A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

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AAndy
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A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

Post by AAndy »

About 2 years at the most until construction commences ...I hope.

And the mighty Gilwern to Brynmawr construction will be overshadowed by the scale of roadbuilding craft needed here.

A flythrough animation of the completed work has been produced.

https://youtu.be/Zsz3C1B7_KM

https://youtu.be/pUSGjDFojAY

Information from here: http://gov.wales/topics/transport/roads ... 5/?lang=en

Section 5 and 6 - Dowlais Top to Hirwaun
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Last updated 19 September 2017

We are converting the A465 from Dowlais Top to Hirwaun to 2 lanes in each direction.

Summary

Project status: planned
Region: south-east Wales
Start date: end of 2019
End date: 2022
Cost: capital cost of construction approximately £400m (2016 prices)
Advisers: Jacobs (technical advisers), DLA Piper (legal advisers), PWC (financial advisers), Willis (insurance advisers).
What we are doing
Flythrough west to east

Flythrough east to west

We are converting the A465 from Dowlais Top to Hirwaun to 2 lanes in each direction.
Why we are doing it

The existing, A465 was built in the 1960s and is a single three lane carriageway with two lanes in the uphill direction and one in the downhill direction. A regional traffic study in 1990 identified the need to improve this road.

The width of the road restricts traffic flow and opportunities for safe overtaking. In many areas there is poor visibility. Accidents on this stretch are concentrated around junctions and areas with poor visibility.

This improvement to the A465 is critical to the social and economic regeneration of the Heads of the Valleys area. It will improve access to key services, jobs and markets supporting inward investment to areas such as the Ebbw Vale Enterprise Zone.
Current progress

In 1994, the Secretary of State for Wales consulted the public on alternatives for improving the 40km length of the A465 between Abergavenny and Hirwaun. In July 1995 he announced his preferred route, which consisted of widening the existing road to provide a dual two-lane carriageway with some sections off the existing line of the road.

In 1997 a draft Line Order was published. The line Order was then made in June 1999 following a Public Local Inquiry in 1998. The project was divided into 7 sections (later reduced to 6) to enable a phased delivery.

We appointed Jacobs in September 2015 to develop the design, produce an environmental impact assessment of the length between Dowlais Top and Hirwaun and take the scheme through the statutory process and seek the powers to build the road.

We have completed the outline design development and have published new plans. We have reviewed and improved the original design. We have commissioned independent consultants to review environmental, structural, geotechnical, engineering and traffic modelling aspects of the design.

We have also inspected the condition of existing structures on the A465 that we intend to keep as part of the new section of the A465. We have developed the project in enough detail to publish the draft Statutory Orders and Environmental Statement which we published in July 2017. They set out the land considered necessary to construct the project and assess the impact it would have on the surrounding environment.

Copies of these documents are available for inspection, during normal office hours at the following locations:

Orders Branch, Welsh Government, Cathays Park, Cardiff, CF10 3NQ
Dowlais Library, Church Street, Dowlais, CF48 3HS
Hirwaun Library, High Street, Hirwaun, CF44 9SW
Cefn Coed Community Centre, Old Drill Hall Road, Cefn Coed, Merthyr Tydfil, CF48 2NA
Merthyr Tydfil County Borough Council Offices Civic Centre, Castle Street, Merthyr Tydfil, CF47 8AN
Rhondda Cynon Taf County Borough Council Offices, The Pavilions, Cambrian Park, Clydach Vale, Tonypandy, CF40 2XX
Caerphilly County Borough Council offices, Penallta House, Tredomen Park, Ystrad Mynach, Hengoed, CF82 7PG
Brecon Beacons National Park Offices, Plas y Ffynnon, Cambrian Way, Brecon, LD3 7HP.

Timetable

Public exhibitions: December 2015
Publication of draft Orders and environmental statement: July and August 2017
Public local inquiry: February 2018
Minister's decision: June 2018
Procure contractor: autumn 2019
Start of construction: end 2019
Completion of new section of trunk road: end 2022
Next steps

The public and all other stakeholders will review the published documents and either support, comment or object to what is proposed.

