A428 Black Cat - Caxton Gibbet improvement

[Al__S]

There’ve been a lot of moans in some quarters (including from Chris Boardman in his official role as cycling champion in Manchester) that this project eats up the sort of funding he wants for his projects (zebra crossings in every street corner).

It makes you think - not that I don’t believe this project is viable or necessary - just the scale of what would really be needed to provide mass active travel facilities.

And also things embedded in legislation (zebra crossings needing electrical lights in the UK, whereas they don’t in New Zealand).

my main issue with this scheme is that whilst the consultation does look good from the point of view of crossing the new road, as far as I can tell IAN195/16 means that it should have (separate, not on road) cycle provision along the length. In particular not linking Eltisley to St Neots (at least as far as the scheme boundary- and leave Cambs to finish it) and not creating a new crossing of the ECML, Great Ouse and A1 open to non motorised users is an opportunity being missed that as an add-on is relatively inexpensive, but would be hugely expensive as an independent project

[Berk]

Doesn’t leaving the old road count towards that?? It will still be open for all forms to traffic.

[KeithW]

my main issue with this scheme is that whilst the consultation does look good from the point of view of crossing the new road, as far as I can tell IAN195/16 means that it should have (separate, not on road) cycle provision along the length. In particular not linking Eltisley to St Neots (at least as far as the scheme boundary- and leave Cambs to finish it) and not creating a new crossing of the ECML, Great Ouse and A1 open to non motorised users is an opportunity being missed that as an add-on is relatively inexpensive, but would be hugely expensive as an independent project

The existing road will remain as a LAR and will carry far less traffic than it currently does. The new A428 will almost certainly end up being part of the East West Expressway and to be honest I cannot imagine any part of it that I would want to cycle along. In any event HE have addressed the issues at all the junctions and overall in this publication. which includes a number of new paths.

https://highwaysengland.citizenspace.co ... 20maps.pdf

This specifically addresses the Eltiseley to St Neots section

1 We are maintaining access to bridleway 74/6 via a new route.
The bridleway will be diverted under the new dual carriageway via an
underpass to the west of its existing route.

2 At Eltisley, we will provide a new
combined cycleway/footway at road level
and over the new St Ives Road bridge

[Al__S]

The old A428 will remain as a fast rat run of a road, not suitable as a cycleway. The new road won't be available for cycling (this I have no issue with)

[KeithW]

The old A428 will remain as a fast rat run of a road, not suitable as a cycleway. The new road won't be available for cycling (this I have no issue with)

I really don't see many people using the old A428 as a rat run as it will be slower and no shorter ! There will be some commuters from St Neots on it but they will mostly come down the Cambridge Road (B1428) or the Potton Road (B1046) and join the new A428 at the junctions provided . While there may be some traffic from the southbound A1 I would expect most of that will be using the new A14. If anything the rat run for traffic from the A1 at Alconbury has always been the A1198 to Godmanchester and once the viaduct is demolished most of that will disappear. There is very little sign of rat running on the old A428 from Caxton Gibbet to Madingley. The old A428 was part of my daily commute from Eltiseley to Cambridge for 20 years and I know darned well I wouldnt use the old road in preference to the new ! The one thing I would not describe the old road as is fast !

In fact if I was cycling from St Neots to Cambridge my route of choice would be the B1046 St Neots road to Abbotsley and Great Gransden and then take the Caxton Road to Cambourne via the Crow Dene Bridleway.

[Bryn666]

It would not be beyond the wit of man to provide a new cycle corridor along a modified old road.

However given this country still thinks cycling is just for leisure on a Sunday instead of a means of travel in its own right we will still ensure that only car traffic growth is catered for and then wonder why shiny new road isn't wide enough.

[Berk]

Out of curiosity, what sort of distance is a cycle travel to work radius expected to be, versus a car one?? Would you reasonably expect a cyclist to travel 15/20 miles by bike, if the appropriate provision was there??

