Google earth county boundaries

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milly
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Google earth county boundaries

Post by milly »

Although I Prefer the traditional counties I would still like to see the modern day ones correctly shown .On my google earth mapping there is no boundary line between Merseyside and Greater Manchester . West Yorkshire and Greater Manchester and West and South Yorkshire. So Liverpool to Doncaster appears to be one large area. Just wondering if there is any way of contacting google earth to tell them of this error. thanks David.
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Re: Google earth county boundaries

Post by Steven »

milly wrote:Although I Prefer the traditional counties I would still like to see the modern day ones correctly shown .On my google earth mapping there is no boundary line between Merseyside and Greater Manchester . West Yorkshire and Greater Manchester and West and South Yorkshire. So Liverpool to Doncaster appears to be one large area. Just wondering if there is any way of contacting google earth to tell them of this error. thanks David.
None of those are administrative areas (and are "former metropolitan counties"), and so aren't marked on OS maps either. It's entirely reasonable that they're not on there.
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Re: Google earth county boundaries

Post by Gareth »

Actually, all four of those counties continue to exist. Counties are for geographic reference, even if the administrative function have long ceased to exist.
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Re: Google earth county boundaries

Post by Chris Bertram »

Gareth wrote:Actually, all four of those counties continue to exist. Counties are for geographic reference, even if the administrative function have long ceased to exist.
And I think they all have police forces and fire services, and are "counties for the purposes of lieutenancy" as well, even if the last is purely ceremonial.
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Re: Google earth county boundaries

Post by milly »

I still do not understand why google earth show Merseyside, Greater Manchester , West Yorkshire and South Yorkshire in green writing on the map but with no indication as to where the area starts and ends.
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Re: Google earth county boundaries

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Gareth wrote:Actually, all four of those counties continue to exist. Counties are for geographic reference, even if the administrative function have long ceased to exist.
I was quoting the Government there with the terminology of "former metropolitan counties". And what OS actually mark on their mapping - so-called "counties for the purposes of lieutenancy" aren't marked at all. Indeed, it's almost impossible to find modern paper mapping that does.
Chris Bertram wrote: And I think they all have police forces and fire services, and are "counties for the purposes of lieutenancy" as well, even if the last is purely ceremonial.
Police forces and fire services are not a county-level function. Unless you're thinking that the likes of West Mercia and Thames Valley (or "Devon and Somerset") are counties, so that's irrelevant.
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Re: Google earth county boundaries

Post by Ruperts Trooper »

Steven wrote:Police forces and fire services are not a county-level function. Unless you're thinking that the likes of West Mercia and Thames Valley (or "Devon and Somerset") are counties, so that's irrelevant.
West Mercia Police (Herefordshire, Worcestershire and Shropshire) covers a very different area to West Midlands Police - Wolverhampton-Coventry with all stops in between, but covering the Old West Midlands County.
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Re: Google earth county boundaries

Post by AndrewGPaul »

The version of Google Maps I'm looking at doesn't show any county boundaries on the basic view, but when I type "Merseyside" or "Greater Manchester" they both show up with a red border and pink shading.
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Re: Google earth county boundaries

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Steven wrote:Police forces and fire services are not a county-level function. Unless you're thinking that the likes of West Mercia and Thames Valley (or "Devon and Somerset") are counties, so that's irrelevant.
Well, actually they are. All the forces in England and Wales are aligned with county boundaries. It's just that some of them cover several counties for reasons of efficiency. The police boards that have oversight of the forces are populated by elected councillors from the counties and unitary areas concerned.

And I'd struggle to think of a fire service that isn't county-based in England. Again, in Wales there are merged services but they still align with county/borough boundaries.
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Re: Google earth county boundaries

Post by Piatkow »

Enter a postal area or local authority name and the boundary will usually show. I don't see boundaries otherwise.

Its a bit eratic. Greater Manchester works but Greater London just gives London without boundaries. On districts and boroughs that I tried Dacorum, Chiltern and Havering all work but Hertsmere just gives the council offices.