If anyone wishes to support, comment on, or object to the draft Orders, put forward alternative proposals, or comment on the Environmental Statement and / or the Statement to Inform an Appropriate Assessment they should write to us at the address below:

Orders Branch
Welsh Government
Cathays Park
Cardiff
CF10 3NQ.

Responses should be sent no later than the 08 September 2017.

It is anticipated an independent inspector will then carry out a public local inquiry in February 2018.

This will then inform the next stage of ministerial decision making as to whether to proceed to construction of the project.
How we are consulting

We consulted on improvements to the A465 between Abergavenny and Hirwaun in 1994 as part of the process to develop the preferred route for the whole project.

We held public information exhibitions in December 2015. At these events we presented the 1990s design and highlighted areas where we are considering options to improve this design.

We have been running a series of presentations to local interest groups and meetings with local landowners and businesses. We have used these to gather information on and understand how the proposals fit with local priorities, objectives and policies.

We held a series of draft Orders exhibitions in August 2017.
Find out more

We have appointed a dedicated public liaison officer for the project. If you have a concern or query you can contact Chris Meredith on 07497 894081 or email him at: christopher.meredith2@jacobs.com.
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jackal
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Re: A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

Post by jackal »

I count six full GSJs on this section (three two-bridge roundabouts and three dumbbells). Impressive. I'm amazed they can apparently do that for £400m.
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Re: A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

Post by Osthagen »

Considering the summary skips from 1994 to 1997 to 1998 then all the way to 2015, it really shows how long it takes for anything to get done in Britain :)
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Re: A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

Post by WHBM »

McNessA720 wrote:Considering the summary skips from 1994 to 1997 to 1998 then all the way to 2015, it really shows how long it takes for anything to get done in Britain.
I wonder if there are any civil servants still holding planning meetings for how to win World War 2 ?
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Re: A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

Post by Robert Kilcoyne »

jackal wrote:I count six full GSJs on this section (three two-bridge roundabouts and three dumbbells). Impressive. I'm amazed they can apparently do that for £400m.
I would think that the main engineering challenge will be the crossing of the River Taff at Cefn Coed-y-Cymmer and the nearby junction with the A470, particularly as there is a long steep ascent west of the current A470 roundabout.
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Re: A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

Post by Moyceyy »

This is easily the most controversial part of the dualling, especially the Merthyr Urban section.

The Merthyr Section (I.e. at least half of the road) will be very challenging to build, in terms of both engineering and public disproval. I think I counted 3 GSJs and 3 major bridge/viaduct sections over steep gorges, all in a built-up area with plenty of retaining walls - and of course the demolishing of homes (the controversial part).

Beautiful road building, we haven't seen something like this since the 80's!

However, I refuse to believe that it will cost only (!!) £400m. Looks more like £650m (±50m) to me.
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AAndy
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Re: A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

Post by AAndy »

It does appear that there is hurdle in the way. A public enquiry.




Ha!

It appears the 'public' enquiry is being held by a private firm, persona. See: http://a465-dualling.persona-pi.com/index .

It opens on the 24th April 2018. - Almost 3 months late too.
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Re: A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

Post by wrinkly »

AAndy wrote: It appears the 'public' enquiry is being held by a private firm, persona. See: http://a465-dualling.persona-pi.com/index .
They just run the inquiry website and do some of the admin.
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Re: A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

Post by DB617 »

WAG can't afford to let another major strategic project die in public inquiry. If we end up with the Blue Route and an incomplete expressway taking traffic to and from England, the entire region as far as Cardigan Bay is up cack creek in a few years' time. They had certainly better make this work, and damn the cost. Additionally I feel that the toil and struggle of the Brynmawr workers would be completely wasted if Merthyr shuts down the final part of the dualling.
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Re: A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

Post by Berk »

DB617 wrote:WAG can't afford to let another major strategic project die in public inquiry. If we end up with the Blue Route and an incomplete expressway taking traffic to and from England, the entire region as far as Cardigan Bay is up cack creek in a few years' time. They had certainly better make this work, and damn the cost. Additionally I feel that the toil and struggle of the Brynmawr workers would be completely wasted if Merthyr shuts down the final part of the dualling.
To be fair, although the M4 enquiry has taken two, maybe thee times longer than expected, it would be wrong to say it's failed - no decision has been reached yet.

