A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

The study of British and Irish roads - their construction, numbering, history, mapping, past and future official roads proposals and general roads musings.

There is a separate forum for Street Furniture (traffic lights, street lights, road signs etc).

Registered users get access to other forums including discussions about other forms of transport, driving, fantasy roads and wishlists, and roads quizzes.

Moderator: Site Management Team

Post Reply
User avatar
KeithW
Member
Posts: 19205
Joined: Thu Dec 04, 2014 13:25
Location: Marton-In-Cleveland North Yorks

Re: A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

Post by KeithW »

Burns wrote: Sat Oct 09, 2021 20:21 Had we been in Norway, Austria, France, Italy, Spain, Switzerland, okay, pretty much any other country in Europe, the A82 would have had a couple of tunnels built around Loch Lomond decades ago.

Just sayin'.
Why build a tunnel when you can build road alongside the Loch and admire the views ?
swissferry
Member
Posts: 319
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2017 20:42

Re: A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

Post by swissferry »

Looks good. Scheme is more ambitious than I expected with lots of cuttings presumably requiring blasting through rock. Much needed improvement. Tourist traffic in summer makes the route frustrating. Width and bends make it unsuitable for large vehicle. Motorcyclists often overtake dangerously. Road can suffer badly from potholes, minor rockfalls, surface water and ice. Very substandard for a trunk road.
FtoE
Member
Posts: 156
Joined: Sat Nov 30, 2013 09:43

Re: A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

Post by FtoE »

I have to express my reservations about the Rannoch Moor section. Yes, it’s spectacular with plenty of long straights but it’s very narrow - and not just at the bridges. When overtaking a lorry or coach - and there’s plenty of them, often foreign and new to the road - you are relying on them keeping hard left, and plenty of them drift over the line. Combined with soft verges both sides, it can be a hairy experience. I doubt it’ll happen in my lifetime but I’d like to see an extra metre on each side.
swissferry
Member
Posts: 319
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2017 20:42

Re: A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

Post by swissferry »

FtoE wrote: Sun Oct 10, 2021 00:30 I have to express my reservations about the Rannoch Moor section. Yes, it’s spectacular with plenty of long straights but it’s very narrow - and not just at the bridges. When overtaking a lorry or coach - and there’s plenty of them, often foreign and new to the road - you are relying on them keeping hard left, and plenty of them drift over the line. Combined with soft verges both sides, it can be a hairy experience. I doubt it’ll happen in my lifetime but I’d like to see an extra metre on each side.
True, but there are plenty of good overtaking opportunities with excellent sightlines so I tend to be cautious and wait if in doubt. In high winds, rain or snow I may just follow.
clc
Member
Posts: 216
Joined: Fri Feb 05, 2016 22:34

Re: A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

Post by clc »

Drove the Inverarnan to Tarbet section for the first time in years. Got stuck behind 3 vehicles just north of Inverarnan, the front vehicle was a very slowly driven motorhome. The second vehicle was glued to the motorhome’s rear bumper with no interest in overtaking (opportunities were had but not taken). By the time the motorhome turned off at Luss there was a very long queue of frustrated drivers behind.

Someone posted on the A9 dualling thread recently that the cost of the Tarbet- Inverarnan scheme had escalated to nearly £500 million. If that is correct then I can’t see it going ahead. Perhaps the worst bends will be sorted but the plan for a full upgrade looks unlikely to happen now.
User avatar
Bryn666
Elected Committee Member
Posts: 35755
Joined: Thu Jun 20, 2002 20:54
Contact:

Re: A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

Post by Bryn666 »

FtoE wrote: Sun Oct 10, 2021 00:30 I have to express my reservations about the Rannoch Moor section. Yes, it’s spectacular with plenty of long straights but it’s very narrow - and not just at the bridges. When overtaking a lorry or coach - and there’s plenty of them, often foreign and new to the road - you are relying on them keeping hard left, and plenty of them drift over the line. Combined with soft verges both sides, it can be a hairy experience. I doubt it’ll happen in my lifetime but I’d like to see an extra metre on each side.
Yes, it definitely is less than 7.3m wide in many places - ideally it should be widened to a non-standard but suitable 8m given the campers etc. At the narrow bridges, until they can be replaced, I'd remove the centre lines entirely and probably look at priority signs just to keep it safer in the interim. The sightlines and relatively low traffic flows make this possible.
Bryn
Terminally cynical, unimpressed, and nearly Middle Age already.
She said life was like a motorway; dull, grey, and long.

