A96 Dualling: Inverness to Nairn

[Mikehannah]

And your point is?

[Duncan macknight]

And your point is?

Very rarely is it Half an hour based on facts and figures....

[Mikehannah]

First off my figure is based on real experience not someone looking at charts from England.
Secondly it has been several years since I have traveled through Nairn/Elgin at rush hour as I time my quarterly trips to Aberdeen to avoid it.
However you are entitled to your opinion regarding the merits of two roads that have an abysmal safety record,
The case for upgrading is not just Traffic based, it is also safety and economic based.

[HandShandy]

I appreciate this is on the verge of an argument here but this is a classic A96 situation.

Sometimes it's great and you can make good progress but at other times it really can be very slow.

Achieving dual carriageway from Inverness to Nairn that incorporates a bypass of the latter will allow for a consistent journey time. Safety aspects aside, it will just generally make a more pleasant driving experience along that part of the route.

I'm not sure about others here but with the A9 and the A96, I often drive along them with great anxiety about getting stuck behind something that you then can't get past or restricts the pace in which you want to travel. Even when I'm flowing freely with nothing infront of me, I just know that around that next bend a tractor, HGV or a Honda Jazz might suddenly spawn and you are down to 40mph or less.

Another argument for the dualling of the route in general is predictions for growth in population and economic activity along the entire corridor. While I agree the traffic volumes at the moment do not necessarily require end to end dualling, will single carriageway still be adequate in 10-20-30 years time? Lessons learned in the past which have failed to "predict and provide" have resulted in congestion and subsequently costly and disruptive upgrades down the line.

To summarise my angle = Just get it built, and properly. That way it's done and you don't end up with something that has to be sorted out again a few decades down the line. All this fussing over current AADTs and cost/benefit analysis just ends up building a case for consultants to waste money and people to form objections in time for the government to change it's policy and nothing gets built.

[Mikehannah]

Agreed!!!

[B9127]

I would consider the Inverness to Nairn including the Nairn Bypass is positive need - - Elgin would be the next Bypass with an immediate need

[cb a1]

First off my figure is based on real experience not someone looking at charts from England.
Secondly it has been several years since I have traveled through Nairn/Elgin at rush hour as I time my quarterly trips to Aberdeen to avoid it.
However you are entitled to your opinion regarding the merits of two roads that have an abysmal safety record,
The case for upgrading is not just Traffic based, it is also safety and economic based.

Your figure is based on real experience, but it's years since you've travelled through Nairn / Elgin. Interesting paradox.

The data is from the A96, it's not from England. There isn't an A96 in England. It's in Scotland

[Mikehannah]

Not contradictory in any way, I travel down the A96 at least four times a year. Only an idiot continues to make the trip when he knows he is running into a period with the highest traffic density if he can avoid it.

However I have travelled down the A96 enough times. when I had no choice when I made the trip.

And my point at someone looking at charts in England meaning when did you last drive on the A96. How much real experience do you have other than looking at statistics?

But if proving you are right makes you happy, fill yer boots ( as they say in Glasgow)

[haggishunter]

There is a bypass of Nairn and Elgin for end to end A96 trips, it's called the A939! A vastly more pleasurable drive and my go to choice if the A96 means passing through Nairn, Elgin or Keith at busy times.

Would be interested on methodology for the stats on journey time through Nairn - was it done by a manual census of traffic at some point? IE like how Transport Scotland have conveniently done surveys of the A82 in Fort William in early spring and late autumn!

[Mikehannah]

I would agree with you on A939.
Very enjoyable drive on a nice day and I am not in a hurry.

[cb a1]

Not contradictory in any way, I travel down the A96 at least four times a year. Only an idiot continues to make the trip when he knows he is running into a period with the highest traffic density if he can avoid it.

However I have travelled down the A96 enough times. when I had no choice when I made the trip.

And my point at someone looking at charts in England meaning when did you last drive on the A96. How much real experience do you have other than looking at statistics?

But if proving you are right makes you happy, fill yer boots ( as they say in Glasgow)

Always fascinates me how uncurious some people are.

I merely provided evidence and yet you choose to play the man rather than the ball.

I'm curious why you think I'm based in England. Is it the username? I did live in London once, but that was last century. I then moved to the other end of the A1, but that was well over a decade ago before I moved yet further north.

Anyhow, you have your anecdata, but I'll just stick with actual data thanks.

As for when I last drove the full length of the A96, that would be when we last came out of lockdown and I was once again permitted to leave my local authority so visited friends in The Sneck.

