A1 Western bypass widening

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jackal
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Re: A1 Western bypass widening

Post by jackal » Thu Feb 22, 2018 17:54

This isn't necessarily decisive, but one problem with that is that the ghost island effectively shortens the already extremely tight weaving space to the services.

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Re: A1 Western bypass widening

Post by jackal » Thu Oct 10, 2019 12:46

A1 Birtley to Coal House was put before the Planning Inspectorate in August.

Re: the discussion about the northbound squeeze to two lanes, maybe they could just have a short four lane section with a lane gain from the services, which then has a single lane drop to the A194(M) with three lanes for the A1?
Last edited by jackal on Thu Oct 10, 2019 12:50, edited 2 times in total.

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Mark Hewitt
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Re: A1 Western bypass widening

Post by Mark Hewitt » Thu Oct 10, 2019 12:48

jackal wrote:
Thu Oct 10, 2019 12:46
A1 Birtley to Coal House was put before the Planning Inspectorate in August.

Re: the discussion about the northbound squeeze to two lanes, maybe they could just have a short four lane section with a lane gain from the services, which then has a single lane drop to the A194(M) with three lanes for the A1?
That would make sense, if you use the hard shoulder area. As that's bound to remain a bottleneck otherwise.
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jackal
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Re: A1 Western bypass widening

Post by jackal » Thu Oct 10, 2019 12:51

Though looking back through the thread I've seen the problem with that, which is HGVs are in lane four. Still maybe the best that could be done.

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Re: A1 Western bypass widening

Post by Rob590 » Thu Oct 10, 2019 13:14

Mark Hewitt wrote:
Thu Oct 10, 2019 12:48
That would make sense, if you use the hard shoulder area.
In my experience on this road, there are plenty of morning commuters who seem to have found that solution for themselves!

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Re: A1 Western bypass widening

Post by owen b » Thu Oct 10, 2019 21:04

Mark Hewitt wrote:
Thu Oct 10, 2019 12:48
jackal wrote:
Thu Oct 10, 2019 12:46
A1 Birtley to Coal House was put before the Planning Inspectorate in August.

Re: the discussion about the northbound squeeze to two lanes, maybe they could just have a short four lane section with a lane gain from the services, which then has a single lane drop to the A194(M) with three lanes for the A1?
That would make sense, if you use the hard shoulder area. As that's bound to remain a bottleneck otherwise.
Back in the 70s / early 80s (and possibly later) I distinctly recall the arrangement at J65 northbound was three lanes for the A1, two lanes for the A194(M). I presume it was hatched down to two lanes so that there could be a lane gain for the A1231 onslip which IIRC was a later addition.
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jackal
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Re: A1 Western bypass widening

Post by jackal » Thu Oct 10, 2019 23:05

Presumably that was with the old-fashioned arrangement where one lane suddenly splits in two, each heading in a different direction?

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Re: A1 Western bypass widening

Post by owen b » Thu Oct 10, 2019 23:31

jackal wrote:
Thu Oct 10, 2019 23:05
Presumably that was with the old-fashioned arrangement where one lane suddenly splits in two, each heading in a different direction?
That's my recollection, yes. From J64 northbound my recollection is that a fourth lane emerged a few hundred metres before the diverge, and the fifth lane (ie. lane three for the A1) no more than 200 metres from the diverge. Certainly the section of five lanes was very short, but it was there. There wasn't the very closely spaced white lining you get where a conventional slip road leaves/joins a main carriageway. The M6/M42 diverge westbound at M6 J3a is quite similar to this day, where a fourth lane suddenly emerges from the middle lane without the usual slip road markings, which surprises me.
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Re: A1 Western bypass widening

Post by Bryn666 » Fri Oct 11, 2019 09:24

The easier solution for marking optional lanes is to do what's done at the M42/M6 Toll split - no stupid ghost islands that cause people to panic swoop across because they don't look far enough ahead to see the second diverge and just a simple widening of the lane before it goes in both directions.

This is how it used to be done on the M5 approaching Almondsbury, it's still done at Chevening complete with special lane allocation sign that is now in the TSRGD so presumably the DfT want to encourage more of this type.
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Re: A1 Western bypass widening

Post by jackal » Wed Jan 08, 2020 13:23

General arrangement plans for Birtley to Coal House:

https://infrastructure.planninginspecto ... 20Plan.pdf

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Re: A1 Western bypass widening

Post by Glenn A » Sun Jan 12, 2020 17:37

Planning for the western by pass began in the early eighties. Back then, Tyne and Wear had one of the lowest levels of car ownership in England, so a D2 was deemed satisfactory and also the original plan called for the demolition of 60 houses, most of which were owner occupied and in good condition. Building a wider western by pass could have meant more demolition of houses in West Denton, again mostly private, and this could have triggered protests by residents. However, since the early eighties, car ownership and the number of vehicles on the road in general has risen continually and the D2 became inadequate ten years after the western by pass was built.

