M181

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SuperAddick
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M181

Post by SuperAddick » Thu Feb 12, 2015 20:34

Can anybody help me on two issues of interest please regarding the M181:

Firstly - where there ever any plans to extend the motorway north or south of the current end points? If not then it seems a fairly pointless piece of road.

Secondly - is it true that the M181 is to be cut down to half its present size and they are building a roundabout in the middle of it to cater for new houses and some lake developments?

Thank you.
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clanford
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Re: M181

Post by clanford » Thu Feb 12, 2015 21:52

As far as I know the M181 was only designed as it stands today to allow traffic to enter Scunny from the west via the A18. The trumpet with the M180 has no provision for a southern extension. There is nowhere to extend to anway as the A15 to Lincoln comes off the next junction along.
The proposed roundabout is for the Lincolnshire lakes development. If it goes go ahead the M181 would become a really pathetic motorway split about half way along. A sad end to a great little spur if it happens

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Chris5156
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Re: M181

Post by Chris5156 » Fri Feb 13, 2015 07:08

SuperAddick wrote:Firstly - where there ever any plans to extend the motorway north or south of the current end points? If not then it seems a fairly pointless piece of road.
No, I don't believe it was ever supposed to be any longer than it is.

It may be a short spur, and it's certainly unusual in having it its own number when most motorway spurs of a similar length don't, but it's not remotely pointless. It provides access from the M180 to the west and north of Scunthorpe, which is a very useful purpose.

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jgharston
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Re: M181

Post by jgharston » Sun Feb 15, 2015 10:14

Realistically, it would have to become derestricted and become something like the A1077.

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Patrick Harper
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Re: M181

Post by Patrick Harper » Sun Feb 15, 2015 21:13

They could always add sliproads to one of the bridges and then build an access from that road. Would probably be less disruptive.
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M4 Cardiff
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Re: M181

Post by M4 Cardiff » Sun Feb 15, 2015 22:12

Aaah, but TPTB can't pass up an opportunity to slow things down by installing a roundabout or lights. Free-flow is sooo 1970's. :cheek: Can't have drivers thinking for themselves, can we?

The southern stump of the M181 looks long enough to just remain a motorway in its own right, rather than being relegated to sliproads under motorway regulations, like M4 J7 or M6 J15, but the north will be 'detrunked' so I assume no longer motorway.

Given the proximity of the new roundabout to the trumpet, I would not be surprised that the remnants of the M181 will probably attract a 50 limit, as will the detrunked section to the north. At least the hard shoulders could be converted to bus lanes if needed, without cutting capacity.
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wrinkly
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Re: M181

Post by wrinkly » Fri Jul 29, 2016 17:01

The roundabout on the M181 is to go ahead.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/mult ... ed-by-2028

It doesn't say what the M181 north of the roundabout will become. (Edit: presumably it will become A1077.)
Last edited by wrinkly on Fri Jul 29, 2016 17:25, edited 1 time in total.

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Chris5156
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Re: M181

Post by Chris5156 » Fri Jul 29, 2016 17:06

wrinkly wrote:The roundabout on the M181 is to go ahead.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/mult ... ed-by-2028

It doesn't say what the M181 north of the roundbout will become.
There's some very euphemistic use of the word "improve" in that press release! I'm not sure I'd describe a motorway being halved in length as a motorway being improved... :laugh:

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Truvelo
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Re: M181

Post by Truvelo » Fri Jul 29, 2016 17:24

If the proposed junction had been planned in the 70s it would have been grade separated enabling the M181 to remain a motorway throughout. There would also be an opportunity to number the junction as J1 with the current terminus as J2.
How would you like your grade separations, Sir?
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Bryn666
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Re: M181

Post by Bryn666 » Fri Jul 29, 2016 17:39

Indeed, only in the UK would reducing the length of a motorway with a roundabout be hailed as an improvement.

Losing the will to live with HE spin.
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wrinkly
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Re: M181

Post by wrinkly » Fri Jul 29, 2016 17:40

Truvelo wrote:If the proposed junction had been planned in the 70s it would have been grade separated enabling the M181 to remain a motorway throughout. There would also be an opportunity to number the junction as J1 with the current terminus as J2.
I'm not convinced of that. There's no particular reason why the M181 needs to be or remain a motorway. It was probably only made a motorway because its junction with the M180 is a trumpet. Though offhand I can't think of any cases where either a new flat roundabout or a new GSJ was built on a comparable spur in the past.

