A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

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Chris5156
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Re: A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

Post by Chris5156 »

Berk wrote: Mon May 20, 2019 23:38
Chris Bertram wrote: Mon May 20, 2019 10:23There is one gap, between A168 and A61. It was deemed unnecessary to provide one as access to settlements just off the motorway was adequately provided for by other routes.
That decision completely undermines the point of providing an LAR. Just because those villages are fine, what about if they want to drive up to another village, or further up the B-roads towards Ripon.

Pointless. :x
Hmm.

If you want to drive, you can use the A1(M). If you want to go to another village there are roads to all the villages. If you want to go to Ripon from either J49 or 50, the A1(M) and the missing LAR are irrelevant because you'd be travelling west, not north or south.

Can you find an example of a journey that would actually be inconvenienced by the lack of a local access road between J49 and 50?
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Re: A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

Post by DavidBrown »

Chris5156 wrote: Tue May 21, 2019 11:50 Can you find an example of a journey that would actually be inconvenienced by the lack of a local access road between J49 and 50?
If we're really clutching at straws here, you could argue that Rainton - A1 north would have been slightly easier then the extra 2 minutes they instead have to spend going across to the A61. But that is really being pedantic, and definitely doesn't justify the existence of an LAR there - we just have to get used to it looking a little odd on a map, that's all.

But, back on topic, the A303 here is a completely different kettle of fish, with 10 or so local lanes and tracks, plus more private properties to take into account. The old road is ready made to be the LAR. It should be a doddle of a scheme to design and cater for all needs but apparently not. :@
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Re: A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

Post by KeithW »

Berk wrote: Sun May 19, 2019 21:12 That decision completely undermines the point of providing an
LAR. Just because those villages are fine, what about if they want to drive up to another village, or further up the B-roads towards Ripon.

Pointless. :x
The reality that the one and only local road between J49 and J50 runs east west from Rainton to the A61 and crosses the A1(M) on a flyover.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@54.16469 ... 6656?hl=en
Its a lot more usable now than it was when it was a flat junction. Take a look at the GSV and tell me which you would rather use.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@54.16512 ... 6656?hl=en

Church lane always ended on the A1 (Leeming Lane if you go back far enough) and there is nothing to access from it anyway except farm fields.

As for getting to Ripon its unchanged.
From J49 you use the Dishforth Road
From Rainton the new overbridge on Sleights Lane makes that route usable again
From J50 you use the A61.

There is no LAR because there is nothing to access that needs it and in fact a road (Sleights Lane) that was unusable due to 4 lanes of speeding traffic and a flat junction is now accessible again.
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Re: A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

Post by Richardf »

While this upgrade will be a big improvement on the current situation, and the sooner it is built the better, i still feel the design could be better. What would have wrong with leaving the current road intact as local access and connecting it to the new road at either end with GSJ's? Would be easier in the future to give expressway status to this section with a continuous LAR as well as good local connectivity.

This scheme once again represents the inconsistency of road improvment in this country. While elsewhere we can have gold plated schemes with junctions and LARs aplenty, then we have basic schemes like this where the absolute minimum is done to upgrade the road to modern standards!
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Re: A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

Post by A303Chris »

Contract to construct scheme been awarded to Galliford Try, due to start March 2020. HE must be confident of getting planning consent then.
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c2R
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Re: A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

Post by c2R »

Interestingly, the BBC News website says this:
Somerset residents will find out just before Christmas whether part of the A303 in Somerset will be upgraded to a dual carriageway.

Highways England, which is responsible for England’s motorways and major A-roads, put forward proposals to widen the single-carriageway stretch between the Podimore and Sparkford roundabouts.

Following a series of public hearings earlier in the year, the Planning Inspectorate has now submitted its findings to the government.

The transport secretary will now have around three months to make a final decision – which will be publicly announced on 12 December.

A series of public hearings were held in February and May to discuss the plans for the new dual carriageway, which largely follows the route of the existing road between Podimore and Sparkford.

These two sets of hearings formed part of the ‘examination phase’ for the plans, which formally concluded on 12 June.

Planning inspector Lesley Coffey has now submitted her final report to transport secretary Grant Shapps MP, summarising the evidence and giving her final recommendation on whether the project should proceed.

Her report will not be made public until after the final decision has been made, according to Highways England South West.

If the government gives the green light, construction of the new road could begin in 2020, with the cost being estimated at between £100m and £250m.
I can't link to it, as it is on their "England Live Reporting" page, which doesn't appear to allow articles to be linked, perhaps they're just transitory?
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Re: A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

Post by JonB2028 »

£135m...

