous, told The Portugal News that his belief was that motorway operators were actually writing off the usage of the A22 by foreign tourists travelling in a rent-a-car as a bad debt. Furthermore, he said it was virtually impossible to force these clients to pay once they had left the country, as they could later allege they had changed address or never received a letter requesting payment or the details contained on the rental contract were incorrect. Euroscut, who insisted foreign residents were being chased for unpaid tolls, said the letters requesting payment being sent abroad are being sent out solely in English, “as it is a universally spoken language.” But a tourist from any other nationality, and whose English or Portuguese is not up to scratch, might experience difficulty in understanding the contents of a letter sent to their respective addresses.

Local residents, however, are receiving completely different treatment. Long overdue tolls are reportedly being eventually handed over to the taxman, who has been given the authority to even seize the vehicle of a transgressing Portuguese-registered vehicle. The Portugal News was this week handed a copy of an invoice sent out by Ascendi, which operates a number of motorways, including the previous toll-free A23 and A24 routes. A statement sent to a motorist who had not paid a toll fee of €3.50, climbed to over €30 due to a €26.67 administrative cost, followed by an €87.50 fine should the toll be paid within 15 days of the notification. Refusal to comply with this order, said the invoice, would result in the total cost of the €3.50 toll soaring to €205.17.

Another cost of tolls on the A22 can be seen along the motorway’s now deserted fuel stations. Even thieves are staying away. These once hotspots for hold-ups, have not reported a single incident since the introduction of tolls. Last Thursday at around 11am, staff at the Lagos fuel station told The Portugal News it had been their first customers, while the fuel stations at Loulé have reportedly sent three-quarters of their staff to join dole queues at job centres due to the chronic lack of business.

Ordinary people have also been forced to face enormous difficulties in commuting to and from work, an unheard of problem for the Algarve until now. Every weekday long-term resident Irene Vitorino, who lives in Portimão and works in Albufeira, travels an 80 kilometre roundtrip on the EN125, which was commonly referred to as Europe’s deadliest road prior to the completion of the A22. Reluctant to use the A22 motorway “because of the cost”, it means not only does she now spend more time on the road, but also sees less of her family. Leaving home earlier and arriving home later makes it a longer day for all. “I always did go on the motorway and it would take me about 35 minutes to get to work. Now it takes anything between 50 minutes and an hour”, she said. “The traffic coming home in the evening is much worse than in the morning, especially coming through Lagoa”, she explains, adding: “Every single day I see an accident on the EN125.” Leaving home on average 20 minutes earlier and arriving home at least half an hour later than she used to means Mrs. Vitorino is also later picking her daughter up after school. “It makes it a long day for her as well.” Mrs. Vitorino says she would still consider using the motorway if the tolls were cheaper. “I already pay a lot of money for petrol and it would be a lot more on top of that. About an extra €100 a month”, she concludes.

A number of companies located in the central Algarve contacted by The Portugal News confirmed similar scenes of congestion in areas between Almancil and Vilamoura, explaining that collisions on the EN125 are becoming an increasingly common sight. But extreme congestion on the EN125 has been avoided as local residents who have paid €27.50 for a transponder are entitled to ten free trips on the A22 each month, followed by a 15 percent discount for the remainder of the calendar month, affording them the occasional luxury of travelling on the Algarve’s only motorway. This though, will change in a few months, as the cash-strapped government has confirmed these ten free trips and discounts will be done away with at the start of the summer holiday season on 30 June.


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 Post subject: Re: Possible change to toll on Portugal's A22?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2012 13:41 
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Thanks Mistral. We are just in the process of booking our holiday for this year and were definately looking at the Algarve again.....maybe not now.


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 Post subject: Re: Possible change to toll on Portugal's A22?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 19:29 
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More interesting is this article from 7th Jan:

Quote:
According to daily newspaper Correio da Manhã, every time a toll gate is targeted it costs an average of €2,000 to fix.

Recently, in less than one month, four such incidents have taken place, damaging from fibre optic cables to the equipment itself, the infrastructures and the IT system.

Altogether, the newspaper estimates, more than €20,000 has been spent on repairing vandalised toll gates on the A22.

On top of this more money has had to be spent on installing fire detection systems after the bunkers that house the systems were set alight, more than once.

Since it was announced that tolls were to be installed on the A22 last month (December), five acts of sabotage have been carried out in protest.

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 Post subject: Re: Possible change to toll on Portugal's A22?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 22:47 
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If that carries on they wont carry on trying to collect the tolls will they? I doubt they have made enough to cover the original equipment costs yet never mind the replacements?


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