I’m starting to believe that, whilst there is an argument for appropriate provision (gritted teeth etc), the argument needs to move on more and focus on how far you expect cyclists to travel.

It’s the medium-distance car journeys that are the killer, not just the short ones. Remove those, and you could cut car traffic significantly.

We’d just transfer the CO2 emissions to heating and hot water, and erecting public showers at the destination.

[Jeni]

Out of curiosity, what sort of distance is a cycle travel to work radius expected to be, versus a car one?? Would you reasonably expect a cyclist to travel 15/20 miles by bike, of the appropriate provision was there??

I’m starting to believe that, whilst there is an argument appropriate provision (gritted teeth etc), the argument needs to move on more and focus on how far you expect cyclists to travel.

It’s the medium-distance car journeys that are the killer, not just the short ones. Remove those, and you could cut car traffic significantly.

We’d just transfer the CO2 emissions to heating and hot water, and erecting public showers at the destination.

15/20 miles you'd be looking at the dedicated cyclists only really - what's where strong public transport links need to take over where possible

[Herned]

We’d just transfer the CO2 emissions to heating and hot water, and erecting public showers at the destination.

A five minute electric shower will use about 1kWh of electricity. Right now the UK electricity supply is producing 0.152 kg of CO2 per kWh. Which is less than my car for a single km.

[roadtester]

We’d just transfer the CO2 emissions to heating and hot water, and erecting public showers at the destination.

A five minute electric shower will use about 1kWh of electricity. Right now the UK electricity supply is producing 0.152 kg of CO2 per kWh. Which is less than my car for a single km.

Although that's about 4-8 km in an electric car.

[trickstat]

Out of curiosity, what sort of distance is a cycle travel to work radius expected to be, versus a car one?? Would you reasonably expect a cyclist to travel 15/20 miles by bike, of the appropriate provision was there??

I’m starting to believe that, whilst there is an argument appropriate provision (gritted teeth etc), the argument needs to move on more and focus on how far you expect cyclists to travel.

It’s the medium-distance car journeys that are the killer, not just the short ones. Remove those, and you could cut car traffic significantly.

We’d just transfer the CO2 emissions to heating and hot water, and erecting public showers at the destination.

15/20 miles you'd be looking at the dedicated cyclists only really - what's where strong public transport links need to take over where possible

Around 1990 I had a colleague who commuted by bike from Luton to Stevenage. I don't know which route he used, but Google suggests the shortest route via country lanes is 13 miles while using the A505 and A602 via Hitchin is about 14.5. The latter option includes a substantial climb and descent over Offley Hill while the 'country' route would be undulating. Despite being a regular smoker, this guy was pretty fit. In fact, we used to do a run after football training and he was always first back.

I catch the train to work about 7 miles from where I live. Although it is less hilly than Luton to Stevenage as someone who hasn't ridden for a long time I think I would want to half that distance before I seriously considered cycling as an option.

[B1040]

When the weather is dry, my favoured way of doing the last few miles into central Cambridge is to park at the Longstanton P&R and then cycle.
7 miles each way. Good exercise. I'm not sure I'd want to go much further though.

[Debaser]

Out of curiosity, what sort of distance is a cycle travel to work radius expected to be, versus a car one?? Would you reasonably expect a cyclist to travel 15/20 miles by bike, if the appropriate provision was there??

Usually journeys of approximately 7.5km/5m are quoted as being easily replaceable by bike. However, with the rise in popularity of e-bikes 10 or 15m may become the standard in discussions.

[Bryn666]

Yes between 5-10 miles is possible. More if using an assisted bike.

The majority of urban car trips are under this figure so the medium trips is a red herring.

[Alderpoint]

Out of curiosity, what sort of distance is a cycle travel to work radius expected to be, versus a car one?? Would you reasonably expect a cyclist to travel 15/20 miles by bike, if the appropriate provision was there??

A friend of mine used to commute by bike Redditch to central Birmingham - a distance of about 14 miles each way in the days when no-one had ever heard the phrase "appropriate provision". The door-to-door journey took him about the same time as driving in by car or taking the train. He was *very* fit.

