Upgrading the A66 and A69

The study of British and Irish roads - their construction, numbering, history, mapping, past and future official roads proposals and general roads musings.

There is a separate forum for Street Furniture (traffic lights, street lights, road signs etc).

Registered users get access to other forums including discussions about other forms of transport, driving, fantasy roads and wishlists, and roads quizzes.

Moderator: Site Management Team

Post Reply
User avatar
jervi
Member
Posts: 1594
Joined: Thu Aug 17, 2017 16:29
Location: West Sussex

Re: Upgrading the A66 and A69

Post by jervi »

Some Alternative options are being assessed from the preferred route at Kirkby Thore and Warcop
https://highwaysengland.co.uk/our-work/ ... ment-work/
Glenn A
Member
Posts: 9751
Joined: Fri Apr 15, 2005 19:31
Location: Cumbria

Re: Upgrading the A66 and A69

Post by Glenn A »

A serious accident at Low Row on the A69 causing massive delays. This section of road with its 40 mph speed limit, bends and houses needs to be replaced. A by pass is quite easy to build to the east of the current road( the other side has the railway).
Glenn A
Member
Posts: 9751
Joined: Fri Apr 15, 2005 19:31
Location: Cumbria

Re: Upgrading the A66 and A69

Post by Glenn A »

Drove from Scotch Corner to Penrith today on the A66, and the dualling is needed more than ever. For no reason I could discern, the road was jammed with traffic at the western end of the Temple Sowerby pass to the start of the D2 near Penrith and was I was stationary for ten minutes. On the other side of the S2, a tractor was reducing the average speed to about 10 mph. Then there is the nasty section of S2 at Warcop with the bends and the cottage jutting out on the eastbound carriageway, which surely one day could be demolished by an HGV.
User avatar
Mark Hewitt
Member
Posts: 31389
Joined: Fri Dec 17, 2004 12:54
Location: Chester-le-Street

Re: Upgrading the A66 and A69

Post by Mark Hewitt »

Glenn A wrote:Drove from Scotch Corner to Penrith today on the A66, and the dualling is needed more than ever. For no reason I could discern, the road was jammed with traffic at the western end of the Temple Sowerby pass to the start of the D2 near Penrith and was I was stationary for ten minutes. On the other side of the S2, a tractor was reducing the average speed to about 10 mph. Then there is the nasty section of S2 at Warcop with the bends and the cottage jutting out on the eastbound carriageway, which surely one day could be demolished by an HGV.
I still remember that this was one of the roads identified for dualling in the early 2000s, along with dualling the A1 to Alnwick that had the plug pulled in 2006 by the Labour government. The A66 trans pennine should have been fully dualled for more than a decade.
Micro The Maniac
Member
Posts: 1167
Joined: Thu Jun 25, 2015 13:14
Location: Gone

Re: Upgrading the A66 and A69

Post by Micro The Maniac »

Given there are local access roads parallel to the upgrade (or existing carriageways retained), is there any reason this could not be A66(M) ?
User avatar
Mark Hewitt
Member
Posts: 31389
Joined: Fri Dec 17, 2004 12:54
Location: Chester-le-Street

Re: Upgrading the A66 and A69

Post by Mark Hewitt »

Micro The Maniac wrote:Given there are local access roads parallel to the upgrade (or existing carriageways retained), is there any reason this could not be A66(M) ?
The days of making short bypass roads motorway is no longer with us. If it was then we would have seen the likes of Haddington to Dunbar would be A1(M) not A1.
User avatar
Gav
Member
Posts: 1964
Joined: Sat Oct 22, 2005 17:44

Re: Upgrading the A66 and A69

Post by Gav »

there is an old geographa AtoZ atlas scan aboutt hat shows that very section of road under construction as a motorway.... in and around Macmerry I believe it was just an error as they had seen the special road status and assumed that it was a motorway, or maybe even it was originally going to be a motorway
User avatar
KeithW
Member
Posts: 19181
Joined: Thu Dec 04, 2014 13:25
Location: Marton-In-Cleveland North Yorks

Re: Upgrading the A66 and A69

Post by KeithW »