Showing my age, but my first road job as a summer student, the Sparkford Bypass built by Davies Middleton Davies had a value less than a tenth of that, £5m rings a bell (but I may well be wrong). (OK so the £135m I guess is not just the construction cost?)
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Re: A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

Post by Herned »

The National Audit Office reported the cost as £170m https://www.nao.org.uk/report/south-wes ... -tunnel/#"

Does that mean the planning, consultation and design cost £35m? (£7m/km)
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Re: A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

Post by RichardA35 »

JonB2028 wrote: Mon Sep 23, 2019 21:59 £135m...

Showing my age, but my first road job as a summer student, the Sparkford Bypass built by Davies Middleton Davies had a value less than a tenth of that, £5m rings a bell (but I may well be wrong). (OK so the £135m I guess is not just the construction cost?)
Consultant pay scales have gone through the roof possibly?
Is it a scheme budget with construction estimate + land/utilities/supervision/design/risk/optimism bias/inflation/kitchen sink all thrown in?
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Re: A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

Post by Debaser »

RichardA35 wrote: Tue Sep 24, 2019 14:04 Consultant pay scales have gone through the roof possibly?
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!

...Oh, you were being serious? Nope, still 'doing more, with less', etc., etc. So still in the 8% to 12% bracket they always have been.
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Re: A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

Post by RichardA35 »

Debaser wrote: Tue Sep 24, 2019 14:32
RichardA35 wrote: Tue Sep 24, 2019 14:04 Consultant pay scales have gone through the roof possibly?
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!

...Oh, you were being serious? Nope, still 'doing more, with less', etc., etc. So still in the 8% to 12% bracket they always have been.
Just like in contracting then? I've being doing less for more each year for ages now...
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Re: A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

Post by A320Driver »

Original date for the SoS to make his decision was 12/12/19, date of the election. Now postponed into the new parliament, date TBA.

Also it seems that the SoS has asked for clarification on a few items, no idea if this is customary or whether there are doubts brewing already?

https://infrastructure.planninginspecto ... -dualling/
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Re: A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

Post by Vierwielen »

A320Driver wrote: Thu Nov 21, 2019 21:21 Original date for the SoS to make his decision was 12/12/19, date of the election. Now postponed into the new parliament, date TBA.

Also it seems that the SoS has asked for clarification on a few items, no idea if this is customary or whether there are doubts brewing already?

https://infrastructure.planninginspecto ... -dualling/
Have any of the local candidates said anything yet?
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Re: A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

Post by Berk »

I don’t think too much should be read into the (then) SoS’s request for comments.

It is still a valid part of the process, and they appear to be only minor details, rather than calling the whole scheme into question. The Leeming-Barton scheme had similar issues and were all fully resolved.

I do wonder why it’s focusing on anti-social behaviour issues once the old A303 is detrunked though.
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Re: A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

Post by Herned »

Berk wrote: Sun Nov 24, 2019 21:52 I do wonder why it’s focusing on anti-social behaviour issues once the old A303 is detrunked though.
The submission it's referring to says that dead ends are attractive to the travelling community, and doesn't want to be lumbered with the costs of chucking them out
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Re: A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

Post by Herned »

This seems to have vanished into some sort of administrative limbo, the SoS decision was due on 12 December but postponed because of the election. And it's nearly 3 months later and nothing has been mentioned, not even an updated timescale for a decision
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Re: A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

Post by SteveA30 »

Perhaps the March 11 budget will provide an answer. There is supposed to be a Big Spend on infrastructure coming up, hopefully not entirely in the north.
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Re: A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

Post by RichardA35 »

SteveA30 wrote: Mon Feb 24, 2020 10:00 Perhaps the March 11 budget will provide an answer. There is supposed to be a Big Spend on infrastructure coming up, hopefully not entirely in the north.
The contractor is headhunting/advertising for staff so must have been given some comfort :wink: ...
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Re: A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

Post by A320Driver »

Decision by SoS now deferred until 17th July, along with Stonehenge.

Several other infrastructure schemes have been delayed, hard to tell whether it is procedural due to Covid related issues, or whether they can be afforded.

My suspicion is that they will both get approved and advance to construction, particularly as a contract has been awarded for Sparkford, or they both get canned. If the latter, it’s game over for the A303 for a generation probably.

This is actually the first official update on this scheme since its original deadline of 12th December.
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Re: A303 Sparkford to Ilchester

Post by Debaser »

A320Driver wrote: Wed Apr 29, 2020 19:10 Decision by SoS now deferred until 17th July, along with Stonehenge.

Several other infrastructure schemes have been delayed, hard to tell whether it is procedural due to Covid related issues, or whether they can be afforded.

My suspicion is that they will both get approved and advance to construction, particularly as a contract has been awarded for Sparkford, or they both get canned. If the latter, it’s game over for the A303 for a generation probably.

This is actually the first official update on this scheme since its original deadline of 12th December.
If this section of the A303 is canned then Highways England have just wasted a great deal of money on detailed design. I don't think the contractor will be particularly happy either as they are paying the bills.
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