And whilst I don’t support the process particularly, I think you’re trying to second guess the outcome. Newport was easily resolved once the Welsh government started talking to the owners of Newport docks, and agreed to make modifications to the viaduct crossing the docks.

Where’s the opposition supposed to come from in Merthyr?? Unless you mean from householders due to be bought out?? I’m not aware the route is taking a lot more land, so why should there be loads of complaints?? It’s not an automatic given that people will lodge complaints just because the road is passing through their area. It already does, the route is being recycled mostly.
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Re: A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

Post by ANiceEnglishman »

Just as the M4 Public Enquiry finishes, a new enquiry is announced to keep the civil servants, consultants and politicians busy.

http://www.senedd.assembly.wales/mgIssu ... ?IId=21501
The Economy, Infrastructure and Skills Committee has agreed to undertake an inquiry into the State of Roads in Wales.

Summary

The inquiry will focus on:

The condition and approach to maintenance of the local road, trunk road and motorway network;
Delivery of enhancement projects on the local road, trunk road and motorway network; and
How far the approaches taken to highway maintenance and improvement are sustainable.
Terms of reference

The current condition of roads in Wales and whether the approach to funding and delivery of maintenance programmes for the local road, trunk road and motorway network in Wales is effective, managed so as to minimise disruption to road users, and provides value for money;
Whether major enhancement projects on the local road, trunk road and motorway network are prioritised, funded, planned and delivered effectively, and provide value for money. Relevant issues include the implementation of the Early Contractor Involvement approach and the opportunities offered by the Welsh Government’s Mutual Investment Model; and
Whether Wales is adopting a sustainable approach to the maintenance and enhancement of its road network in the context of key legislation such as the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015 and the Active Travel (Wales) Act 2013.
You can find any answers you want on the Internet. Some of them may even be correct.
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Re: A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

Post by DB617 »

Berk wrote:To be fair, although the M4 enquiry has taken two, maybe thee times longer than expected, it would be wrong to say it's failed - no decision has been reached yet.

And whilst I don’t support the process particularly, I think you’re trying to second guess the outcome. Newport was easily resolved once the Welsh government started talking to the owners of Newport docks, and agreed to make modifications to the viaduct crossing the docks.

Where’s the opposition supposed to come from in Merthyr?? Unless you mean from householders due to be bought out?? I’m not aware the route is taking a lot more land, so why should there be loads of complaints?? It’s not an automatic given that people will lodge complaints just because the road is passing through their area. It already does, the route is being recycled mostly.
Yeah, I don't disagree with your points at all. I'm just suffering from a lack of faith - unfortunately that may be based on where I live. We were given great grand promises of new roads leaving the Vale of Glamorgan and the inquiry and consultation went on and on until the small number of NIMBY responses from Pendoylan resulted in the choice of the 'do nothing' option. Here we stand ten or so years on finally getting a road that goes as far as the A48 then hits another bottleneck. It's painful and I hope the larger projects do survive on their merits and building momentum.

I was responding to other members stating above that there could be some societal struggle relating to the building of the Merthyr stretch. However I hope the residents are more realistic than that and realise how desperately needed and how useful the expressway will be.

Also I actually don't mind the news of the new inquiry. It seems to have a broader scope and its results can't really be negative or harmful to our road network like those of the A465/M4 ones could be.
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Re: A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

Post by IAN »

Update On 15th Jan 2019.

https://beta.gov.wales/a465-section-5-a ... n-overview

It says Minister's Decision - Sep 2018 - I don't recall that, did it happen and if so what was it? Still has construction start date as end of 2019. Is this update actually just nonsense!

