Can someone explain this sign?

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geofftswin
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Can someone explain this sign?

Post by geofftswin » Sun Oct 17, 2021 23:23

Heading east along the A31, when you approach Tongham and turn off to take the A331, the signpost for the roundabout lists both the destinations for the A331 and also has London and Guildford given as A31 destinations. I would not have thought that anybody taking that exit would want to turn right at the roundabout to rejoin the road they'd just left?
https://maps.app.goo.gl/8deDwuyTEJjNgfyh7

tom1977
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Re: Can someone explain this sign?

Post by tom1977 » Mon Oct 18, 2021 09:50

At first glance it looks a bit pointless, advising drivers who have just left the A31 to rejoin, but I suspect the sign pre-dates the current junction layout and is from the time when all A31 traffic passed through the roundabout. After the bypass was constructed no traffic will make that maneuvre but the sign was never updated.

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Brenley Corner
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Re: Can someone explain this sign?

Post by Brenley Corner » Mon Oct 18, 2021 10:40

tom1977 wrote:
Mon Oct 18, 2021 09:50
At first glance it looks a bit pointless, advising drivers who have just left the A31 to rejoin, but I suspect the sign pre-dates the current junction layout and is from the time when all A31 traffic passed through the roundabout. After the bypass was constructed no traffic will make that maneuvre but the sign was never updated.
On first thoughts that would seem to be a good answer but the whole stretch of A31 from the end of the Hogs Back section near the Hogs Back Hotel to where the (old) Guildford Road re-joins the A31 near the Shepherd and Flock roundabout was new build and laid out as you see it today including the junction with the A331 - this makes the sign remain a mystery

The road that predated this dual carriageway is the Hogs Back / Guildford Road minor road which was the A31 until the late 80s/90s when the new dual carriageway was built: https://goo.gl/maps/TCFx3CQrQviJCNvF6. The difference in standards between the Hogs Back dual carriageway which is much older and has a 60mph limit and the new carriageway is noticeable and the transition between the two very obvious which is around this point: https://goo.gl/maps/SfxMMrFnoXJJog8A6.
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Bryn666
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Re: Can someone explain this sign?

Post by Bryn666 » Mon Oct 18, 2021 11:05

It's a simple error. People make the mistake of looking for logic in a sign when nearly all of them end up wrong somehow.

All the sign needed for the right turn arm was a stub arm and no destinations as it is irrelevant to a driver leaving the A31 beyond having to give way to traffic turning out from it.
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Micro The Maniac
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Re: Can someone explain this sign?

Post by Micro The Maniac » Mon Oct 18, 2021 11:17

There are a number of central cross-overs prior to that junction that have been closed, so traffic that wanted to head east (to Guildford) has to head west and throwing a u-turn at the roundabout.

Likewise, at the eastern end, approaching the A3 junction, a U-turn to A31 Farnham is also signed.
https://goo.gl/maps/EewrzGrbRsG8HDsu6

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Brenley Corner
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Re: Can someone explain this sign?

Post by Brenley Corner » Mon Oct 18, 2021 12:48

Micro The Maniac wrote:
Mon Oct 18, 2021 11:17
There are a number of central cross-overs prior to that junction that have been closed, so traffic that wanted to head east (to Guildford) has to head west and throwing a u-turn at the roundabout.
Indeed....except that is the sign on the exit slip from the London/Guildford bound carriageway!

I thinks Bryns reply, as always, is the most plausible.
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multiraider2
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Re: Can someone explain this sign?

Post by multiraider2 » Mon Oct 18, 2021 12:49

Micro The Maniac wrote:
Mon Oct 18, 2021 11:17
There are a number of central cross-overs prior to that junction that have been closed, so traffic that wanted to head east (to Guildford) has to head west and throwing a u-turn at the roundabout.

Likewise, at the eastern end, approaching the A3 junction, a U-turn to A31 Farnham is also signed.
https://goo.gl/maps/EewrzGrbRsG8HDsu6
Gap closures or generally joining a dual carriageway, yes often require wrong way driving then an effective U--turn at the junction, but this is not that though. This is leaving the London/Guildford bound carriageway only to have it marked again as a destination even before you leave the off-ramp.

By the way have the bridge works been finished? This was the bottom of that off ramp in August with the main carriageway closed and it was horrendous there.

Edit. Beat me to it!
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ellandback
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Re: Can someone explain this sign?

Post by ellandback » Mon Oct 18, 2021 13:12

I've never really understood why traffic on this slip road, leaving the Leeds-bound M62, needs to know which lane to get into for the Leeds-bound M62.

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the cheesecake man
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Re: Can someone explain this sign?

Post by the cheesecake man » Mon Oct 18, 2021 13:24

There were some more examples in this thread.

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multiraider2
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Re: Can someone explain this sign?

Post by multiraider2 » Mon Oct 18, 2021 13:27

Actually, that's a good point. It's not just the sign. It's also the road markings. That streetview shot was April 2021. The sign and the road markings would have actually made perfect sense during the closure of the main carriageway this year, except they closed that second lane as part of the works.
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Micro The Maniac
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Re: Can someone explain this sign?