[Berk]

But for people like me (driving 20 miles/day), you need to start building those (light) rail facilities.

And councils above all need to stop wheedling on about funding or lack of. That’s what 106 money should be spent on. Not providing nice flower beds or replacing the market place (again).

It’s beyond time for better public transport revision to be made.

[B1040]

The guy in the Audi R8 usually takes the same time as me (on my bike) to get from Histon to the centre of Cambridge in the mornings.

[Al__S]

anyway, it turns out (from someone who went to an event) that they're determined to ignore their own IAN195/16 and the crossing of the A1198 to the north of the Caxton Gibbet junction will remain a single stage at grade crossing with no signals, so basically the rest of the Eltisley-Cambourne (about three miles) path is a waste of time and money (though even that will have no separation, being just a footway with a kerb)

[KeithW]

anyway, it turns out (from someone who went to an event) that they're determined to ignore their own IAN195/16 and the crossing of the A1198 to the north of the Caxton Gibbet junction will remain a single stage at grade crossing with no signals, so basically the rest of the Eltisley-Cambourne (about three miles) path is a waste of time and money (though even that will have no separation, being just a footway with a kerb)

Have you actually read it ?

The reason I ask is that in section 2.1.1 it clearly states the following

2. Cycle Traffic
2.1. Cycle Traffic and the Strategic Road Network
2.1.1. Designing networks for Cycle Traffic
The development of cycle networks shall be in accordance with Highways
England’s Cycling Strategy. Where Non-Motorised Users (NMU) are prohibited
from the Strategic Road Network, out of corridor cycle routes may be created as
part of the legal process of creation of new highway, or through the adoption or
conversion of rights of way, such as disused railway lines, with the potential to link
to national cycle routes. Highways England and designers shall plan to acquire
land to create the space to accommodate cycle traffic as part of new scheme
designs (see Section 1.3) or when enhancing cycling provision for existing routes
with NMU prohibitions.

Where all-purpose trunk roads are upgraded with new routes being provided, the
original route corridor and adjoining local road network can provide a suitable
opportunity for compensatory cycle route provision. In such instances, designers
shall liaise with the appropriate local highway authority responsible for the original
route once reclassified.

Given that the old A428 is indeed still available it is surely down to the local highway authority which is Cambridgeshire County Council to make the decisions on how the old route should be configured. I suggest you raise the matter with them. They worked quite closely with HE on such matters on the A14 upgrade. As an ex resident of South Cambs I am sure that the District council has opinions on the matter as well. At the end of the day it is the local highway authority that is responsible for the long term support of the new LAR.

If you have not already done so I suggest you register with the Cyclescape system run by the Cambridge Cycling Campaign who were quite active with regard to the initial dualling of the A428 from Cambridge to Caxon Gibbet.
https://www.camcycle.org.uk/newsletters ... cle16.html

I would also urge you to respond to the HE Consultation Page which closes on 26 July if you have not yet done so.
https://highwaysengland.co.uk/a428-blac ... bet-about/

As to the statement that the the rest of the Eltisley-Cambourne (about three miles) path is a waste of time and money is unfounded, there are other users as well as cyclists and I note that between Cambourne and Hardwick shared use of the old St Neots road seems to have worked out. Last but not least anything that does away with very dangerous flat junctions at Eltisley has to be an improvement for all road users, it was so dangerous I would go out of my way to avoild turning east onto the A428 here.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@52.22195 ... 6656?hl=en

This report will tell you why that is
https://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/a ... s-13336431

[Micro The Maniac]

15/20 miles you'd be looking at the dedicated cyclists only really - what's where strong public transport links need to take over where possible

Such multi-model travel (bike + bus/train) is practically impossible though. You cannot take a bike on a bus, and South Western Railways won't (with few exceptions) let you take a bike on their trains - unless it's one of those fold-up bikes, which (having previously owned one) is not suitable for any sort of distance.