A77: Ayr to Stranraer

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What should become of the A77 between Ayr & Stranraer?

Motorway
21
14%
Grade-Seperated D2
47
32%
At-Grade D2
23
16%
WS2/S3/S4/S2+1 etc.
24
16%
Keep it as it is (ie. S2)
10
7%
Mixture of the above
20
14%
Other (please state)
1
1%
 
Total votes: 146

Altnabreac
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Re: A77: Ayr to Stranraer

Post by Altnabreac »

Euan wrote: Tue Nov 24, 2020 07:10
DaStreetsweep wrote: Tue Nov 24, 2020 01:37 Thought this thread deserved a bump.

Will Maybole bypass likely be finished by the summer of 2021.

Is Girvan the next most logical bypass?

Sadly no sign of any dualling sections in the near future.

Progress is slow on this road, regardless of Covid.
In February the expectation seemed to be that the bypass would be completed by next summer, but taking COVID-19 into account it may well be more realistic to look towards a time nearer the end of next year and especially so if as you say progress has genuinely been slow.

Girvan is logically the next place along the A77 which would merit a bypass going by the simple fact that it is by some way the largest town along the road that is not already bypassed. As I understand it the A77 through Maybole is very narrow and is not suitable for trunk road traffic while in Girvan there is some splitting of the traffic within the partial one way system in the town centre, so it is not all confined to one road as in the town centre of Maybole.
I’d say dualling of the Ayr Bypass is the top priority for investment on the A77.

As you say Girvan has a much better road layout than Maybole. I’d suggest Kirkoswald and Minishant might be higher initial priorities for bypasses than Girvan.
snookes
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Re: A77: Ayr to Stranraer

Post by snookes »

Hi,

My worry once the maybole bypass is complete is it’ll have a knock on effect elsewhere. In my eyes probably the northbound approach to the Bankfield Roundabout which can already be queued back to the A719 junction at peak times.

So therefore if I was planning a dual upgrade I’d do it all the way from whitletts to the north roundabout of the new Maybole bypass.

I do think this is the next part that will receive government funding.
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KeithW
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Re: A77: Ayr to Stranraer

Post by KeithW »

snookes wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 22:21 Hi,

My worry once the maybole bypass is complete is it’ll have a knock on effect elsewhere. In my eyes probably the northbound approach to the Bankfield Roundabout which can already be queued back to the A719 junction at peak times.

So therefore if I was planning a dual upgrade I’d do it all the way from whitletts to the north roundabout of the new Maybole bypass.

I do think this is the next part that will receive government funding.
There is not that much traffic south of Alloway but I'd certainly support dualling from there to Whittlets especially if they fixed some of the dodgy flat junctions.
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Altnabreac
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Re: A77: Ayr to Stranraer

Post by Altnabreac »

Yes I think dualling wouldn’t go beyond the Doomholm Road. Probably 2+1 south of there would make more sense.

The important thing would be improving all those flat junctions and bypassing Minishant.
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ChrisH
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Re: A77: Ayr to Stranraer

Post by ChrisH »

The mentions of 2+1 lane sections and the platooning coming off the ferries makes me think that maybe the priority is having two lanes going away from the ferry: eastbound on A75 and northbound on A77. For the same reason that Tube stations typically have 2 escalators coming up and only 1 going down: the flows are the same but the bunching of people using them means you need the extra surge capacity.
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Stevie D
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Re: A77: Ayr to Stranraer

Post by Stevie D »

ChrisH wrote: Mon Feb 15, 2021 12:24 The mentions of 2+1 lane sections and the platooning coming off the ferries makes me think that maybe the priority is having two lanes going away from the ferry: eastbound on A75 and northbound on A77. For the same reason that Tube stations typically have 2 escalators coming up and only 1 going down: the flows are the same but the bunching of people using them means you need the extra surge capacity.
I would imagine that there would be sections with overtaking lanes in each direction. It's nearly 100 miles from Stranraer to Gretna, and 50 miles from Stranraer to Prestwick. If the overtaking lanes were only heading away from the port then that would be unhelpful (especially if the S2+1 sections have double white lines to prohibit overtaking in the '1' direction) ... although there might be more sections heading away from the port to cope with the surge flows, especially close to the port, less so further away by which time the surge will have spread out a bit.
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wrinkly
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Re: A77: Ayr to Stranraer

