Catthorpe re-modelling

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c2R
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Re: Catthorpe re-modelling

Post by c2R » Sat May 20, 2017 20:26

Chris5156 wrote:
wrinkly wrote:
Stevie D wrote: They have done exactly the same on the A63 ELLR, another of those rare examples where it might not be technically correct but it is a practical and useful bodge. While the A63 doesn't lead quite as inexorably to the motorway as the A14 does, as there are other destinations along the way and a roundabout to turn round at, there is no through route other than via the motorway so I think the sign is fair enough.
But Leeds loves using that type of sign even where there's no suggestion of an excuse:

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.91025 ... 312!8i6656
Yes, whoever Leeds City Council employs to design its direction signs has at best a fairly shaky grasp of the rules.

I love the use of motorway here: https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.68132 ... 312!8i6656
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Berk
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Re: Catthorpe re-modelling

Post by Berk » Sat May 20, 2017 21:16

But that's just what we've been talking about - and it works. :)

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Re: Catthorpe re-modelling

Post by A320Driver » Thu Aug 24, 2017 15:57

We were passing through the area on the M1 last week and took a small detour to drive through the junction M6->A14. Managed to grab a couple of photos of the A14/A5199 junction.....the A14 is signed as a motorway but with no number.
A14.jpg
A141.jpg
a142.jpg
Driving along the new local route does give you an impression of the true scale of the junction - it's quite impressive.
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Re: Catthorpe re-modelling

Post by Berk » Thu Aug 24, 2017 16:07

Secret motorway?? :D

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Re: Catthorpe re-modelling

Post by ais523 » Thu Aug 24, 2017 22:07

The ADSes are correct. That symbol on an ADS means "this exit inescapably leads to a motorway", which is correct.

I'm less clear on the meaning on flag signs; does it start motorway regulations by itself? It shouldn't, anyway, because that sign is one of the simplest ways to make sure drivers do the right thing, so it'd be a shame if it meant the wrong thing.

Incidentally, those emergency diversion symbol patches are intriguing. Why would you send an emergency diversion along the A5199? I thought the approved diversion route used the A43. (Is this just for traffic that somehow reaches the junction and then finds it has nowhere to go?) More interestingly, why are there three of them? (I see solid circle, solid triangle, hollow square.)

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Re: Catthorpe re-modelling

Post by darkcape » Sat Aug 26, 2017 23:56

It's the diversion route from J1, I think it spits out at M1 J20 westbound and the A6 at Rothwell eastbound.

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Re: Catthorpe re-modelling

Post by Berk » Sun Aug 27, 2017 01:33

darkcape wrote:It's the diversion route from J1, I think it spits out at M1 J20 westbound and the A6 at Rothwell eastbound.
Diversion for NMU's?? Incidentally I was on the A14 yesterday, and I noticed that the signage for stray NMU's to 'pull into the layby and ring for assistance' is still on temporary folding boards.

I'm not being funny but how long has the junction been fully open now?? Just over 18/20 months?? Isn't that quite long enough to erect permanent signage?? :?

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Re: Catthorpe re-modelling

Post by Berk » Sun Sep 03, 2017 21:34

I see that Catthorpe is now on Google Streetview - the whole A14 journey is now available, however, the pictures are about 2 years old (when it was down to one lane each way).

Previously, it was just the M6-M1 bridges. The new (local) Rugby Road isn't available yet.

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Re: Catthorpe re-modelling

Post by lotrjw » Mon Sep 04, 2017 00:01

Berk wrote:I see that Catthorpe is now on Google Streetview - the whole A14 journey is now available, however, the pictures are about 2 years old (when it was down to one lane each way).

Previously, it was just the M6-M1 bridges. The new (local) Rugby Road isn't available yet.
The A14 bit has been there for a while, I think back to February this year.

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Re: Catthorpe re-modelling

Post by Berk » Mon Sep 04, 2017 00:22

lotrjw wrote:
Berk wrote:I see that Catthorpe is now on Google Streetview - the whole A14 journey is now available, however, the pictures are about 2 years old (when it was down to one lane each way).