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Re: A1 Western bypass widening

Post by Mark Hewitt » Sun Jan 12, 2020 20:17

Plus don’t forget it wasn’t built as or really intended to be the A1. It was a distributor road going to the Scotswood Bridge.
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Re: A1 Western bypass widening

Post by Glenn A » Sun Jan 12, 2020 20:44

Mark Hewitt wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 20:17
Plus don’t forget it wasn’t built as or really intended to be the A1. It was a distributor road going to the Scotswood Bridge.
I wonder if the original intention was to replace the A69, which was rerouted through Denton and Scotswood in 1976, and where traffic levels had become unbearable by the mid eighties. However, the city council had been wanting a western by pass since 1979 as roads like Silver Lonnen and Stamfordham Rd were busy with airport traffic to add to the rerouted A69.

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Re: A1 Western bypass widening

Post by KeithW » Sun Jan 12, 2020 20:44

Mark Hewitt wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 20:17
Plus don’t forget it wasn’t built as or really intended to be the A1. It was a distributor road going to the Scotswood Bridge.
As I recall the official route of the A1 at that time was along the A194(M)/A194 to the Tyne Tunnel where in went through the single S2 bore before rejoining the old A1 at Seaton Burn.

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Re: A1 Western bypass widening

Post by Mark Hewitt » Sun Jan 12, 2020 20:45

Glenn A wrote:
Mark Hewitt wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 20:17
Plus don’t forget it wasn’t built as or really intended to be the A1. It was a distributor road going to the Scotswood Bridge.
I wonder if the original intention was to replace the A69, which was rerouted through Denton and Scotswood in 1976, and where traffic levels had become unbearable by the mid eighties. However, the city council had been wanting a western by pass since 1979 as roads like Silver Lonnen and Stamfordham Rd were busy with airport traffic to add to the rerouted A69.
Well given the road was called the A69 not long after opening that makes sense.

However the current line of the A1 was development protected so you have to wonder if that was the long term plan?
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Re: A1 Western bypass widening

Post by Glenn A » Sun Jan 12, 2020 20:56

Mark Hewitt wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 20:45
Glenn A wrote:
Mark Hewitt wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 20:17
Plus don’t forget it wasn’t built as or really intended to be the A1. It was a distributor road going to the Scotswood Bridge.
I wonder if the original intention was to replace the A69, which was rerouted through Denton and Scotswood in 1976, and where traffic levels had become unbearable by the mid eighties. However, the city council had been wanting a western by pass since 1979 as roads like Silver Lonnen and Stamfordham Rd were busy with airport traffic to add to the rerouted A69.
Well given the road was called the A69 not long after opening that makes sense.

However the current line of the A1 was development protected so you have to wonder if that was the long term plan?
Part of the western by pass crossed through a wide area of grassland separating two halves of a road called Copperas Lane, which was familiar to dogwalkers and football playing kids in West Denton until it was ripped out for the by pass in 1988. Its sad in a way for the residents as a peaceful suburban road with private houses now is separated by a very noisy D2, but Denton Rd and Silver Lonnen had become too congested by the late eighties.

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Re: A1 Western bypass widening

Post by Truvelo » Sun Jan 12, 2020 21:33

The Scotswood Bridge route that Mark Hewitt mentioned is called A69 (A696) on the original plans from 1982. I wonder if the grade separation either side of the bridge was built to cater for the increased traffic Scotswood Bridge would carry without the A1 bridge that new exists.

I seem to recall seeing early plans for the western bypass with the southern section ending at the A694 junction. Traffic wanting to travel between the two sections of the bypass would have to use Scotswood Bridge. No wonder it was only a year later in 1983 when the plans were altered to provide a dedicated bridge over the Tyne.
How would you like your grade separations, Sir?
Big and complex.

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Re: A1 Western bypass widening

Post by Glenn A » Sun Jan 12, 2020 23:16

Truvelo wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 21:33
The Scotswood Bridge route that Mark Hewitt mentioned is called A69 (A696) on the original plans from 1982. I wonder if the grade separation either side of the bridge was built to cater for the increased traffic Scotswood Bridge would carry without the A1 bridge that new exists.

I seem to recall seeing early plans for the western bypass with the southern section ending at the A694 junction. Traffic wanting to travel between the two sections of the bypass would have to use Scotswood Bridge. No wonder it was only a year later in 1983 when the plans were altered to provide a dedicated bridge over the Tyne.
The Scotswood Bridge was known for structural faults in the seventies and eighties where roadworks were frequent and possibly it wouldn't cope with more traffic. It was decided that a new bridge would be built and the Scotswood Bridge would be mostly intended for traffic using the A695.

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Re: A1 Western bypass widening

Post by jabbaboy » Thu Feb 20, 2020 18:46

It seems construction of Scotswood to North Brunton is going to start early next month and be complete by Autumn 2022 (I think it was might be wrong). There's new signs been put up the past week or so. Haven't seen it mentioned anywhere about construction starting and always thought it was being done after Coalhouse to Birtley.

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Re: A1 Western bypass widening

Post by Paul7755 » Thu Feb 20, 2020 19:17

jabbaboy wrote:
Thu Feb 20, 2020 18:46
It seems construction of Scotswood to North Brunton is going to start early next month and be complete by Autumn 2022 (I think it was might be wrong). There's new signs been put up the past week or so. Haven't seen it mentioned anywhere about construction starting and always thought it was being done after Coalhouse to Birtley.
Highways England site says start Mar 2020 for this, but Birtley to Coal House is still just showing start 2020/21.

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