Post by wrinkly »

Altnabreac wrote: Mon Feb 15, 2021 11:33 Yes I think dualling wouldn’t go beyond the Doomholm Road.
As far as the A713 might be good as a first stage as there's a bridge under the railway on the next section south that would be expensive to deal with.
clc
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Re: A77: Ayr to Stranraer

Post by clc »

I don’t think dualling would go further than the planned new at grade roundabout at Maybole Road which will provide access to the Corton development:

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/ayrshire/ ... h-23469145
snookes
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Re: A77: Ayr to Stranraer

Post by snookes »

clc wrote: Mon Feb 15, 2021 21:51 I don’t think dualling would go further than the planned new at grade roundabout at Maybole Road which will provide access to the Corton development:

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/ayrshire/ ... h-23469145

Good point, it probably would be the end of a dual there. I have my doubts about this development as it did previously rely on a supermarket (Sainsbury’s) committing to opening a store there and when they pulled out the whole scheme collapsed.

I don’t think this housing development takes in as much land as previous incarnations which may be a positive.

Not sure what store would be interested, Tesco’s store in Whitletts is nearly 30 years old so they may look to relocate, or add another store. They did I believe have plans to build at Holmston next to Dobbies at one point.(eta sorry it was actually Waitrose)
clc
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Re: A77: Ayr to Stranraer

Post by clc »

New speed limit and traffic lights planned on the A77 near Alloway:
The Scottish Ministers are satisfied that to restrict the national speed limit to 40mph at the Doonholm Road / Corton Road junction on the A77 Glasgow – Stranraer Trunk Road will be in the interests of traffic safety.
This new lower speed limit is necessary to accommodate the introduction of a traffic signal installation at this location to assist in managing traffic movements and to reduce the incidence of road traffic accidents contributing towards the Scottish Governments casualty reduction targets.
https://www.transport.gov.scot/road-ord ... order-202/
clc
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Re: A77: Ayr to Stranraer

Post by clc »

Am I understanding this correctly- the plan is to put traffic lights on a section of the A77 where there is currently a 60mph speed limit?
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Re: A77: Ayr to Stranraer

Post by AndyB »

If the Doonholm Road is busy enough, it may be necessary. It’s easy to see it being extended to the A79 junction at a later date.
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roadtester
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Re: A77: Ayr to Stranraer

Post by roadtester »

This seems to be an interesting development.

Scottish Labour leader Anas Sarwar is using the SNP's failure to invest in the A75 and A77 to drive home a wider message about them supposedly neglecting South West Scotland. He calls on both the Scottish and British governments to invest in the two roads.

https://twitter.com/AnasSarwar/status/1 ... 6843586565

Not sure whether this is just a one-off jab at the Sturgeon administration or whether he is going to keep up sustained criticism on the subject.
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Re: A77: Ayr to Stranraer

Post by avtur »

roadtester wrote: Wed Jul 28, 2021 18:25 This seems to be an interesting development.

Scottish Labour leader Anas Sarwar is using the SNP's failure to invest in the A75 and A77 to drive home a wider message about them supposedly neglecting South West Scotland. He calls on both the Scottish and British governments to invest in the two roads.

https://twitter.com/AnasSarwar/status/1 ... 6843586565

Not sure whether this is just a one-off jab at the Sturgeon administration or whether he is going to keep up sustained criticism on the subject.
The significance of these two roads in providing access to the ferry's to Ireland can not be understated. The frequency of accidents, particularly on the A75, is testament to the need for these roads to be upgraded.
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Re: A77: Ayr to Stranraer

Post by clc »

I drove the A77 from Ayr to Stranraer on Saturday as it happens.

I got stuck behind a slow moving convoy after Alloway and the lack of guaranteed overtaking was very frustrating. Maybole bypass can’t come quickly enough.

I remember there were plans for a WS2+1 between Turnberry and Girvan a few years ago and it was sufficiently developed that public consultations took place, so hopefully this scheme will be revived in the not too distant future. Same goes for the Ardwell to Slockenray scheme south of Girvan which if I recall correctly had an overtaking lane in one direction.

The most enjoyable part of the route for me is Lendalfoot to Ballantrae which gives you around 6 miles of high quality road and plenty of guaranteed overtaking especially on the long climbing lanes on Bennane Hill. The views are good too.