Previously, it was just the M6-M1 bridges. The new (local) Rugby Road isn't available yet.
The A14 bit has been there for a while, I think back to February this year.
In my experience it started on the new road, and then slipped back in time to the old M6 slip roads. At least it's all consistent now. Apart from Rugby Road. :)

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Re: Catthorpe re-modelling

Post by vlad » Mon Sep 04, 2017 20:19

Berk wrote:In my experience it started on the new road, and then slipped back in time to the old M6 slip roads. At least it's all consistent now. Apart from Rugby Road. :)
Given that the year-old images from the M1 basically show Rugby Road to be part of a building site (here, for example), I think we can allow it that they didn't update that road at the same time!
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Re: New Lower Thames Crossing

Post by jackal » Fri Jan 08, 2021 12:25

Bryn666 wrote:
Fri Jan 08, 2021 12:13
jackal wrote:
Fri Jan 08, 2021 12:03
I still think the M2 may be extended to the big new GSJ at Thong. This is because the west-facing slips at J1 are to be disconnected from the mainline, so if the motorway continued to start/end there it would be a 'spontaneous motorway'.
Don't bank on it, given Blyth and M56 terminus cock-ups.

But I agree this would be logical. So that's why it won't happen.
Not to mention Catthorpe!

The reason that I'm reasonably confident is that there's a parallel route (the outer carriageways) with full connectivity for non-motorway traffic, which isn't really true in the other cases. Though that may not stop them...

https://highwaysengland.citizenspace.co ... 20maps.pdf

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Re: New Lower Thames Crossing

Post by EpicChef » Fri Jan 08, 2021 15:51

jackal wrote:
Fri Jan 08, 2021 12:25
Bryn666 wrote:
Fri Jan 08, 2021 12:13
jackal wrote:
Fri Jan 08, 2021 12:03
I still think the M2 may be extended to the big new GSJ at Thong. This is because the west-facing slips at J1 are to be disconnected from the mainline, so if the motorway continued to start/end there it would be a 'spontaneous motorway'.
Don't bank on it, given Blyth and M56 terminus cock-ups.

But I agree this would be logical. So that's why it won't happen.
Not to mention Catthorpe!
I just don't get Catthorpe. What is so wrong about extending the M6 and making Catthorpe junction 1A?

All it would take at the max is the conversion of existing laybys to Emergency Refuge Areas and the installation of Smart Motorway technology (which would be mandatory given there's no hard shoulder).
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Re: New Lower Thames Crossing

Post by trickstat » Thu Jan 14, 2021 19:14

EpicChef wrote:
Fri Jan 08, 2021 15:51
jackal wrote:
Fri Jan 08, 2021 12:25
Bryn666 wrote:
Fri Jan 08, 2021 12:13


Don't bank on it, given Blyth and M56 terminus cock-ups.

But I agree this would be logical. So that's why it won't happen.
Not to mention Catthorpe!
I just don't get Catthorpe. What is so wrong about extending the M6 and making Catthorpe junction 1A?

All it would take at the max is the conversion of existing laybys to Emergency Refuge Areas and the installation of Smart Motorway technology (which would be mandatory given there's no hard shoulder).
Perhaps it's because you'd be turning somewhere where tired and/or hungry drivers can take a break into somewhere they can only use in an emergency for the sake of blue lining a few extra miles of road.

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Re: New Lower Thames Crossing

Post by Gav » Thu Jan 14, 2021 21:04

jackal wrote:
Thu Jan 14, 2021 18:19
The Queensferry Crossing is another one.
According to Bryn its along side upgrade so might not be.

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Re: New Lower Thames Crossing

Post by lotrjw » Thu Jan 14, 2021 22:57

trickstat wrote:
Thu Jan 14, 2021 19:14
EpicChef wrote:
Fri Jan 08, 2021 15:51
jackal wrote:
Fri Jan 08, 2021 12:25

Not to mention Catthorpe!
I just don't get Catthorpe. What is so wrong about extending the M6 and making Catthorpe junction 1A?