[cb a1]

Would be interested on methodology for the stats on journey time through Nairn - was it done by a manual census of traffic at some point?

Journey Time data extracted from here - https://inrix.com/products/roadway-analytics/

[Graham]

There is a bypass of Nairn and Elgin for end to end A96 trips, it's called the A939!

I agreee that the A939 is a magnificent driving road, but I would point out that it does not actually bypass Nairn....

Are you using the B9090/B9091 to avoid the centre of Nairn? I don't know these roads so hve no idea how good they are. If they are any good, they presumably provide an unofficial Nairn bypass for traffic on the A96!

[haggishunter]

There is a bypass of Nairn and Elgin for end to end A96 trips, it's called the A939!

I agreee that the A939 is a magnificent driving road, but I would point out that it does not actually bypass Nairn....

Are you using the B9090/B9091 to avoid the centre of Nairn? I don't know these roads so hve no idea how good they are. If they are any good, they presumably provide an unofficial Nairn bypass for traffic on the A96!

Up from Culloden Battlefield through Cawdor out to either the A939 or on to Auldearn and the A96 avoids Nairn, but for end to end via A939 would use the A9 and A938 from Carrbridge. Does in part depend where in Aberdeen you are going to or coming from and the Lang Stracht no longer provides the fast escape from the city it once did, but avoiding the Haudagain usually still pays dividends at busy times !

[SteelCamel]

Are you using the B9090/B9091 to avoid the centre of Nairn? I don't know these roads so hve no idea how good they are. If they are any good, they presumably provide an unofficial Nairn bypass for traffic on the A96!

It's not a bad route going B9006/B9091/B9090/B9101/A939. The B9091 drops you right in the middle of Nairn, so you need to turn off at Clephanton and go through Cawdor to avoid Nairn. The B9006/B9091 and B9090/B9101 junctions are TOTSOs where you don't turn, so it's a pretty straight run and there have been a lot of improvements - bends removed between Clephanton and Croy, and the new White Bridge.

[Mikehannah]

Cba1
You wrote
“I'm curious why you think I'm based in England. Is it the username? I did live in London once, but that was last century. I then moved to the other end of the A1, but that was well over a decade ago before I moved yet further north.”
Looking at your posting history you posted your favourite “ lock down walk was in the Luton area” or did I misunderstand ?
On the suggestion of “ Owen B” I looked at the post where you refer to Luton and it would appear I had made a mistake , you had incorporated a post in your from a person from Luton. This was not clear until I reviewed the actual post , instead of the posting summary.

You provide statistics I have my real life experience. Because of the real life experience I avoid Nairn/Elgin like the plague at certain times . It was pretty clear what I meant yet in your previous post you said
“Your figure is based on real experience, but it's years since you've travelled through Nairn / Elgin. Interesting paradox”
Interesting use of paradox? It is a reasonable assumption for me to assume what was true five years ago when I made the journey monthly , is still true ( pre lockdown)now. So not sure where the paradox ( an absurd or contradictory proposition) comes from.

Given the information of where you enjoy your “ lockdown” walk it is a reasonable question to ask when you last actually drove down the A96. I do not think asking a simple question of your actual experience of the road is “ playing the man”
However if you do, that is not my intention , therefore I apologise .

[owen b]

Cba1
You wrote
“I'm curious why you think I'm based in England. Is it the username? I did live in London once, but that was last century. I then moved to the other end of the A1, but that was well over a decade ago before I moved yet further north.”
Looking at your posting history you posted your favourite “ lock down walk was in the Luton area” or did I misunderstand ?

I'm trying to help here. I'm in Luton and my lockdown walk is in Luton. There have been threads where cb a1 and I have responded to each other's posts. There is an oddity about the SABRE post history in that I have occasionally looked up what I thought was someone's post only to find that it contains within it an unattributed quote of someone else's post. So I'm supposing that you've seen something I've posted, and the way the post history is laid out has led you to believe it's cb a1's post.

[Mikehannah]

Hi Owen
I took your advice and investigated further. It would seem I have been caught out by CBA1 replying to someone who lives in Luton area and had included part of this person’s post in his.

[owen b]

Hi Owen
I took your advice and investigated further. It would seem I have been caught out by CBA1 replying to someone who lives in Luton area and had included part of this person’s post in his.

Yes, almost certainly me .

[cb a1]

Was going to say I've never been to Luton in my life, but I was once at London Luton airport.