I think the worst part of the route is the section south of Ballantrae where the road winds its way up the hill to Auchencrosh, that really is a horrible twisty and narrow bit of road. I’m not sure how they would go about upgrading this section though given the challenging topography - any thoughts?

I was glad to see the Glen App WS2 had been resurfaced as it previously had some of the biggest pot holes I’ve ever seen, nice and smooth now though.
snookes
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Re: A77: Ayr to Stranraer

Post by snookes »

On another note I see the final bridge structure has been lifted in place on the Maybole
Bypass. I haven’t been by recently but I believe they are at the start of tying in the roundabouts to the existing road.

Transport Scotland anticipates road will open winter 2021
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Re: A77: Ayr to Stranraer

Post by Glenn A »

roadtester wrote: Wed Jul 28, 2021 18:25 This seems to be an interesting development.

Scottish Labour leader Anas Sarwar is using the SNP's failure to invest in the A75 and A77 to drive home a wider message about them supposedly neglecting South West Scotland. He calls on both the Scottish and British governments to invest in the two roads.

https://twitter.com/AnasSarwar/status/1 ... 6843586565

Not sure whether this is just a one-off jab at the Sturgeon administration or whether he is going to keep up sustained criticism on the subject.
Might Nicola not be interested in Dumfries and Galloway as it returns Conservative MPs and is the most Unionist part of Scotland. Go to somewhere like Annan and English accents aren't uncommon and many of the Scots have English partners and relatives.
Incidentally, the A75 veers between quiet and busy, depending on when the ferries land. In quiet times, it's a rapid drive from the A74(M) to Dumfries.
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Re: A77: Ayr to Stranraer

Post by Owain »

avtur wrote: Wed Jul 28, 2021 21:46The significance of these two roads in providing access to the ferry's to Ireland can not be understated. The frequency of accidents, particularly on the A75, is testament to the need for these roads to be upgraded.
I posted the following on this very thread (p. 4) after an unbelievable midnight drive along the A75 four years ago:
Owain wrote: Tue Sep 05, 2017 08:50I related my last drive along the A75 on Numpty Overload. I've never seen anything like it! Whole platoons of HGVs using the A75's many long straights to overtake whole platoons of HGVs that were slightly slower. Some of these were pulling out early in the hope of getting the jump on the vehicle in front, even if it was a car or, in my case, a van. Some had to abort their manouevres when a vehicle came the other way; others when they ran out of road; a few even carried on, around blind bends, on the wrong side of the road. All this on a road where the speed limit for HGVs is supposed to be 40mph.

I'm sure that a programme of improvements like those you've proposed for the A77 would improve things considerably; to be honest, my experience of both roads suggests that anything that can be done should be done. These are the main roads to Northern Ireland; Corsica, Sardinia and Sicily are all much better connected to their respective mainlands than NI is to the rest of the UK.
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exiled
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Re: A77: Ayr to Stranraer

Post by exiled »

roadtester wrote: Wed Jul 28, 2021 18:25 This seems to be an interesting development.

Scottish Labour leader Anas Sarwar is using the SNP's failure to invest in the A75 and A77 to drive home a wider message about them supposedly neglecting South West Scotland. He calls on both the Scottish and British governments to invest in the two roads.

https://twitter.com/AnasSarwar/status/1 ... 6843586565

Not sure whether this is just a one-off jab at the Sturgeon administration or whether he is going to keep up sustained criticism on the subject.
It is politics, but good politics. It allows him to say he cares about all of Scotland, and actually has the political antennas to know that upgrading the A75 will be a multi jurisdictional investment.

In simply Scottish terms, neither is a main priority. For Scotland I'd say having an upgraded link from the '74 to the 75 would be better than the A77 with the A75 getting improved from then on.
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Glenn A
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Re: A77: Ayr to Stranraer

Post by Glenn A »

The A75 upgrades in the late eighties and early nineties were a huge improvement on the old route, Dumfries and Annan were chronically congested and traffic could back up into Annan, but now not good enough, and there's still Crocketford to be by passed. I would suggest dualling from Gretna to Dumfries.
As regards the A77 Ayr by pass, being only partly D2 was good enough when the town was by passed in 1971, but this should now be fully dualled.
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