Post by Micro The Maniac » Mon Oct 18, 2021 13:39

multiraider2 wrote:
Mon Oct 18, 2021 12:49
This is leaving the London/Guildford bound carriageway only to have it marked again as a destination even before you leave the off-ramp.
Good point... and thus the sign is completely wrong, as the A331 is left (9 o'clock) and the A31 on-slip is straight on.
By the way have the bridge works been finished?
No... but we now have added works, as they're adding a free flow A331(S)-A31(E) - plus traffic lights to the roundabout :(

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Vierwielen
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Re: Can someone explain this sign?

Post by Vierwielen » Mon Oct 18, 2021 15:06

geofftswin wrote:
Sun Oct 17, 2021 23:23
Heading east along the A31, when you approach Tongham and turn off to take the A331, the signpost for the roundabout lists both the destinations for the A331 and also has London and Guildford given as A31 destinations. I would not have thought that anybody taking that exit would want to turn right at the roundabout to rejoin the road they'd just left?
https://maps.app.goo.gl/8deDwuyTEJjNgfyh7
Basically, if you leave the road at that junction, you will almost invariably leave the roundabout at the first exit. Signposting the exit as "Guildford, London" will tell the motorist very quickly that he does not want to use that exit.

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Glen
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Re: Can someone explain this sign?

Post by Glen » Mon Oct 18, 2021 21:52

It's not the first time it's been done and it certainly won't be the last.

I'm sure some designers must decide what destinations are needed on each exit, then just swap them around for the signs on each approach with stopping to think what is actually needed in each direction.

A couple more:
https://maps.app.goo.gl/LHvB5NXjyfr1ekoS9
https://maps.app.goo.gl/Rakxi1ZT638yUXk56 That one is particularly bad as the sign is so much larger than it needs to be to fit in an unnecessary direction.

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Glen
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Re: Can someone explain this sign?

Post by Glen » Mon Oct 18, 2021 21:54

Vierwielen wrote:
Mon Oct 18, 2021 15:06
Signposting the exit as "Guildford, London" will tell the motorist very quickly that he does not want to use that exit.
Leaving a stub with no destination would have the same effect.

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Vierwielen
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Re: Can someone explain this sign?

Post by Vierwielen » Tue Oct 19, 2021 21:36

If you leave a dual carriageway in error and come to a roundabout, you might initially expect there to have a choice of three exits and you would take the second exit to get back onto your road. In this case there are only two exits and this signpost gives you ample opportunity to get into the correct lane - See for example this sign as you join the A31 from the A3 going westwards (about 8 miles from the sign under discussion).

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Skermington
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Re: Can someone explain this sign?

Post by Skermington » Thu Oct 21, 2021 08:27

Vierwielen wrote:
Tue Oct 19, 2021 21:36
If you leave a dual carriageway in error and come to a roundabout, you might initially expect there to have a choice of three exits and you would take the second exit to get back onto your road. In this case there are only two exits and this signpost gives you ample opportunity to get into the correct lane - See for example this sign as you join the A31 from the A3 going westwards (about 8 miles from the sign under discussion).
:bow:

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A303Chris
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Re: Can someone explain this sign?

Post by A303Chris » Thu Oct 21, 2021 15:15

I think it is the result of the sign coming off Westbound which also does the same, but this off slip is joined by an on slip from the Tongham Road half way down, so traffic may be going both ways.

It seems the sign designer just did the same for the other direction.

However, it may be also to warn drivers that there is a heavy flow from the right, if it was just a stub , some drivers may not appreciated that a large volume of traffic is already entering the roundabout , however by signing it, it does indicate another entrance point.
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katie_lou_lou
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Re: Can someone explain this sign?

Post by katie_lou_lou » Sun Oct 24, 2021 21:38

The one I haven't yet fathomed out, is the reason for these two on the A1...

https://www.google.com/maps/@52.1290142 ... 384!8i8192
https://www.google.com/maps/@52.1416976 ... 384!8i8192

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Bryn666
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Re: Can someone explain this sign?

Post by Bryn666 » Sun Oct 24, 2021 21:41

katie_lou_lou wrote:
Sun Oct 24, 2021 21:38
The one I haven't yet fathomed out, is the reason for these two on the A1...

https://www.google.com/maps/@52.1290142 ... 384!8i8192
https://www.google.com/maps/@52.1416976 ... 384!8i8192
Other than being a U-turn presumably because of gap closures I haven't a sausage. It amuses me everytime I pass it.
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SteelCamel
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Re: Can someone explain this sign?

Post by SteelCamel » Sun Oct 24, 2021 21:53

katie_lou_lou wrote:
Sun Oct 24, 2021 21:38
The one I haven't yet fathomed out, is the reason for these two on the A1...

https://www.google.com/maps/@52.1290142 ... 384!8i8192
https://www.google.com/maps/@52.1416976 ... 384!8i8192
The second one makes sense. There are a number of properties that have accesses directly onto the southbound A1 - such as the caravan dealer just north of there. If you want to take your new caravan north, you need join the southbound A1, then leave at that junction and join the northbound carriageway.

The sign at the northbound exit makes sense for the same reason. The advance sign less so, as it's immediately after the previous junction - anyone wanting to turn round would have joined after that sign. But I suppose the rules require an advance sign, so there it is.

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