A9 dualling

[A9Dan]

Unfortunate that almost all the land west of Inveralmond has been developed, had it not been then this would have been a good opportunity to bypass Inveralmond and link the new alignment directly into the A9 south.

[David D Miller]

There does seem a lot of development land being allocated north and west of Perth for housing, from what I know of Perth I cannot see how all these houses are needed. I know the city is a transport hub, however it takes over an hour to travel to Edinburgh or Glasgow area for commuting.

Has Perth council got ideas of a large city there?

Perth and Dundee already have regular commuters going through to Glasgow - even students going for 9 o-clock lectures! It's far enough out to be covered by discounted Inter7City pricing, and that makes advance-purchase tickets really cost effective: Last year, I was getting peak-hour return journeys from Dundee for as little as £6.60, and I could work productively on the train!

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

[Berk]

How long does an Inter7City take from Perth, and Inverness??

[djw1981]

Perth to Glasgow 1h5 to 1h20 by train
Perth to Dundee 20-25min
Perth to Edinburgh 1h15-1h40 (sadly the direct route had M90 built over significant chunks)
Perth to Inverness 2h10 to 2h40
Perth to Aberdeen (via Dundee) 1h40

[Berk]

Wow, those are significant improvements on what there was before.

We could do with some similar services in England - for example, Birmingham - Stansted Airport. Completely unsuitable journey to be provided by basic DMU’s.

It may even provide similar journey times.

[Euan]

Perth to Glasgow 1h5 to 1h20 by train
Perth to Dundee 20-25min
Perth to Edinburgh 1h15-1h40 (sadly the direct route had M90 built over significant chunks)
Perth to Inverness 2h10 to 2h40
Perth to Aberdeen (via Dundee) 1h40

If that is the case then at the moment it must be a bit of a toss-up over whether it is quicker to travel between Perth and Inverness by road or by rail. Once the entire stretch of the A9 is fully dualled the road would quite easily be quicker than the train.

[Stravaiger]

Perth/Inverness road is faster than rail at the moment. Been travelling that stretch for many years and always manage in less than 2 hours.

[A9Craig]

Perth/Inverness road is faster than rail at the moment. Been travelling that stretch for many years and always manage in less than 2 hours.

Same for me, usually around 1h 50m to 2 hours. Once Luncarty - Birnam gets going next month 2 hours will seem like a good run. 3 years from now, when things are in full swing over several sections, I think that train might be a lot busier.

[A9NWIL]

Perth/Inverness road is faster than rail at the moment. Been travelling that stretch for many years and always manage in less than 2 hours.

Same for me, usually around 1h 50m to 2 hours. Once Luncarty - Birnam gets going next month 2 hours will seem like a good run. 3 years from now, when things are in full swing over several sections, I think that train might be a lot busier.

I wonder what it will be once the whole road is finished? 1hour 30min?

[djw1981]

112 miles centre to centre on google maps, so if A9 is 70mph D2, then should be just over 90minutes for the dualled bit, the bit either end may take it nearer to 100 mins.

[A9Dan]

112 miles centre to centre on google maps, so if A9 is 70mph D2, then should be just over 90minutes for the dualled bit, the bit either end may take it nearer to 100 mins.

I expect the Dunkeld roundabout will also extend the journey time, maybe not so much off peak but I can see things grinding to a halt there at peaks times.

[Euan]

Perth/Inverness road is faster than rail at the moment. Been travelling that stretch for many years and always manage in less than 2 hours.

The journey time by rail would depend on how many stations the trains call at. Some trains do not stop at stations like Newtonmore and Carrbridge, while others stop at all the stations. Perth to Inverness in under 2 hours by road sounds like pretty good going, presumably that is in the absence of 40mph drivers along the undualled sections.

[A9NWIL]

112 miles centre to centre on google maps, so if A9 is 70mph D2, then should be just over 90minutes for the dualled bit, the bit either end may take it nearer to 100 mins.

Well based on the road as it is now, using the northbound A9 entrance from Inveralmond to the end of the northbound exit slip at Raigmore its 174km (108 miles). Then add from the centre of Perth to the northbound A9 entrance at Inveralmond and from the end of the northbound exit slip at Raigmore to the centre of Inverness added together its 6.8km (4.2 miles).
So the speed limits will be 113km/h (70mph) for 174km (108 miles) and 48km/h (30mph) for 6.8km (4.2 miles) when its fully duelled.

If travelling at the speed limit so no traffic then I make it 1 hour 40 min so 10 min of what was said could be done now with current speed limits.
If you factor in traffic then expect another 3-5 min on top.

If you were to use the 10% error margin on speed enforcement as some people may do (not recommended of course!) then at 6% faster no traffic you could do it in 1 hour 35 min and at 10% faster you could do it in 1 hour 31 min.

Thats what I get anyway as a more detailed analysis.

Google maps is saying that the current time is 2 hours and 9 min without traffic.

[Stravaiger]

Perth to Inverness in under 2 hours by road sounds like pretty good going, presumably that is in the absence of 40mph drivers along the undualled sections.

Believe it or not, I recall the journey times Perth/ Inverness were very similar in the 1960’s. Presumably because back then there wasn’t the traffic there is now, and of course, no speed limits!

[Euan]

Perth to Inverness in under 2 hours by road sounds like pretty good going, presumably that is in the absence of 40mph drivers along the undualled sections.

Believe it or not, I recall the journey times Perth/ Inverness were very similar in the 1960’s. Presumably because back then there wasn’t the traffic there is now, and of course, no speed limits!

2 hours despite none of the towns or villages having bypasses at the time? It would have had to have been a really good run along the rural sections, but much of the old A9 would have been far from suitable for reaching such speeds without crashing. Although there may have been fewer slow drivers back then as well.

[B9127]

https://www.transport.gov.scot/news/fur ... xt-week-1/ A further step forward

[paully]

Being realistic, an S2 will I’m sure be more that adequate here. There aren’t unlimited funds available to make everything D2, especially as this is a local authority road. I would imagine making the bridge more than twice as wide would probably double the cost.

In fantasyland, a D2 A94 from Forfar, with appropriate bypasses, plugging into the A9 (with grade separation around Perth) would be a good alternative to the A90, and may lessen the requirement for a Dundee bypass, but in reality, that’s not going to happen. (And any further fantasy discussion of this should happen in the appropriate forum!)

Thats why I said make the bridge at least wide enough for D2 plus pavements, even if at first they just have a WS2 over the bridge with wide pavements, so make the bridge about 20 metres wide, meaning 5 metre wide pavements each side. That would future proof the bridge at least. If thats too wide make it wide enough for an S4 at 16 metres wide with 3 metre wide pavements each side.

There's no danger of them building a 20m wide bridge. At best, it'll have a shared use pavement on one side (this is similar to the new B9993 bridge over the Almond). Best bet is to ensure that the road layout at the junction allows for another identical bridge to be installed parallel to it in the future, should the need arise. Of course, we both know that this will never happen, and I really worry that the sliproads they propose for this junction will be under-specced to deal with the volume of traffic.

[A9Dan]

https://www.transport.gov.scot/news/a9- ... -closures/

Confirmation that the main construction works for Luncarty to Pass of Birnam will start on 4 February.

[Euan]

Usually whenever we plan trips we will make time estimates based on expected speeds along different stretches of road which are based upon past experience on that road. I reckon it would be wise for us to factor the 40mph speed limit during the two year long works into our estimates somehow.

[IAN]

Which section is due to start construction next and when?

Ian (M5 Driver)