N.IRL: A5 Derry Dual Carriageway Progress updates

[nirs]

Rep of Ireland press release today setting out what will happen in the next 4 years. The plan says that the A5 schemes will go ahead as planned (see very last line). I didn't notice this press release myself - it was sent to me by a site visitor.

Gives some interesting reading for RoI roads. Several new starts in 2011, but essentially nothing for the two years after that:

New starts 2011:
• Belturbet / N5 Longford/ Tralee bypasses
• Cork Southern Ring Road junctions
• M17/18 Gort – Tuam PPP
• M11/Newlands Cross PPP bypasses.

jaytee - welcome to SABRE - although I suspect we have met before! Great to have another NI member on here, and one who hails from Tyrone (like myself) no less. I agree that all things being equal, there is no way that the southern part of the A5 upgrade should supersede the A6.

[explo]

Travelling the A5 between Ballygawley and Omagh this week, I noticed there are quite a few little placards placed in the verge along the route. These alternate between "No new road" and "Upgrade this road".

[nirs]

I hear that the Irish Labour party have been dropping hints to the media that if they come to power they are likely to pull the funding for the A5 scheme. Don't know any details of what was said but I imagine it will be in the press soon. No idea what their prospects would be in the next election tho.

[JBK]

The anti road lobby groups against the proposed N2 Slane bypass and the Monaghan/Emyvale bypass (both of which are on the Dublin-Derry route)seemed to have teamed up with the Alternative A5 Alliance lobby group.

I don’t think the argument for the two N2 upgrades is as solid as the A5 and this suits the lobby groups.

I’m not sure how much the Labour party even know about the details of how the funding for the A5 scheme has come about and its link to the St Andrews Agreement.

What some of their TDs have said to date relates to all the N2/A5 schemes but not specifically the A5 scheme.

They won’t win many (if any) seats in northwest constituencies but Fine Gale, their likely partner in a new coalition government will. It will be more important to hear what Fine Gale have to say on this funding.

Also the silent majority of people who realise the importance of this road could become very vocal if the funding situation for this road changes.

[Bryn666]

I can't help but think the Slane bypass (or at least relief for that god-awful bridge at the end of the hill) is justified on safety grounds alone?

[bothar]

I’m not sure how much the Labour party even know about the details of how the funding for the A5 scheme has come about and its link to the St Andrews Agreement

I doubt if they can have missed this. A lot would depend on the definition of "pull". Procastination would probably suit nearly everyone, as the NI assembly has to balance its budget too. I'd say that most would be happy with a reformulation into a shadow tolling arrangement whereby the ROI contribution would be paid over 20 years or something. But borrowing money from the UK government at commercial rates of interest to pay for this road is a hard sell politically, right now.

I can't help but think the Slane bypass (or at least relief for that god-awful bridge at the end of the hill) is justified on safety grounds alone?

The locals are beating the safety drum, with good reason.

[JBK]

I think a toll on the new A5 should be considered and would be a good idea, probably on the section around Omagh.

The M9 has no toll and I think the NRA said recently that the aadt isnt high enough to justify it. The A5 has very similar aadt figures to the M9. What sort of traffic figures justify a toll??

They plan to start this road in 2012 but this will probably end up being 2013. It will take two years to build so most of the money wont be needed to 2015.

[nirs]

What sort of traffic figures justify a toll??

I'd have thought the decision on whether to toll would be more to do with what people were prepared to pay and how much of a delay it would be to evade the toll and stick to the old road. The new road will save about 20 minutes on a journey from Ballygawley to L'Derry, so I'd have thought that given the choice many people would just stay on the old road. So iit would probably have to be a shadow toll or none at all.

They plan to start this road in 2012 but this will probably end up being 2013. It will take two years to build so most of the money wont be needed to 2015.

Indeed, the Irish government is proposing small payments in 2011 and 2012 and two big payments in 2013 and 2014.

The story is all over the media today:
A5 protests redundant? - 4ni
Slugger O'Toole
Plus the front cover of today's Irish News (not online).

At the present time, we are experiencing savage cutbacks in education, health and social welfare. Giving Northern Ireland £400million towards its roads is not a priority for the Labour Party. ... We are no longer in a position to fund the section of the [Dublin-Derry] road in the south so how could we fund the northern section?

I think the Irish funding towards the scheme is starting to look very shaky indeed.

[AndyB]

I agree. Desirable as the upgrade certainly is, I don't think it's fair on the people of the Republic to divert hundreds of millions to mainly benefit the people of Northern Ireland, and it would be far better to reduce the burden of the cuts and tax rises on their own people.

[JBK]

http://www.highlandradio.com/2010/12...bour-comments/
The are fears for the future of the new A5 dual carriageway linking Derry and Aughnacloy after Labour’s Transport Spokesman said it would not be a priority for the next government.

Contracts have been signed, and preliminary work is already underway. However, while the budget this week reaffirmed funding for the cross border project, Labour’s Joe Costello said a new government could not afford to fund what he termed “grandiose” projects in Northern Ireland.

In light of Deputy Costello’s comments, Foyle MLA Pol Callaghan, says the SDLP will be seeking talks with all the southern parties, including Labour, to set out the strong reasons for this key road to be built……….