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Re: A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

Post by Euan »

If the dualling through Merthyr Tydfil has passed then it would be quite astonishing. The steep and rugged ground to the north has probably done the plan a favour, it would be soundly rejected if it was within a flat or gently sloping landscape more suitable for building roads over.
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Re: A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

Post by Riley »

The timetable near the bottom of this page (updated on 8 April) states start of construction early 2020, with completion at the end of 2023 (i.e. 4 years).

https://gov.wales/a465-section-5-and-6- ... n-overview
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Re: A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

Post by DB617 »

I can't see from that flythrough what line the road is supposed to take over the top or to the side (genuinely can't tell) of Dowlais Top Junction. Coming up from Cardiff to Gilwern this week with a satnav on I noted the hugely splayed slip road-like one-way carriageways off the D2 section, which I hadn't noticed before, with the absolutely massive mound of earth in the middle which I assume was excavated during the construction of the Dowlais-Brynmawr phase and left there for use to the west if it was ever approved. The graphics in the fly-through are honestly so outdated it was difficult to recognise anything relating to the actual landscape, for example the colliery at Dowlais Top or the current A465 which would become the slip roads.

In these days of augmented reality, I hope we can do better than this with flythroughs. Speaking as a hopeful future member of the industry but not yet in the know, would it be difficult with today's technology to start with a drone/helicopter-captured high detail flythrough and impose a carriageway design onto it? It may be costly but also totally worthwhile if it helps fearful residents to understand exactly what is the impact to their surrounding area when the road comes through, act as good evidence at inquiry and even be useful for the planning teams and project teams when ground is broken. This is especially important to South (and to an extent, coastal North) Wales as every other major road seems to be carved through a large urban area which will require modification to take a widening. I thought that the flythroughs for the M1 at Derby and Nottingham, and the ones for the A14(M), were far better than those done by WAG planners.
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Re: A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

Post by Chris5156 »

DB617 wrote: Sat May 04, 2019 13:14 I can't see from that flythrough what line the road is supposed to take over the top or to the side (genuinely can't tell) of Dowlais Top Junction. Coming up from Cardiff to Gilwern this week with a satnav on I noted the hugely splayed slip road-like one-way carriageways off the D2 section, which I hadn't noticed before, with the absolutely massive mound of earth in the middle which I assume was excavated during the construction of the Dowlais-Brynmawr phase and left there for use to the west if it was ever approved. The graphics in the fly-through are honestly so outdated it was difficult to recognise anything relating to the actual landscape, for example the colliery at Dowlais Top or the current A465 which would become the slip roads.
The plans are better for this sort of detail:
https://gov.wales/a465-section-5-and-6- ... heme-plans
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Re: A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

Post by DB617 »

Chris5156 wrote: Sat May 04, 2019 14:07
DB617 wrote: Sat May 04, 2019 13:14 I can't see from that flythrough what line the road is supposed to take over the top or to the side (genuinely can't tell) of Dowlais Top Junction. Coming up from Cardiff to Gilwern this week with a satnav on I noted the hugely splayed slip road-like one-way carriageways off the D2 section, which I hadn't noticed before, with the absolutely massive mound of earth in the middle which I assume was excavated during the construction of the Dowlais-Brynmawr phase and left there for use to the west if it was ever approved. The graphics in the fly-through are honestly so outdated it was difficult to recognise anything relating to the actual landscape, for example the colliery at Dowlais Top or the current A465 which would become the slip roads.
The plans are better for this sort of detail:
https://gov.wales/a465-section-5-and-6- ... heme-plans
Much better, thankyou.
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Re: A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

Post by roadtester »

Here's a bit of coverage from the last couple of weeks on the awarding of the contracts for sections 5 & 6, which seems quite pricey - although they are trying to drive a pretty high quality road through some difficult terrain:

https://www.highwaysmagazine.co.uk/Priv ... ction/8673

https://www.highwaysmagazine.co.uk/Head ... -mile/8688
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Re: A465 Heads Of The Valleys Dualling; Dowlais Top To Hirwaun

Post by IAN »

Good news to see that this will hopefully start soon but it will presumably mean that two schemes will be under construction at the same time leading to several miles of disruption.
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