A358 Taunton to Southfields

[Richardf]

Think I prefer the last option. Less offline and I like the link up to the existing J25 with limited access new J25a. Prefered option disadvantages N-S traffic to an from the M5.

Disapointing that in all options there is no new connection to the Ilminster bypass avoiding the roundabout. I suppose that might come if/when the bypass gets dualled.

[Herned]

Nice to see sense prevailing. How the decision was made to only go with one option is very strange. Highways England and Somerset County Council have a current scheme to improve J25 of the M5 which includes building the first few metres of the new dual carriageway!

Also the original proposal for a new roundabout junction for new development made no sense, as it is not in either the borough or the county development plans, it seems very odd that HE just decided that was a good idea, there must have been some guidance on that somewhere. Also HE have denied that the junction would have any links to local roads, and yet it would be inconceivable that there would be significant development without any link to Taunton...

Option 8 seems most sensible, from memory option 2 was quite a bit more expensive. I can't see any option without a link to J25 being approved, especially given the cost difference being so little

[Richardf]

Apart from the route between West Hatch and the motorway being a different route I can't see much difference between the second and third options shown earlier.

[TimM3-A55]

I still believe upgrading the A303 route through the Blackdowns is still the best. Devon CC is planning a single carriageway upgrade so why not dual it and send traffic the direct way.

I don't think the ilminster to honiton (a303/a30) road across the blackdown hills would have enough traffic to warrant a d/c and it's through rolling coutryside so the costs would be astronomic.

The ilminster (a303) to taunton (m5) a358 road is already a busy transport corridor and often comes to a standstill at busy periods so makes more sense to spend money on that route.

If the A358 is busy because it takes M5 traffic heading to or from Exeter (and beyond) then it makes sense to upgrade the direct route, won't this result in more traffic using the route therefore justifying the upgrade? If that isn't the case then there seems little point in the free flow slips-roads to/from the M5 south.
I get that the A358 is the busier of the two route and seems the better choice for upgrading, but upgrading one route and claiming it to be a fix for both is just a bodge. Out of interest has any traffic surveys or similar been done to show traffic using the A358 does continue south on the M5 and isn't heading north or into Taunton, neither of those options are going to be served well if that's the case.

The latest proposed upgrade for the part of the Blackdowns route was frustrating, a nearly fully offline upgrade that was S2+1 instead of D2. If an extensive offline upgrade is being coincided it should be D2 so at least it will be ready should the rest of the route ever be upgraded.

[jackal]

Also the original proposal for a new roundabout junction for new development made no sense, as it is not in either the borough or the county development plans, it seems very odd that HE just decided that was a good idea, there must have been some guidance on that somewhere.

It's not unheard of for councils to hang HE out to dry for an 'inadequate consultation' when it's precisely what they asked for...

[Herned]

If the A358 is busy because it takes M5 traffic heading to or from Exeter

The less obvious point about the A358 is that it is not just east-west traffic but it is also a significant north-south route. As far east as Weymouth it is the suggested route north via the M5 so that movement needs to be catered for

[tompatt]

This has been announced with some fanfare more than a couple of times.

I'd never even considered the A358 to be an East/west thoroughfare. Id always assumed it was a link from North Devon/West Somerset to the A303 with Exeter bound traffic braving the blackdown hills. Presumably a new road between Honiton and Southfields isn't on the cards?

Taunton is a little short changed in this as you would still need to drive through Henlade which is congested at the best of times. This doesn't really work for me, it looks like a massive fudge which will lit ately please no one.

[jackal]

Presumably a new road between Honiton and Southfields isn't on the cards?

No but there are plans for a new road between Honiton and the A30/A303 junction. There's a separate thread for that.

Taunton is a little short changed in this as you would still need to drive through Henlade which is congested at the best of times. This doesn't really work for me, it looks like a massive fudge which will lit ately please no one.

All the shortlisted options bypass Henlade for Taunton traffic. For the consulted option you would go along the bypass, then north onto the M5, before turning left to get to Taunton.

[tompatt]

Presumably a new road between Honiton and Southfields isn't on the cards?

No but there are plans for a new road between Honiton and the A30/A303 junction. There's a separate thread for that.

Taunton is a little short changed in this as you would still need to drive through Henlade which is congested at the best of times. This doesn't really work for me, it looks like a massive fudge which will lit ately please no one.

All the shortlisted options bypass Henlade for Taunton traffic. For the consulted option you would go along the bypass, then north onto the M5, before turning left to get to Taunton.