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jackal
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Re: M181

Post by jackal » Fri Jul 29, 2016 17:45

Truvelo wrote:If the proposed junction had been planned with any common sense it would have been grade separated
FTFY :)

As suggested above, the B1450 bridge could have been used as part of a folded-diamond or dumbbell interchange with slips to the North, extending weaving space to the M180 junction. The bridge is quite generously provisioned - you could probably get three narrow lanes across here if necessary. I doubt this would have been much if any more expensive than building a roundabout on the A181 mainline, with all the associated disruption and traffic management.

With this and the awful waste of money proposed at M6 J19 the idea of HE as valiant defenders of the strategic network is truly dead :(

Yorkshirelad
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Re: M181

Post by Yorkshirelad » Wed Aug 30, 2017 17:31

Latest on the demise of the M181 here: http://www.scunthorpetelegraph.co.uk/ne ... ext-381108

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Chris5156
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Re: M181

Post by Chris5156 » Wed Aug 30, 2017 19:28

Yorkshirelad wrote:Latest on the demise of the M181 here: http://www.scunthorpetelegraph.co.uk/ne ... ext-381108
"improvements" :roll:

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Chris Bertram
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Re: M181

Post by Chris Bertram » Thu Aug 31, 2017 09:04

Chris5156 wrote:
Yorkshirelad wrote:Latest on the demise of the M181 here: http://www.scunthorpetelegraph.co.uk/ne ... ext-381108
"improvements" :roll:
Weasel wording at its finest. "Alterations", certainly, not necessarily for the better.
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Bryn666
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Re: M181

Post by Bryn666 » Thu Aug 31, 2017 09:28

On the plus side it's another mile of maintenance off HE ledgers.

I think their aim is to have a trunk road network of less than 1000 miles some days.
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Re: M181

Post by iansergeant » Sat Sep 02, 2017 13:24

A number of points here, for those who don't know the area.

1) The Scunthorpe Telegraph ("Comic Cuts" to my family) recently reported a rare hawk moth to be present in North Lincolnshire - it's actually quite common. My point here is that stories from here with no reliable source backing them should not be trusted.

2) The point of the roundabout is twofold - as an access point to the planned Scunthorpe United ground and Lincolnshire Lakes housing developments, and for local traffic to access south Scunthorpe. I haven't seen traffic estimates, but I suspect that the traffic will be split roughly equally at the new junction simply because Scunthorpe town centre - which is where the A18/A1029 at the end of the M181 head - is at the north of Scunthorpe and Bottesford.

3) One of the two developers of Lincolnshire Lakes went into financial difficulties and withdrew. Given that the road was (largely?) to be funded by the developers, any increase in costs could make the whole project fail.

4) There was optimism from within North Lincolnshire council that you could build the stadium without the new roundabout. Given this would take heavy construction traffic along the unclassified Scotter Road from the A18/A1029 roundabout (Berkeley Circle) I just don't see it as practical.

So, assuming the story is true, I welcome it, as the road needs to be built to relieve congestion at Berkeley Circle, and to kick start the new stadium and Lincolnshire Lakes projects.

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Re: M181

Post by XC70 » Sat Sep 02, 2017 21:58

As someone who works in Scunthorpe I understand your points Ian. However, surely the important point is that this could be built as a grade separated junction utilising the existing overbridge. This would have all the same benefits as you describe including relieving Scotter road and Berkeley Circle.

Instead it is another nail in the coffin of grade separation when an existing free flowing road is being downgraded to an at grade road.

I am looking forward to a year of roadworks on my way to work but at least HE are not proposing to close the entire road whilst they do they work - not after they got their fingers burned last time they tried that stunt.....

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Re: M181

Post by Truvelo » Sat Sep 02, 2017 22:13

Looks like there's two roundabouts planned for the M181 :@

http://nlincs-consult.limehouse.co.uk/p ... 5303816732
How would you like your grade separations, Sir?
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Re: M181

Post by Jamesabout29 » Sat Sep 02, 2017 22:50

I wonder if this will see the M181 number dropped and the remaining section relegated to a spur of the M180? Sad if so. :(
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