Micro The Maniac wrote: Tue Jul 06, 2021 07:14 Given there are local access roads parallel to the upgrade (or existing carriageways retained), is there any reason this could not be A66(M) ?
There are not many sections that fit that test and most of those that do carry agricultural traffic as well as NMU's. Take a look at the Stainmore section for example. This road was dualled online and has lots of properties with direct access to the road as has the Bowes Moor section.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/Sta ... authuser=0


Here is another classic junction at West Gilling
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@54.45365 ... authuser=0

This is rather like the old A1, an existing road that go a number of D2 bypasses with the bits in between dualled online. The other factor in the case of the A66 is that most of the bypasses and existing D2 upgrades were built before the A1 was upgraded to A1(M).
Glenn A
Member
Posts: 9751
Joined: Fri Apr 15, 2005 19:31
Location: Cumbria

Re: Upgrading the A66 and A69

Post by Glenn A »

KeithW wrote: Tue Jul 06, 2021 15:23
Micro The Maniac wrote: Tue Jul 06, 2021 07:14 Given there are local access roads parallel to the upgrade (or existing carriageways retained), is there any reason this could not be A66(M) ?
There are not many sections that fit that test and most of those that do carry agricultural traffic as well as NMU's. Take a look at the Stainmore section for example. This road was dualled online and has lots of properties with direct access to the road as has the Bowes Moor section.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/Sta ... authuser=0


Here is another classic junction at West Gilling
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@54.45365 ... authuser=0

This is rather like the old A1, an existing road that go a number of D2 bypasses with the bits in between dualled online. The other factor in the case of the A66 is that most of the bypasses and existing D2 upgrades were built before the A1 was upgraded to A1(M).
The section of the A66 over Stainmore is the only road that can be used by the properties and farms along the route and demolishing them would have led to large compensation payments and possible resistance by the farmers, who have no other livelihood than their livestock. ( The terrain is unsuitable for crop growing).
M19
Member
Posts: 2248
Joined: Mon Dec 24, 2001 05:00
Location: Rothwell, Northants

Re: Upgrading the A66 and A69

Post by M19 »

Glenn A wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 20:30 Drove from Scotch Corner to Penrith today on the A66, and the dualling is needed more than ever. For no reason I could discern, the road was jammed with traffic at the western end of the Temple Sowerby pass to the start of the D2 near Penrith and was I was stationary for ten minutes. On the other side of the S2, a tractor was reducing the average speed to about 10 mph. Then there is the nasty section of S2 at Warcop with the bends and the cottage jutting out on the eastbound carriageway, which surely one day could be demolished by an HGV.
I used the A66 on Tuesday. Roadworks closing a lane on the south bound offslip of the M6 at J40 caused two miles of traffic queuing waiting to get off the motorway. I did plan to come off at J41 and come through Penrith, but I thought better of it and continued down to J38 and took the A685 which benefits from a HGV ban. My ETA to Teesside on the Satnav only slipped by five minutes and heading that way was a novelty with the bonus of missing the S2 sections west of Brough.
M19
User avatar
Mark Hewitt
Member
Posts: 31389
Joined: Fri Dec 17, 2004 12:54
Location: Chester-le-Street

Re: Upgrading the A66 and A69

Post by Mark Hewitt »

M19 wrote:
Glenn A wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 20:30 Drove from Scotch Corner to Penrith today on the A66, and the dualling is needed more than ever. For no reason I could discern, the road was jammed with traffic at the western end of the Temple Sowerby pass to the start of the D2 near Penrith and was I was stationary for ten minutes. On the other side of the S2, a tractor was reducing the average speed to about 10 mph. Then there is the nasty section of S2 at Warcop with the bends and the cottage jutting out on the eastbound carriageway, which surely one day could be demolished by an HGV.
I used the A66 on Tuesday. Roadworks closing a lane on the south bound offslip of the M6 at J40 caused two miles of traffic queuing waiting to get off the motorway. I did plan to come off at J41 and come through Penrith, but I thought better of it and continued down to J38 and took the A685 which benefits from a HGV ban. My ETA to Teesside on the Satnav only slipped by five minutes and heading that way was a novelty with the bonus of missing the S2 sections west of Brough.
Oh really. I'm planning to head to The Lakes - Keswick area in three weeks time. Was going to use A1(M) - A66 if that's still a good idea.
M19
Member
Posts: 2248
Joined: Mon Dec 24, 2001 05:00
Location: Rothwell, Northants