Blog - https://showmeasign.online/
X - https://twitter.com/ShowMeASignBryn
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@BrynBuck
User avatar
SouthWest Philip
Member
Posts: 3478
Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2002 19:35
Location: Evesham, Worcestershire

Re: A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

Post by SouthWest Philip »

Bryn666 wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 10:41 Yes, it definitely is less than 7.3m wide in many places - ideally it should be widened to a non-standard but suitable 8m given the campers etc. At the narrow bridges, until they can be replaced, I'd remove the centre lines entirely and probably look at priority signs just to keep it safer in the interim. The sightlines and relatively low traffic flows make this possible.
"One Lane Bridge", like they do in New Zealand.
jnty
Member
Posts: 1727
Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2021 00:12

Re: A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

Post by jnty »

SouthWest Philip wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 12:57
Bryn666 wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 10:41 Yes, it definitely is less than 7.3m wide in many places - ideally it should be widened to a non-standard but suitable 8m given the campers etc. At the narrow bridges, until they can be replaced, I'd remove the centre lines entirely and probably look at priority signs just to keep it safer in the interim. The sightlines and relatively low traffic flows make this possible.
"One Lane Bridge", like they do in New Zealand.
I think they all have the trusty "Oncoming vehicles in middle of road" sign.

I always wonder what the general safety record is of locations where this sign is used. They certainly startled me as a new driver...
User avatar
Bryn666
Elected Committee Member
Posts: 35755
Joined: Thu Jun 20, 2002 20:54
Contact:

Re: A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

Post by Bryn666 »

SouthWest Philip wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 12:57
Bryn666 wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 10:41 Yes, it definitely is less than 7.3m wide in many places - ideally it should be widened to a non-standard but suitable 8m given the campers etc. At the narrow bridges, until they can be replaced, I'd remove the centre lines entirely and probably look at priority signs just to keep it safer in the interim. The sightlines and relatively low traffic flows make this possible.
"One Lane Bridge", like they do in New Zealand.
That would be "oncoming vehicles in middle of road" under our sign regs so still possible.
Bryn
Terminally cynical, unimpressed, and nearly Middle Age already.
She said life was like a motorway; dull, grey, and long.

Blog - https://showmeasign.online/
X - https://twitter.com/ShowMeASignBryn
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@BrynBuck
jnty
Member
Posts: 1727
Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2021 00:12

Re: A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

Post by jnty »

Bryn666 wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 13:02
SouthWest Philip wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 12:57
Bryn666 wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 10:41 Yes, it definitely is less than 7.3m wide in many places - ideally it should be widened to a non-standard but suitable 8m given the campers etc. At the narrow bridges, until they can be replaced, I'd remove the centre lines entirely and probably look at priority signs just to keep it safer in the interim. The sightlines and relatively low traffic flows make this possible.
"One Lane Bridge", like they do in New Zealand.
That would be "oncoming vehicles in middle of road" under our sign regs so still possible.
I think they are all signed this way already, but I don't think the two are equivalent. One lane bridges I've seen in NZ are generally exactly one traffic lane wide and usually work under priority systems on main roads. A priority system, or lights, would be the only real choice in the UK too on remotely busy S2 roads I think. "Oncoming vehicles in middle of road" sections, at least on Scottish trunk roads, are generally wide enough for two cars to pass, often without unduly slowing. A proliferation of priority systems on the Rannoch Moor bridges would probably just devalue the concept unless they were artificially narrowed.
Glenn A
Member
Posts: 9776
Joined: Fri Apr 15, 2005 19:31
Location: Cumbria

Re: A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

Post by Glenn A »

The A66 from Penrith to Scotch Corner still has my vote. You can by flying along the D2 at 70 mph and then into a section of S2 where a tractor can reduce you to 10 mph and an accident can leave the road closed for hours. Last year for no apparent reason, the S2 section was blocked near Kirby Thore for half an hour before the traffic started moving again. I can only assume this was either due to the volume of traffic or a breakdown, but in hot, humid weather this was no fun.
csd
Member
Posts: 399
Joined: Sun Nov 16, 2003 17:55
Location: Dublin

Re: A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

Post by csd »

With views like this, it's possible to forgive a lot!
Image

/csd
User avatar
exiled
President
Posts: 24644
Joined: Sat Jan 27, 2007 17:36
Location: South Lanarkshire

Re: A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

Post by exiled »

The section from the Erskine Bridge to Dumbarton is often IMHO overlooked.

Noticed on GSV the link below shows some changes

https://www.google.com/maps/@55.9293791 ... authuser=0

This is the Old Kirkpatrick turnoff, and they have put in the 'keep apart' chevrons since summer 2021, and also the lane arrows have been placed in red surfacing. The junction is quite tight at that point, a 90 degree turn on a 70 mph limit. Making some improvements here also makes sense as this is the route to Argyll, the Islands, and the southern Highlands from Glasgow Airport and that section of the A82 always feels too narrow for its job.
Did you know there's more to SABRE than just the Forums?
Add your roads knowledge to the SABRE Wiki today!
Have you browsed SABRE Maps recently? Try getting involved!
User avatar
Owain
Elected Committee Member
Posts: 26209
Joined: Fri Aug 21, 2009 17:02
Location: Leodis

Re: A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

Post by Owain »

csd wrote: Tue May 03, 2022 21:39 With views like this, it's possible to forgive a lot!
Image

/csd
Indeed, I'd contend it's one of the best!

