Towns that are absent from signs

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Osthagen
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Re: Towns that are absent from signs

Post by Osthagen »

The A470 isn’t very good for signage southbound. Cardiff doesn’t seem to get a mention on DSs or RCSs until you reach around Merthyr Tydfil, which is absolute nonsense. Heck, Merthyr doesn’t even get a mention until you’re about 30 miles away.
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Re: Towns that are absent from signs

Post by Bryn666 »

McNessA720 wrote:The A470 isn’t very good for signage southbound. Cardiff doesn’t seem to get a mention on DSs or RCSs until you reach around Merthyr Tydfil, which is absolute nonsense. Heck, Merthyr doesn’t even get a mention until you’re about 30 miles away.
Probably because very few people use the entire A470 end-to-end. Its existence is mostly political, to try and show that North and South Wales aren't disconnected. It's quicker to go via England to head south from much of the north coast.

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/dir/53.32 ... m2!4m1!3e0
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Re: Towns that are absent from signs

Post by Osthagen »

Bryn666 wrote:
McNessA720 wrote:The A470 isn’t very good for signage southbound. Cardiff doesn’t seem to get a mention on DSs or RCSs until you reach around Merthyr Tydfil, which is absolute nonsense. Heck, Merthyr doesn’t even get a mention until you’re about 30 miles away.
Probably because very few people use the entire A470 end-to-end. Its existence is mostly political, to try and show that North and South Wales aren't disconnected. It's quicker to go via England to head south from much of the north coast.

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/dir/53.32 ... m2!4m1!3e0
I’m fairly sure that your quickest route from Cardiff to Llandudno is up the ‘470. I’d bring the road up to a mix of GS and non-GS D2. That should connect the North and South of that country and disperse a bit of traffic away from roads like the M6 and M5.
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Re: Towns that are absent from signs

Post by Robert Kilcoyne »

Bryn666 wrote:
Probably because very few people use the entire A470 end-to-end. Its existence is mostly political, to try and show that North and South Wales aren't disconnected. It's quicker to go via England to head south from much of the north coast.

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/dir/53.32 ... m2!4m1!3e0
It is an indictment of the low quality of the A470 north of Brecon that it is quicker to travel from Llandudno to Cardiff via Hereford city centre.
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Re: Towns that are absent from signs

Post by Osthagen »

Robert Kilcoyne wrote:
Bryn666 wrote:
Probably because very few people use the entire A470 end-to-end. Its existence is mostly political, to try and show that North and South Wales aren't disconnected. It's quicker to go via England to head south from much of the north coast.

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/dir/53.32 ... m2!4m1!3e0
It is an indictment of the low quality of the A470 north of Brecon that it is quicker to travel from Llandudno to Cardiff via Hereford city centre.
Are you sure on that? The route that Google gives me is straight up the A470.
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Re: Towns that are absent from signs

Post by Bryn666 »

That's the shortest route, it's several miles longer but approximately 15 mins quicker via the A49.
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Re: Towns that are absent from signs

Post by Osthagen »

Bryn666 wrote:That's the shortest route, it's several miles longer but approximately 15 mins quicker via the A49.
One minute longer according to Google.
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Re: Towns that are absent from signs

Post by Bryn666 »

Your Google settings are clearly wildly different to mine.
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Re: Towns that are absent from signs

Post by owen b »

McNessA720 wrote:
Bryn666 wrote:That's the shortest route, it's several miles longer but approximately 15 mins quicker via the A49.
One minute longer according to Google.
I've just put it into Google Maps (A470 end to end, starting at the Cardiff end), and it's offering me :
i) 3:59 191 miles Newport - Abergavenny - Hereford = Shrewsbury - Oswestry - A55 Chester bypass - Llandudno
ii) 4:13 189 miles nearly all A470
iii) 4:17 241 miles Newport Monmouth Ross Spur M5 M6 M56 A55
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Re: Towns that are absent from signs

Post by Big L »

owen b wrote:
McNessA720 wrote:
Bryn666 wrote:That's the shortest route, it's several miles longer but approximately 15 mins quicker via the A49.
One minute longer according to Google.
I've just put it into Google Maps (A470 end to end, starting at the Cardiff end), and it's offering me :
i) 3:59 191 miles Newport - Abergavenny - Hereford = Shrewsbury - Oswestry - A55 Chester bypass - Llandudno
ii) 4:13 189 miles nearly all A470
iii) 4:17 241 miles Newport Monmouth Ross Spur M5 M6 M56 A55
It's almost as if Google Maps gives different results at different times of day depending on something as ridiculous as traffic levels.
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Re: Towns that are absent from signs

Post by Robert Kilcoyne »

owen b wrote:
McNessA720 wrote:
Bryn666 wrote:That's the shortest route, it's several miles longer but approximately 15 mins quicker via the A49.
One minute longer according to Google.
I've just put it into Google Maps (A470 end to end, starting at the Cardiff end), and it's offering me :
i) 3:59 191 miles Newport - Abergavenny - Hereford = Shrewsbury - Oswestry - A55 Chester bypass - Llandudno
ii) 4:13 189 miles nearly all A470
iii) 4:17 241 miles Newport Monmouth Ross Spur M5 M6 M56 A55
The 4 hours 17 minutes (241 miles) for the route via the M5 and M6 seems very tight to me, particularly as you have the 30 mph section of the M5 in the roadworks at Oldbury, and also 20 miles at a maximum speed limit of 50 mph on the M6 in Cheshire.
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Re: Towns that are absent from signs