For Havering itself you have to type the full name of Havering atte Bower. Looking at Streetview I notice that signage now shows the proper name rather than the former Havering Village.
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Re: Google earth county boundaries

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Chris Bertram wrote:And I'd struggle to think of a fire service that isn't county-based in England.
Devon and Somerset Fire Service.
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Re: Google earth county boundaries

Post by Rob590 »

Google's showing of boundaries is a new-ish feature - I expect it will improve and be refined over time. I've found that they're pretty good at correcting errors - simply pull up the area covered by the map and click report a problem in the bottom right hand corner (screenshot attached).

Police services in England and Wales still match administrative boundaries. Most obviously, Cleveland Police and Cleveland Fire both exist even though the county of Cleveland has been abolished. The same act states that Cleveland police now cover "“The non-metropolitan districts of Hartlepool, Middlesbrough, Redcar and Cleveland and Stockton-on-Tees". I'm not sure what the situation is with fire.
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Re: Google earth county boundaries

Post by Mark Hewitt »

Chris Bertram wrote:
Steven wrote:Police forces and fire services are not a county-level function. Unless you're thinking that the likes of West Mercia and Thames Valley (or "Devon and Somerset") are counties, so that's irrelevant.
Well, actually they are. All the forces in England and Wales are aligned with county boundaries.
Which is why you end up with silly situations where Northumbria and Durham forces have a border in the middle of a housing estate, it would make more sense for Northumbria's remit to stretch into Chester-le-Street and Durham.
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Re: Google earth county boundaries

Post by Chris Bertram »

Steven wrote:
Chris Bertram wrote:And I'd struggle to think of a fire service that isn't county-based in England.
Devon and Somerset Fire Service.
The clue is in the name. Devon and Somerset are both counties. They have a merged service for reasons of efficiency.
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Re: Google earth county boundaries

Post by Chris Bertram »

Mark Hewitt wrote:
Chris Bertram wrote:
Steven wrote:Police forces and fire services are not a county-level function. Unless you're thinking that the likes of West Mercia and Thames Valley (or "Devon and Somerset") are counties, so that's irrelevant.
Well, actually they are. All the forces in England and Wales are aligned with county boundaries.
Which is why you end up with silly situations where Northumbria and Durham forces have a border in the middle of a housing estate, it would make more sense for Northumbria's remit to stretch into Chester-le-Street and Durham.
Or the border just needs to be rationalised, as boundaries have been many times in the past. Seriously, boundaries are usually where they are for historical reasons, and circumstances often overtake the logic for their placement, but they have to be somewhere. There's an area near Kings Norton where the Birmingham boundary with Worcestershire cuts through an estate, and therefore so does the West Midlands and West Mercia force boundary. Maybe it'll be tidied up one day.
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Re: Google earth county boundaries

Post by Ruperts Trooper »

Chris Bertram wrote:Or the border just needs to be rationalised, as boundaries have been many times in the past. Seriously, boundaries are usually where they are for historical reasons, and circumstances often overtake the logic for their placement, but they have to be somewhere. There's an area near Kings Norton where the Birmingham boundary with Worcestershire cuts through an estate, and therefore so does the West Midlands and West Mercia force boundary. Maybe it'll be tidied up one day.
People don't like being "tidied up" - one of my favourite pub haunts in Upper Teesdale proudly proclaims that it's the most northerly pub in Yorkshire and flys the North Riding flag despite the fact that the south side of the Tees valley was "moved" in County Durham in 1974.

The boundary used to be the River Tees but it's "convenient" now to avoid splitting river valleys.
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Re: Google earth county boundaries

Post by M5Lenzar »

Steven wrote:
Chris Bertram wrote:And I'd struggle to think of a fire service that isn't county-based in England.
Devon and Somerset Fire Service.
Which I imagine doesn't cover the parts of Somerset around Bath and Bristol?
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Re: Google earth county boundaries

Post by Chris Bertram »

M5Lenzar wrote:
Steven wrote:Devon and Somerset Fire Service.
Which I imagine doesn't cover the parts of Somerset around Bath and Bristol?
Which are not part of post-1974 Somerset - they were in Avon, whose Fire and Rescue Service still continues.
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Re: Google earth county boundaries

Post by si404 »