All it would take at the max is the conversion of existing laybys to Emergency Refuge Areas and the installation of Smart Motorway technology (which would be mandatory given there's no hard shoulder).
Perhaps it's because you'd be turning somewhere where tired and/or hungry drivers can take a break into somewhere they can only use in an emergency for the sake of blue lining a few extra miles of road.
Thats what service stations are for, something they should build more of.

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Re: New Lower Thames Crossing

Post by trickstat » Fri Jan 15, 2021 08:23

lotrjw wrote:
Thu Jan 14, 2021 22:57
trickstat wrote:
Thu Jan 14, 2021 19:14
EpicChef wrote:
Fri Jan 08, 2021 15:51

I just don't get Catthorpe. What is so wrong about extending the M6 and making Catthorpe junction 1A?

All it would take at the max is the conversion of existing laybys to Emergency Refuge Areas and the installation of Smart Motorway technology (which would be mandatory given there's no hard shoulder).
Perhaps it's because you'd be turning somewhere where tired and/or hungry drivers can take a break into somewhere they can only use in an emergency for the sake of blue lining a few extra miles of road.
Thats what service stations are for, something they should build more of.
I do actually agree with you there.

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Re: New Lower Thames Crossing

Post by Bryn666 » Fri Jan 15, 2021 13:22

lotrjw wrote:
Thu Jan 14, 2021 22:57
trickstat wrote:
Thu Jan 14, 2021 19:14
EpicChef wrote:
Fri Jan 08, 2021 15:51

I just don't get Catthorpe. What is so wrong about extending the M6 and making Catthorpe junction 1A?

All it would take at the max is the conversion of existing laybys to Emergency Refuge Areas and the installation of Smart Motorway technology (which would be mandatory given there's no hard shoulder).
Perhaps it's because you'd be turning somewhere where tired and/or hungry drivers can take a break into somewhere they can only use in an emergency for the sake of blue lining a few extra miles of road.
Thats what service stations are for, something they should build more of.
It also would require several footpaths that cross it on the level to be diverted, and HE don't like doing that unless they absolutely have to. Or if they can get a poncey architect to come up with a completely OTT 'signature' footbridge in a rural setting when a simple bridge would achieve the same result, that is usually the fastest way to do it.
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Re: New Lower Thames Crossing

Post by Alderpoint » Fri Jan 15, 2021 15:01

Bryn666 wrote:
Fri Jan 15, 2021 13:22
It also would require several footpaths that cross it on the level to be diverted, and HE don't like doing that unless they absolutely have to. Or if they can get a poncey architect to come up with a completely OTT 'signature' footbridge in a rural setting when a simple bridge would achieve the same result, that is usually the fastest way to do it.
There are no footpaths (or bridleways) across the section of the A14 between the M1 and J1/A5199 - the few near the M1 junction were all removed/rerouted when Catthorpe was rebuilt.

Indeed I can't find any all the way to Rothwell.
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Re: New Lower Thames Crossing

Post by Bryn666 » Fri Jan 15, 2021 15:37

Alderpoint wrote:
Fri Jan 15, 2021 15:01
Bryn666 wrote:
Fri Jan 15, 2021 13:22
It also would require several footpaths that cross it on the level to be diverted, and HE don't like doing that unless they absolutely have to. Or if they can get a poncey architect to come up with a completely OTT 'signature' footbridge in a rural setting when a simple bridge would achieve the same result, that is usually the fastest way to do it.
There are no footpaths (or bridleways) across the section of the A14 between the M1 and J1/A5199 - the few near the M1 junction were all removed/rerouted when Catthorpe was rebuilt.

Indeed I can't find any all the way to Rothwell.
Excellent, I thought they'd left those in. In that case there's really nothing preventing extending motorway regulations eastwards other than lack of political will and legislative knowledge to grasp how motorways are supposed to work.
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