Re: Upgrading the A66 and A69

Post by M19 »

For me the problem was on the M6 rather than the A66. Much of the dualled section between Stainmore and Bowes is subject to a 40mph contraflow bit wasn’t an issue traffic wise.
M19
User avatar
KeithW
Member
Posts: 19181
Joined: Thu Dec 04, 2014 13:25
Location: Marton-In-Cleveland North Yorks

Re: Upgrading the A66 and A69

Post by KeithW »

Mark Hewitt wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 07:37
Oh really. I'm planning to head to The Lakes - Keswick area in three weeks time. Was going to use A1(M) - A66 if that's still a good idea.
The problem in summer is that traffic from the roundabout junction causes queues back along the single lane slip. Part of the plans for the upgrade involves widening the slip so traffic can for the A592, A66E and A66W van separate earlier. Ideally providing an express lane to the A66E, at really bus times you can also get long queues for the Kemplay Bank Roundabout which is to be grade separated,

Heading west there is rarely a serious problem at Penrith.

One alternative eastbound route I have used in the past is to take the A689 to Alston and the B2677 through Teesdale and Barnard Castle to the A66 at Rokeby Park. It takes about 30 minutes longer but its a nice drive and there are attractions such as High Force along the way if you are not in a hurry.
User avatar
Helvellyn
Member
Posts: 24619
Joined: Tue Apr 04, 2006 22:31
Location: High Peak

Re: Upgrading the A66 and A69

Post by Helvellyn »

Mark Hewitt wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 07:37
M19 wrote:
Glenn A wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 20:30 Drove from Scotch Corner to Penrith today on the A66, and the dualling is needed more than ever. For no reason I could discern, the road was jammed with traffic at the western end of the Temple Sowerby pass to the start of the D2 near Penrith and was I was stationary for ten minutes. On the other side of the S2, a tractor was reducing the average speed to about 10 mph. Then there is the nasty section of S2 at Warcop with the bends and the cottage jutting out on the eastbound carriageway, which surely one day could be demolished by an HGV.
I used the A66 on Tuesday. Roadworks closing a lane on the south bound offslip of the M6 at J40 caused two miles of traffic queuing waiting to get off the motorway. I did plan to come off at J41 and come through Penrith, but I thought better of it and continued down to J38 and took the A685 which benefits from a HGV ban. My ETA to Teesside on the Satnav only slipped by five minutes and heading that way was a novelty with the bonus of missing the S2 sections west of Brough.
Oh really. I'm planning to head to The Lakes - Keswick area in three weeks time. Was going to use A1(M) - A66 if that's still a good idea.
If you're not in that much of a hurry and want a good drive then Weardale and Hartside's (A686 and A689) worthwhile and not really out of your way. If the M6 J40's snarled up in all directions you can always pick your way through Penrith instead.
Glenn A
Member
Posts: 9751
Joined: Fri Apr 15, 2005 19:31
Location: Cumbria

Re: Upgrading the A66 and A69

Post by Glenn A »

Helvellyn wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 11:59
Mark Hewitt wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 07:37
M19 wrote:
I used the A66 on Tuesday. Roadworks closing a lane on the south bound offslip of the M6 at J40 caused two miles of traffic queuing waiting to get off the motorway. I did plan to come off at J41 and come through Penrith, but I thought better of it and continued down to J38 and took the A685 which benefits from a HGV ban. My ETA to Teesside on the Satnav only slipped by five minutes and heading that way was a novelty with the bonus of missing the S2 sections west of Brough.
Oh really. I'm planning to head to The Lakes - Keswick area in three weeks time. Was going to use A1(M) - A66 if that's still a good idea.
If you're not in that much of a hurry and want a good drive then Weardale and Hartside's (A686 and A689) worthwhile and not really out of your way. If the M6 J40's snarled up in all directions you can always pick your way through Penrith instead.
I drove from Whitehaven to Hexham that way on Wednesday. It is a spectacular drive for the scenery and the hairpin bends, but for a novice, it can be daunting and is not recommended in the dark. Also the old cafe at Hartside has not been replaced. :cry:
User avatar
Helvellyn
Member
Posts: 24619
Joined: Tue Apr 04, 2006 22:31
Location: High Peak

