M6 J16 - J19 Smart Motorway

[Jeni]

For the benefit of those who haven't been that way recently - I'm making videos again!

[jusme]

For the benefit of those who haven't been that way recently - I'm making videos again!

Nice

More progress - Saturday the signs were all lit 17-18, 50 southbound with lane 1 coned off, but 60 northbound with 4 lanes. NSL both ways next week I hope!

16-17 section is still missing some signage, and lots of digging in some places, but could be close.

Speed cameras now getting installed. Interesting that they started at the south end, but now they've reached the live part 18-19. Doubt they're active yet, but not going to test them

No orange paint on the ERAs yet.

Also (finally!) spotted one of those cute little matrix signs lit up last night, N/B 3 miles south of J19, showing "Road works in 1 mile", with the standard pictogram in red and white:

road-works.jpg (11.46 KiB) Viewed 2375 times

Quite pretty, though of course there weren't any to be seen, so either testing or broken.

[fras]

Well Jen seemed to be really batting along !

[mikehindsonevans]

Came north this afternoon in the rain. J13 north was holding 49 mph, up to 60mph under MS4control from j17 then derestricted from j18 northwards.

About time too.

Further south, the whole run north from. J13 is under traffic management. Last time I was in a contraflow must have been the 1990s.

[Big L]

There is still a little gap in the works - 2 miles or so - between 13 and 14.

Yesterday morning was 4 lanes and 70mph from 17 northwards. It could do with a NSL sign at the end of the works northbound, rather than an end of roadworks/start of variable limits sign. A large proportion on folk carried on ambling at 50, though maybe they would have done so even with a sign (grumble grumble unobservant drivers grumble grumble).

[jusme]

4 lanes VSL(60) N/B 16-17 last night with all the signs lit up ... nearly there!

Worryingly there has been massive congestion S/B where the 4 lane section ends at J17 the last couple of weeks, hope this is just because it's 4x70 into 3x50, and won't be a regular feature at J16 when it's all finished.

And elsewhere it looks like the last bit of NSL between 13 and 15 will be gone after next weekend

[Big L]

4 lanes VSL(60) N/B 16-17 last night with all the signs lit up ... nearly there!

Worryingly there has been massive congestion S/B where the 4 lane section ends at J17 the last couple of weeks, hope this is just because it's 4x70 into 3x50, and won't be a regular feature at J16 when it's all finished.

And elsewhere it looks like the last bit of NSL between 13 and 15 will be gone after next weekend

Southbound still has a lane coned off, but the 50 limit is now on the new electronic signs rather than pieces of metal.

[Bryn666]

4 lanes VSL(60) N/B 16-17 last night with all the signs lit up ... nearly there!

Worryingly there has been massive congestion S/B where the 4 lane section ends at J17 the last couple of weeks, hope this is just because it's 4x70 into 3x50, and won't be a regular feature at J16 when it's all finished.

And elsewhere it looks like the last bit of NSL between 13 and 15 will be gone after next weekend

J17 isn't a natural place for a lane drop hence the congestion.

J16 sees a lot more traffic leave the M6 so the issue you raise should not be a problem there.

[odlum]

What's the overall opinion on "smart" sections of motorway? I think they look good. Do people mind the absence of a hard shoulder?

Generally in favor?

[fras]

Not me. Too dangerous if you have to stop. The emergency laybys are too far apart. There will always be a finite time, probably several minutes, before the controllers can block the lane of the breakdown. Then the traffic has to obey the lane closure ! WIth a hard shoulder you get onto it and whilst you should get out of the car, you are reasonably safe.

The real problem is when a breakdown occurs without any problem. My experience is that two lanes are closed to allow recovery vehicles a margin of safety. So at a stroke, the motorway has gone from 4 lanes to 2 lanes and huge congestion is the result. The plain fact is that cost has driven these so-called Smart motorways. It would have been better all round if the hard shoulder had been retained, with the exceptions of overbridges. Yes, more cost, but much more safety and less congestion when incidents occur.

[mikehindsonevans]

No. Generally too flaming dangerous, removing the safety net of the traditional hard shoulder, where accident survivors and breakdown victims can wait.

Additionally, with HA/HE/Plod now routinely closing TWO lanes at incidents (ironically to "protect the scene and involved persons"), I agree with my wife's assessment of these schemes as "dumb motorways"

Of course, just my opinion but - you DID ask.

[Big L]

We're not having this discussion again are we?

[fras]

We're not having this discussion again are we?

Looks like it, so better for me to pipe down !

[Bryn666]

I've not had the pleasure of using it at a busy period yet. Won't do either on Wednesday when I take the train to Birmingham.

[brummie_rob]

The first big test will be Easter getaway when it usually queues. I noticed the last few Fridays that the A500 is flowing much better in the afternoon as people would use it to avoid the queues prior to the J16 speed restrictions.

[Truvelo]

I have noticed the afternoon queues southbound between J19-18 have disappeared since the fourth lane became operational. I no longer have to ratrun via Middlewich or Holmes Chapel.

[A303Chris]

According to this announcement from Highways England for Part 1 Limited Land Compensation Act 1973 (as amended), the scheme was fully opened to the public on March 20th. So all open, and to celebrate this the HE will be closing J13 to J14 from 8pm Saturday until sometime Sunday. You win some, you lose some.

[A303Chris]

It was all fully open yesterday according to this HE press release

Interesting snippet from it was this "Statistics from the first week of operation of the stretch between Middlewich and Knutsford (junctions 18 to 19) show that traffic was flowing at around 70mph for 22 hours each day, with the new variable speed limits also helping to keep the motorway congestion-free during peak times."

I thought this had been open since January, so why only refer to one week of data.

[mikehindsonevans]

It was all fully open yesterday according to this HE press release

Interesting snippet from it was this "Statistics from the first week of operation of the stretch between Middlewich and Knutsford (junctions 18 to 19) show that traffic was flowing at around 70mph for 22 hours each day, with the new variable speed limits also helping to keep the motorway congestion-free during peak times."

I thought this had been open since January, so why only refer to one week of data.

The stats period MAY have been driven (sorry!) by the lifting of limits from the stretch further south.

BTW, M6j18 becomes OUR "home" junction on Saturday, so we are delighted to be witnessing the end of the smartification of the mid-Cheshire M6. Cannot find the emoji for "smug face"!!

Meanwhile, the M27 near the current home in Hampshire is becoming a bad joke.

[fras]

I did the Jn 19-17 stretch last weekend and found it gave a very smooth ride, and very little noise in the car. I suppose this is due to using SMA (or a similar variant). There was no lower limit posted, but I did see the gantry past Jn 17 had a limit displayed.

Experience with SMA in the UK has been very poor, even though this surfacing technology came from Germany where all the roads are like billiard tables. How it will fare with the enormous traffic levels on this stretch only time will tell. The emergency refuges are not very frequent and we already know that when a vehicle blocks Lane 1, then Lanes 1 & 2 are both closed off. Personally, I think a Smart Motorway is totally the wrong solution for this particular stretch, it should have been a full widening.

I also noted not very many vehicles in Lane 1, most people sticking to Lanes 2-4, even HGVs. It seems to me there is now a psychological barrier to using Lane 1, as that is where most of the stopped vehicles will be.