Can anyone identify this sign?
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- Danno B10M
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Can anyone identify this sign?
I snapped this old 'Children' sign today in Oakamoor, not far from me.
When does it date from, or what era? Is it pre-Worboys?
I've not seen one like it before. I should've taken my secateurs.
When does it date from, or what era? Is it pre-Worboys?
I've not seen one like it before. I should've taken my secateurs.
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Re: Can anyone identify this sign?
1954 (possibly 1940) standard I think (which is pre Warboys).rsorionboy wrote:I snapped this old 'Children' sign today in Oakamoor, not far from me.
When does it date from, or what era? Is it pre-Worboys?
I've not seen one like it before. I should've taken my secateurs.
The original 1931 standard (as defined in the Maybury Report - the pre-Worboys Worboys Report) had a flaming torch for the symbol with the school sign.
- Paul Townsend
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Re: Can anyone identify this sign?
Actually no. The latter sign specifically indicated a school. This sign refers to a park, playground or other area where there may be children about.ndp wrote:The original 1931 standard (as defined in the Maybury Report - the pre-Worboys Worboys Report) had a flaming torch for the symbol with the school sign.
The sign seems to have lost its head - it would have been adorned with a red triangle back in the good old days. Has it just fallen away through rust?
- Danno B10M
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Not that I'd ever advocate criminal damage or theft, but hypothetically speaking the best place to preserve that sign would be somewhere other than it's current location, as it's obviously not looked after, and if you reported it as such it'd only be replaced with a standard one anyway! (o;rsorionboy wrote:Thanks for the info gents.
I presume the hedge cutter took the triangle off, although that would've been some time ago. I can't remember ever seeing it.
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- J N Winkler
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Re: Can anyone identify this sign?
"Maybury Report"? Sir Henry retired in 1928 and, as far as I know, had no involvement in developing the new signs later prescribed under the Road Traffic Act, although he did chair a conference in 1929 which dealt with road traffic noise and priority control. According to the D.F.T.'s history of traffic signs (available as an unpriced publication), the first departmental committee on traffic signs was organized in December 1931, the 1922 signs (some of which had been inherited from the L.G.B. circular of 1904) were prescribed in 1932 as an interim measure, and the committee reported in 1933.ndp wrote:The original 1931 standard (as defined in the Maybury Report - the pre-Worboys Worboys Report) had a flaming torch for the symbol with the school sign.
- J N Winkler
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Re: Can anyone identify this sign?
The 1944 departmental committee report on traffic signs (which I shall dub the "Cook Report" since the committee chairman was Sir Frederick Cook, who had recently retired as Chief Engineer) recommended the use of the torch symbol with both "SCHOOL" and "CHILDREN."Paul Townsend wrote:Actually no. The latter sign specifically indicated a school. This sign refers to a park, playground or other area where there may be children about.ndp wrote:The original 1931 standard (as defined in the Maybury Report - the pre-Worboys Worboys Report) had a flaming torch for the symbol with the school sign.
Re: Can anyone identify this sign?
1931 might be poor recallection, but there is a document dated from around that time entitled "Maybury Report - Traffic Signs" in the University of Warwick library. It contains designs for the then-new warning, regulatory and directional signs, and details for signals and the "Llewlyn Smith" typeface, and details on road markings as well.J N Winkler wrote:"Maybury Report"?ndp wrote:The original 1931 standard (as defined in the Maybury Report - the pre-Worboys Worboys Report) had a flaming torch for the symbol with the school sign.
Incidentally, the "children" plate wasn't mentioned, but then that doesn't mean it wasn't added before the reports finding's were implemented (in the same way barred circles dissappeared between the Worboys report and the 1964 (?) TSRGD.
- J N Winkler
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Re: Can anyone identify this sign?
Found this reference on B.O.P.C.R.I.S. which confirms that Maybury did indeed chair the departmental traffic signs committee which reported in 1933.I wrote:"Maybury Report"? Sir Henry retired in 1928 and, as far as I know, had no involvement in developing the new signs later prescribed under the Road Traffic Act, although he did chair a conference in 1929 which dealt with road traffic noise and priority control.
- J N Winkler
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Re: Can anyone identify this sign?
Thanks for setting me straight. As a matter of fact I have also seen the 1933 report, but not in any recent year, and I last examined it before I fully appreciated the significance of Maybury having been its chairman. It hardly helps that the copy which is nearest me is in the Bodleian library, so I can't simply duplicate it with a digital camera and load it onto an external U.S.B. hard disk for easy reference. When I finally finish my dissertation and have more leisure, one of my first projects is to go to the National Archives and look up the 1933 Committee documentation.ndp wrote:1931 might be poor recollection, but there is a document dated from around that time entitled "Maybury Report - Traffic Signs" in the University of Warwick library. It contains designs for the then-new warning, regulatory and directional signs, and details for signals and the "Llewellyn-Smith" typeface, and details on road markings as well.
It is also possible, and in fact very likely, that the "CHILDREN" plate was added by Ministerial authorization between 1933 and issuance of the next set of Regulations, in 1950. According to the D.F.T. history, the 1950 Regulations were issued in a hurry because a judge had chastised the Ministry for failing to keep traffic sign legislation in a single, consolidated document--in the seventeen years intervening, sign authorizations had been issued on little pieces of paper which practitioners had to collect in order to have complete knowledge of which signs were legal and which were not.Incidentally, the "children" plate wasn't mentioned, but then that doesn't mean it wasn't added before the report's findings were implemented (in the same way barred circles disappeared between the Worboys report and the 1964 (?) TSRGD.
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- Danno B10M
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Thanks!dave_stokie wrote:Whereabouts exactly is that sign? I'm fairly close to Oakamoor myself and I often go walking around there but I've never spotted that before!
Well spotted Dan!
It's as you come in to Oakmoor down Farley Lane, about 150 yards from the main road.
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- M1J46_A63_A6120
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Go on, go preserve it, you know you want to. I just wonder though, could the red triangle be somewhere in the bushes?c2R wrote:Not that I'd ever advocate criminal damage or theft, but hypothetically speaking the best place to preserve that sign would be somewhere other than it's current location, as it's obviously not looked after, and if you reported it as such it'd only be replaced with a standard one anyway! (o;rsorionboy wrote:Thanks for the info gents.
I presume the hedge cutter took the triangle off, although that would've been some time ago. I can't remember ever seeing it.
- Danno B10M
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