These Police Forces don't cover an integer number of Lieutenancy areas.
  • Cleveland Police - covers parts of Co Durham and N Yorks Lieutenancy areas
  • North Yorkshire Police - covers most of North Yorkshire Lieutenancy area
  • Durham Police - covers most of Durham Lieutenancy area
  • Avon and Somerset Police - covers Somerset and Bristol Lieutenancy areas, and part of Gloucestershire Lieutenancy area
  • Gloucestershire Police - covers most of Gloucestershire Lieutenancy area
  • Humberside Police - covers E Riding of Yorks Lieutenancy area, and part of Lincolnshire Lieutenancy area
  • Lincolnshire Police - covers most of Lincolnshire Lieutenancy area
And of course, the Met was only snapped to Greater London's boundaries when the regional authority was created - parts of GL were other forces, parts of other counties were the Met (I think it was mostly Herts where the boundary didn't align properly).

As for fire:
  • Cleveland (parts of Co Durham, N Yorks)
  • Durham (most of Co Durham)
  • North Yorkshire (most of N Yorks)
  • Humberside (E Yorks, part of Lincs)
  • Lincolnshire (most of Lincs)
  • Avon (Bristol, parts of Somerset and Gloucestershire)
  • Devon and Somerset (Devon, and most of Somerset)
  • Gloucestershire (most of Gloucs)
As for administrative bodies, Stockton-on-Tees is partially in Co Durham for Lieutenancy purposes, and partially in North Yorkshire. The two 'ceremonial counties' don't have an integer number of councils in them.
Chris Bertram wrote:Which are not part of post-1974 Somerset
Bath (and Weston, and surrounding places) are part of post-96 Somerset, just not the administrative body. Bristol is its own ceremonial county, but only that area covered by the LA. The rest of Avon is in Gloucestershire.
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Re: Google earth county boundaries

Post by Chris Bertram »

si404 wrote:These Police Forces don't cover an integer number of Lieutenancy areas.
  • Cleveland Police - covers parts of Co Durham and N Yorks Lieutenancy areas
  • North Yorkshire Police - covers most of North Yorkshire Lieutenancy area
  • Durham Police - covers most of Durham Lieutenancy area
  • Avon and Somerset Police - covers Somerset and Bristol Lieutenancy areas, and part of Gloucestershire Lieutenancy area
  • Gloucestershire Police - covers most of Gloucestershire Lieutenancy area
  • Humberside Police - covers E Riding of Yorks Lieutenancy area, and part of Lincolnshire Lieutenancy area
  • Lincolnshire Police - covers most of Lincolnshire Lieutenancy area
And of course, the Met was only snapped to Greater London's boundaries when the regional authority was created - parts of GL were other forces, parts of other counties were the Met (I think it was mostly Herts where the boundary didn't align properly).

As for fire:
  • Cleveland (parts of Co Durham, N Yorks)
  • Durham (most of Co Durham)
  • North Yorkshire (most of N Yorks)
  • Humberside (E Yorks, part of Lincs)
  • Lincolnshire (most of Lincs)
  • Avon (Bristol, parts of Somerset and Gloucestershire)
  • Devon and Somerset (Devon, and most of Somerset)
  • Gloucestershire (most of Gloucs)
As for administrative bodies, Stockton-on-Tees is partially in Co Durham for Lieutenancy purposes, and partially in North Yorkshire. The two 'ceremonial counties' don't have an integer number of councils in them.
Chris Bertram wrote:Which are not part of post-1974 Somerset
Bath (and Weston, and surrounding places) are part of post-96 Somerset, just not the administrative body. Bristol is its own ceremonial county, but only that area covered by the LA. The rest of Avon is in Gloucestershire.
Point is, they're all aligned to 1974 counties, or groupings of them. There were changes made to police and fire service areas then (Met Police excepted), which brought them into line with the new counties, and there has been little change in police and fire service administration since, save for the changes in committee membership at each subsequent LG change - e.g. West Midlands police committee was a subcommittee of the county council, and is now a joint board of the seven district councils instead.

The change to the Met boundaries happened when the Home Office, which had up to then always had direct control of the Met, handed that responsibity over to the new GLA (it was always a sore point with the GLC that it didn't have policing as its own responsibility). It then no longer made sense to have them policing fringe areas of Herts, Bucks, Surrey or wherever. City of London Police, of course, remains separate, but then the City of London is a law unto itself in many other ways too.
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