I get this but Taunton traffic is still going a couple of miles south of Taunton back up the M5 and then still using the A358/A38 to get into town it's not straightforward. Therefore I can see a significant amount of traffic still using the Original route route through Henlade and onto Taunton.

As for the A358 being a part of the South West corridor, it just isn't. Good news that the A30 is going to be improved up to YaRcombe though

[Richardf]

The trouble with the A30/303 improvements is that it is only the Devon section which isn't that bad. It will require the Somerset section improved as well to see any benefit.

[tompatt]

A quick google suggests locals agree with me

http://www.somersetcountygazette.co.uk/ ... _you_think_/

Taunton bound traffic will still filter off into Henlade whilst the new road will be underused because it doesn't actually go anywhere. It certainly won't be used by traffic heading Exeter bound.

The obvious solution would be to bypass Henlade and enlarge junction 25.

However speaking personally and this suits me perfectly Coming from M5 junction 27.

[jackal]

Well yes, it seems unpopular, hence the consultation rerun. At least they seem to have learnt from the Chichester fiasco.

Here's the thread on the A30 Honiton to Devonshire House scheme: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=36344

[Richardf]

Does anyone know why it's apparently cheaper to build an offline route to a new junction instead of improving online, bypassing Henlade and plugging into an existing junction?

[ais523]

Offline is nearly always cheaper because you don't have all those vehicles in your way while you're trying to do the construction. Except in the case of parallel dualling, it's often hard to reuse much of the existing road structure anyway.

[jackal]

The main determinant is the amount of structural content. The consultation option (8 NFS) and the most offline option (1NFS) are cheapest despite being longest, because they have one less GSJ (no direct connection to J25) and the bridge(s) with the M25 are at right angles rather than skewed.

Traffic management and disruption are also relevant, but as all options are offline at the western end of the scheme this is less of a discriminator.

[TimM3-A55]

If the A358 is busy because it takes M5 traffic heading to or from Exeter

The less obvious point about the A358 is that it is not just east-west traffic but it is also a significant north-south route. As far east as Weymouth it is the suggested route north via the M5 so that movement needs to be catered for

To me that seems obvious but the preferred option caters for it very poorly instead trying to make the A358 part of southwest corridor, which as tompatt says it just isn't. The other two shortlisted options at least include a link to the existing junction, a far more important link than the south facing slip roads further south on the M5. Its essay to see why locals are annoyed. I can see the scheme being canned again, and this may keep happening until the HA drops this idea the A358 can replace upgrading the A303/A30 through Blackdowns, even if this upgrade is to a lower stranded.

[Berk]

If the A358 is busy because it takes M5 traffic heading to or from Exeter

The less obvious point about the A358 is that it is not just east-west traffic but it is also a significant north-south route. As far east as Weymouth it is the suggested route north via the M5 so that movement needs to be catered for

To me that seems obvious but the preferred option caters for it very poorly instead trying to make the A358 part of southwest corridor, which as tompatt says it just isn't. The other two shortlisted options at least include a link to the existing junction, a far more important link than the south facing slip roads further south on the M5. Its essay to see why locals are annoyed. I can see the scheme being canned again, and this may keep happening until the HA drops this idea the A358 can replace upgrading the A303/A30 through Blackdowns, even if this upgrade is to a lower stranded.

Yes, I mean it's entirely possible that some people view the N-S movement as being just as, if not more important than E-W. But HE are only getting involved and taking forward this scheme because it has been chosen as an easy way to 'fix the A303' - it was seen as the preferred option as long as 13 years ago.

Someone really should've said to the Government "finish dualling/fixing the A303 first". I actually support the proposal as put forward, but if I was driving to Cornwall I wouldn't use the new road - unless there was an accident on the old one.

[Richardf]

To me the N-S axis is more important than the E-W axis of the route. Living in Dorset there are better ways to travel westwards than going via Taunton, whereas going north to the M5 and Bristol there are limited options and the A358 is by far the best of them.

If the prefered/consulted is built the route will be desirable mainly by being D2, but by prioritising E-W and forcing N-S to either double back or use the old road it will not be as beneficial as it could be.

[Berk]

I would argue there should be room for both. Whether the last few miles of the old road should be upgraded (apart from J25 itself), I'm not sure. I'd imagined the stub of the old road could become part of the A378.

[tompatt]

The other fallacy with this is that, nobody ITK would ever the use the A303 to go from South West to South East anyway. The A303 is a terrible road, long stretches of S2 between Honiton and Amesbury, agricultural traffic and delays around Stonehenge as everyone slows down.