Re: Upgrading the A66 and A69

Post by Helvellyn »

Glenn A wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 13:20 I drove from Whitehaven to Hexham that way on Wednesday. It is a spectacular drive for the scenery and the hairpin bends, but for a novice, it can be daunting and is not recommended in the dark. Also the old cafe at Hartside has not been replaced. :cry:
Still nothing there? No-one interested or planning wrangles? The latter wouldn't surprise me (seems to be free reign to build rubbish all over the place except where no-one would mind).
Glenn A
Member
Posts: 9751
Joined: Fri Apr 15, 2005 19:31
Location: Cumbria

Re: Upgrading the A66 and A69

Post by Glenn A »

Helvellyn wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 18:10
Glenn A wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 13:20 I drove from Whitehaven to Hexham that way on Wednesday. It is a spectacular drive for the scenery and the hairpin bends, but for a novice, it can be daunting and is not recommended in the dark. Also the old cafe at Hartside has not been replaced. :cry:
Still nothing there? No-one interested or planning wrangles? The latter wouldn't surprise me (seems to be free reign to build rubbish all over the place except where no-one would mind).
Sad to say some scorched earth and a few tables outside are all that remains. I know the cafe would do very little in winter, but in summer with the cyclists, bikers and tourists, it could do really well.
User avatar
Ruperts Trooper
Member
Posts: 12026
Joined: Sun Jun 17, 2012 13:43
Location: Huntingdonshire originally, but now Staffordshire

Re: Upgrading the A66 and A69

Post by Ruperts Trooper »

Glenn A wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 18:28
Helvellyn wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 18:10
Glenn A wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 13:20 I drove from Whitehaven to Hexham that way on Wednesday. It is a spectacular drive for the scenery and the hairpin bends, but for a novice, it can be daunting and is not recommended in the dark. Also the old cafe at Hartside has not been replaced. :cry:
Still nothing there? No-one interested or planning wrangles? The latter wouldn't surprise me (seems to be free reign to build rubbish all over the place except where no-one would mind).
Sad to say some scorched earth and a few tables outside are all that remains. I know the cafe would do very little in winter, but in summer with the cyclists, bikers and tourists, it could do really well.
The last two summers haven't been the right time to invest money in rebuilding it - be nice to see one in place for next summer.
Lifelong motorhead
User avatar
Mark Hewitt
Member
Posts: 31389
Joined: Fri Dec 17, 2004 12:54
Location: Chester-le-Street

Re: Upgrading the A66 and A69

Post by Mark Hewitt »

Helvellyn wrote:
Mark Hewitt wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 07:37
M19 wrote: I used the A66 on Tuesday. Roadworks closing a lane on the south bound offslip of the M6 at J40 caused two miles of traffic queuing waiting to get off the motorway. I did plan to come off at J41 and come through Penrith, but I thought better of it and continued down to J38 and took the A685 which benefits from a HGV ban. My ETA to Teesside on the Satnav only slipped by five minutes and heading that way was a novelty with the bonus of missing the S2 sections west of Brough.
Oh really. I'm planning to head to The Lakes - Keswick area in three weeks time. Was going to use A1(M) - A66 if that's still a good idea.
If you're not in that much of a hurry and want a good drive then Weardale and Hartside's (A686 and A689) worthwhile and not really out of your way. If the M6 J40's snarled up in all directions you can always pick your way through Penrith instead.
Done just that many times in the past. On this occasion we only have the day, including driving there and staying over one night. So looking to get there as quick as we can.
User avatar
owen b
Member
Posts: 9851
Joined: Sun Mar 16, 2003 15:22
Location: Luton

Re: Upgrading the A66 and A69

Post by owen b »

Heading south back to Luton in normal traffic conditions it's marginally quicker for me to stay on the M6 than turn off at J40 and head across to Scotch Corner, but I keep an eye on Google Maps for live traffic updates. On the odd occasion that it recommends turning off (because of problems further south on the M6) there's invariably a long queue backing up onto the motorway from the southbound off slip, which puts me off diverting onto the A66.
Owen
Post Reply