It is very easy for the Labour party to knock this project when they have no, and will not have a presence in the North West.

How can the North West compete with any other region for FDI now that the interurbans are nearing completion ?

[nirs]

At some point within the next month, the A2 dualling scheme (Maydown to City of Derry Airport) will be completed. Once this happens, there will be no road construction projects underway anywhere in Northern Ireland for the first time in at least five years. This surely says something about where we are headed.

The next scheme due to hit the ground is a relatively minor junction improvement scheme at Culmore Road Roundabout in Londonderry which is due to start in February 2011.

[Chris_533976]

I can't help but think the Slane bypass (or at least relief for that god-awful bridge at the end of the hill) is justified on safety grounds alone?

Yes. But the problem with Slane is that its the obvious toll dodge route for the M1. So thats why, after all these years, the remaining crap N road out of Dublin hasnt been extended that far. Its not a priority for that reason.

I dont think it should be. Really the N2 needs to be detrunked to an R road. Either the M1 or M3 could spur off to do the Dublin to Derry road.

[nirs]

I dont think it should be. Really the N2 needs to be detrunked to an R road. Either the M1 or M3 could spur off to do the Dublin to Derry road.

Hear, hear. Constructing an inter-urban that effectively runs parallel to the M1 and M3 is a shameful waste of good money. Traffic for Derry/Donegal should use the M1 as far as the N33 (Ardee). An upgraded N33 could then pop traffic over onto the N2 much further north with no need to upgrade the big stretch in between to D2 standard.

[Enceladus]

I think most Dublin-Derry traffic already uses the M1-N33-N2 route - it's been in place for nearly 8 years now. It's the toll dodging lorries that continue to use Slane (which is a death trap with a 17th century bridge and needs bypassing ASAP).

Actually I'd go one step further and suggest, like quite a few people, that the N53/A37 from Dundalk to Castleblayney could be upgraded and thus traffic heading towards Monaghan, Tyrone and Derry could exit the M1 further north at Dundalk. It makes more use of the M1 and shortens the route from the M1 to Monaghan and the border.

I want to see the A5 upgraded but I firmly believe that the A6 should be a priority. The section from Castledawson to Randalstown urgently needs upgrading. It's quite likely the new government here in Ireland next year will cancel funding for the A5 project.

[andrew_duffy]

The N33 is already the signposted route from Dublin to Derry/Londonderry and back. It's wide, and as it was built on greenfield there is nothing on it*, so dualling would be trivial. Anyone have any ideas how the N2/N33/N52 layout could be revised to prevent through traffic on the N2?

http://maps.google.co.uk/?ie=UTF8&ll=53 ... 20986&z=16



* a new roundabout to provide access to an empty industrial estate was installed recently

[loch_cuan73]

I want to see the A5 upgraded but I firmly believe that the A6 should be a priority. The section from Castledawson to Randalstown urgently needs upgrading. It's quite likely the new government here in Ireland next year will cancel funding for the A5 project.

I firmly agree, having driven Belfast to Derry a couple of times in the snow and ice last week, the randalstown to castledawson section was by far the worst, compacted snow plus poor alignment doesn't make for a relaxing drive. The glenshane pass was completely clear of snow and seemed if all the winter gritting budget was spent keeping it this way.

I'd like to see the A5 go ahead as I also use the ballygawley to omagh section, but the A6 should be prioritised.

[nirs]

Roads Service did say recently that the core of their programme for the next 5 years consisted of
• The A5 upgrade
• The A8 upgrade
• Upgrades on the A6 Randalstown to Castledawson and Dungiven to L'Derry

so provided the money is there (ha ha ha ha) those are the three main roads that should be dealt with next.

[nirs]

I have just completed work on a strip map of the new dual-carriageway on my site.

I have just realised that when finished this road will set THREE new records for the longest stretch of dual-carriageway/motorway without junctions in Northern Ireland:
• 14.6km / 9.1 miles between Seskinore (j14) and A4/Ballygawley (j15)
• 13.0km / 8.1 miles between Newbuildings (j2) and Strabane (j3)
• 12.0km / 7.4 miles between Newtownstewart (j10) and Omagh (j11)

The current record holder is the 10.3km / 6.4 mile stretch of the M1 between Blaris (j8) and Moira (j9).

So pleased to see that they've got rid of the policy they showed on the A4 of dropping down junctions at every hole in the hedge. This is a far better way to build major interurban roads.

[bothar]

Nice job, nirs.

13.0km / 8.1 miles between Newbuildings (j2) and Strabane (j3)

Alas these proposals may join other maps on your site of projects that did not materialise. I think a rethink of this proposal is needed.

I still hold the view that a west bank alternative should still be examined here, given the problems of financing this project and the politics involved. How about a section from north of Newtownstewart to somewhere near St Johnson, with a toll bridge and a spur towards Letterkenny. The toll could be on the Donegal side and people in Derry could either use this route and pay or go on to the existing free A5. If the ROI organise this bit then the NI authorities could do some work on the other sections in a staged way, for instance the recently built Newtownstewart bypass might not be replaced right now.

[dantheman]

Good work Wes, just to let you know that the 30th Jan link update on your website for the Sprucefield scheme is misdirecting