Never been held up by anything on it, either...
Former President & F99 Driver

Viva la Repubblica!
User avatar
TomJ
Member
Posts: 171
Joined: Mon May 20, 2019 13:49
Location: Glasgow

Re: A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

Post by TomJ »

csd wrote:With views like this, it's possible to forgive a lot!
Image

/csd
It's even better in Winter...
IMG20221217143952.jpg
IMG20221217135039.jpg
A212
New Member
Posts: 5
Joined: Wed Nov 24, 2021 16:00

Re: A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

Post by A212 »

Apologies for resurrecting an old thread, however next Friday I am driving from Liverpool to Fort William for a climb up Ben Nevis. I’m picking up some friends in Glasgow en route. I’d naturally assumed taking the A82 from Erskine Bridge onwards was a given however I understand the section around Loch Lomond is a pain and as it is school holiday and a Friday afternoon the traffic will be painful.

Although longer, would going via Stirling across on the A84 to Crianlarich to rejoin the A82 be a suitable alternative?
User avatar
owen b
Member
Posts: 9861
Joined: Sun Mar 16, 2003 15:22
Location: Luton

Re: A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

Post by owen b »

A212 wrote: Thu Jul 20, 2023 21:06 Apologies for resurrecting an old thread, however next Friday I am driving from Liverpool to Fort William for a climb up Ben Nevis. I’m picking up some friends in Glasgow en route. I’d naturally assumed taking the A82 from Erskine Bridge onwards was a given however I understand the section around Loch Lomond is a pain and as it is school holiday and a Friday afternoon the traffic will be painful.

Although longer, would going via Stirling across on the A84 to Crianlarich to rejoin the A82 be a suitable alternative?
I drive from Luton to Fort William from time to time and unless there's a specific problem I find that Google Maps has the Erskine Bridge route typically ten minutes faster than the Callandar route. Until about ten years ago I used to go the Callandar way but the completion of the M74 through Glasgow and the A82 improvements at Pulpit Rock and Crianlarich tipped the balance in favour of Erskine Bridge.
Owen
Summers-lad
Member
Posts: 109
Joined: Thu May 11, 2023 22:40

Re: A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

Post by Summers-lad »

A212 wrote: Thu Jul 20, 2023 21:06 Apologies for resurrecting an old thread, however next Friday I am driving from Liverpool to Fort William for a climb up Ben Nevis. I’m picking up some friends in Glasgow en route. I’d naturally assumed taking the A82 from Erskine Bridge onwards was a given however I understand the section around Loch Lomond is a pain and as it is school holiday and a Friday afternoon the traffic will be painful.

Although longer, would going via Stirling across on the A84 to Crianlarich to rejoin the A82 be a suitable alternative?
Yes it's suitable, and another scenic road, especially north of Callander, but unless there's a major traffic problem I'd not expect it to save you any time. Depends where in Glasgow you're picking up your friends though. Many hauliers prefer the A84 route to avoid damage to mirrors etc, but in a car, the narrow bit (Tarbert to Inverarnan) should be fine. And if it's not too busy, it's great fun!
Loch Lomond as far as Tarbet is a fairly modern road - not many overtaking opportunities but free-flowing, and if you do find the traffic is heavy, you would have the option of going by A83 and A819 - it's longer than the A84 route but could be worthwhile if you're going to be in the west part of Glasgow.
I hope you get good weather for Ben Nevis and you're well equipped for it. There's a description of the tourist route here https://www.walkhighlands.co.uk/fortwil ... evis.shtml - note particularly the safety bearings on the summit plateau if the visibility is poor - and if you are experienced hillwalkers there are other routes (but if you're experienced hillwalkers you probably don't need me to tell you that). A while ago, Google Maps showed an extremely unsuitable and dangerous route up the Ben, from the end of the Glen Nevis road, but thankfully that has been changed (although their depiction of the path is only schematic and not topographic).
swissferry
Member
Posts: 319
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2017 20:42

Re: A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

Post by swissferry »

Generally the A82 will be quicker.

May depend on whereabouts in Glasgow you are picking your friends up. If in east end it may be 50-50. Congestion on the A82 tends to be worse southbound than northbound, especially between Luss and Balloch and through Dumbarton. Congestion on M8/M74/M80 may also influence decision.
A212
New Member
Posts: 5
Joined: Wed Nov 24, 2021 16:00

Re: A82 from Glasgow to Fort William be Britain's worst road?

Post by A212 »

Thank you, this is really helpful. Luckily we’re all fairly experienced walkers too.
Post Reply