Post by Gareth Thomas »

Robert Kilcoyne wrote:
McNessA720 wrote:Another one is the almost total lack of any South Welsh destinations on RCSs on the M4 West until you actually cross over the Severn. This is not helped by the fact that most of the RCSs in question fail to even substitute with the more ambiguous regional destination of 'SOUTH WALES'.
This is the RCS on the M4 west of Junction 19, note no mention of South Wales:-
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.52257 ... 6656?hl=en

This RCS would also be a contender for the Botched Roadsigns thread.

It is only after you have passed the Almondsbury interchange that you see Newport and Cardiff on a RCS for the first time:-
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.55929 ... 6656?hl=en

Chepstow is signed as a forward destination on the M4 at the Almondsbury interchange, but Newport and Cardiff are not.
Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, may I please present Exhibit Just-After-Junction-10...
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Re: Towns that are absent from signs

Post by trickstat »

Gareth Thomas wrote:
Robert Kilcoyne wrote:
McNessA720 wrote:Another one is the almost total lack of any South Welsh destinations on RCSs on the M4 West until you actually cross over the Severn. This is not helped by the fact that most of the RCSs in question fail to even substitute with the more ambiguous regional destination of 'SOUTH WALES'.
This is the RCS on the M4 west of Junction 19, note no mention of South Wales:-
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.52257 ... 6656?hl=en

This RCS would also be a contender for the Botched Roadsigns thread.

It is only after you have passed the Almondsbury interchange that you see Newport and Cardiff on a RCS for the first time:-
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.55929 ... 6656?hl=en

Chepstow is signed as a forward destination on the M4 at the Almondsbury interchange, but Newport and Cardiff are not.
Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, may I please present Exhibit Just-After-Junction-10...
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Re: Towns that are absent from signs

Post by Osthagen »

Gareth Thomas wrote:
Robert Kilcoyne wrote:
McNessA720 wrote:Another one is the almost total lack of any South Welsh destinations on RCSs on the M4 West until you actually cross over the Severn. This is not helped by the fact that most of the RCSs in question fail to even substitute with the more ambiguous regional destination of 'SOUTH WALES'.
This is the RCS on the M4 west of Junction 19, note no mention of South Wales:-
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.52257 ... 6656?hl=en

This RCS would also be a contender for the Botched Roadsigns thread.

It is only after you have passed the Almondsbury interchange that you see Newport and Cardiff on a RCS for the first time:-
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.55929 ... 6656?hl=en

Chepstow is signed as a forward destination on the M4 at the Almondsbury interchange, but Newport and Cardiff are not.
Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, may I please present Exhibit Just-After-Junction-10...
I was taking more about signs in the Bristol region. That sign seems to be a one-off, possibly dating from before 1994. After that, it becomes more generalised as SOUTH WALES.
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Re: Towns that are absent from signs

Post by Gareth Thomas »

Cardiff (and later Newport) is on all the route confirmation signs after Junction 10, all the way to the border and beyond! :-P

They don't appear on the signs at the junctions themselves, "SOUTH WALES" taking up less space and covering the same ground. I've just looked at a few random junctions on Google Street View and Bristol doesn't appear on these signs either until after Swindon, yet it is on the RCS before Cardiff appears after Junction 10.
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Re: Towns that are absent from signs

Post by Osthagen »

Birmingham on the M1 South. On the M1 North, it’s signed from quite a long distance away on both the DSs and RCSs (originally, it was signed all the way from London) but on the M1 South, you only have “For Birmingham, follow A42”.
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Re: Towns that are absent from signs

Post by Robert Kilcoyne »

A random search on Flickr has revealed that the RCS on the M74 south of Junction 12 has been replaced, interesting to note that Dumfries is now included:-

https://www.flickr.com/photos/stevenbra ... qA-25ZCGJC
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Re: Towns that are absent from signs

Post by skiddaw05 »

There's no mention of Norwich in Lowestoft, either on the A146, which is only signed to Beccles, or on the newly renumbered A47. Norwich first appears on the A146 on a sign at the junction with the B1127 at Worlingham. The Fine City bestows more largesse to the UK's Most Easterly Town by signing it, to the exclusion of all others, right at the start of the A146 where it takes over from the A140 on the ring road.
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Re: Towns that are absent from signs

Post by Osthagen »

It is notable that Mansfield and Chesterfield are quite prominently signed from RCSs on the M1 South, whereas they've no mention at all on the road northbound.
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Re: Towns that are absent from signs

Post by Osthagen »

The RCSs on even the most southerly reaches of the A74(M) display no other destination beyond Carlisle and the non-primary Gretna. If they're struggling for something to put on there, I would at least have Penrith on signs in that area, since a considerable amount of traffic will be turning off at J40, for the A66 to the A1(M), and for the Lake District.

Indeed, the number changes at Carlisle, but the mainline of the motorway continues for hundreds of miles further south and the signs gives no implication of this.
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