M11 extension back on the agenda

[mehere]

Hi Guys sorry for the previous ' rushed post's but back to my question about the ' M11', rather than call the new ' Bypass' A14(M) it must be simpler to just extend the M11 and multiplex it witb the A1(m) , leaving the old road is the A14 but using ' white signage ' ensuring they adjust access so it's not easily reached from the new A2(M) interchange).
The poster who spoke of the upgrades to Lincolnshire roads including Dualling thevA15 was spot on, that needs a HQDC from wherever it starts with a fully Dualled ' Ring road of the same spec around Lincoln , A full Grade seperate interchange at the Lincoln Bypass, keeping the existing route as an 'LAR' , ( ensure that from The far south to the Humber.Brudge it has Hard shoulders ), there is ample empty land and a lot of ' abandoned properties alongside the current S2 , North on Lincoln .
As the road approaches the M180 there need to be a split , with D2 heading on the current alignment to the M180.
Plus a route going ' cross country ' perhaps parrallell to the M180 until it meets the road to the Humber Bridge , Again a fully grade seperated free flow interchange there , with hard shoulders added to the Bridge, North of there , A flyover At the ' Hull side' and a HQDC of the road ,bringing upto and upgrading the A1079 to an upgraded junction at York, But again leaving the old road as an Lar.
This should NOT stop the upgrade of the current A1 to motorway or expressway standards , because Lincolnshire is so poorly served by road and rail.
And there is a huge amount of HBV traffic using the A15.
Causing hair raising manouvers.

[alans]

Hi Guys sorry for the previous ' rushed post's but back to my question about the ' M11', rather than call the new ' Bypass' A14(M) it must be simpler to just extend the M11 and multiplex it witb the A1(m) , leaving the old road is the A14 but using ' white signage ' ensuring they adjust access so it's not easily reached from the new A2(M) interchange).
The poster who spoke of the upgrades to Lincolnshire roads including Dualling thevA15 was spot on, that needs a HQDC from wherever it starts with a fully Dualled ' Ring road of the same spec around Lincoln , A full Grade seperate interchange at the Lincoln Bypass, keeping the existing route as an 'LAR' , ( ensure that from The far south to the Humber.Brudge it has Hard shoulders ), there is ample empty land and a lot of ' abandoned properties alongside the current S2 , North on Lincoln .
As the road approaches the M180 there need to be a split , with D2 heading on the current alignment to the M180.
Plus a route going ' cross country ' perhaps parrallell to the M180 until it meets the road to the Humber Bridge , Again a fully grade seperated free flow interchange there , with hard shoulders added to the Bridge, North of there , A flyover At the ' Hull side' and a HQDC of the road ,bringing upto and upgrading the A1079 to an upgraded junction at York, But again leaving the old road as an Lar.
This should NOT stop the upgrade of the current A1 to motorway or expressway standards , because Lincolnshire is so poorly served by road and rail.
And there is a huge amount of HBV traffic using the A15.
Causing hair raising manouvers.

Hi me here

As much as I admire your wishes and desires for large upgrades and new roads for Lincolnshire I can't help thinking some of your wishes are a wee bit fanciful !

I can fully agree with you about upgrades to the Lincoln Western Bypass ,namely full dualling and GSJ'ed throughout,it was built on the cheap with a lot of shortsightedness.
I think dualling ,or a much upgraded A15 north of of Lincoln will be as good as it gets ,there is already a good D2 connection from the M180/A180 Barnetby Top to the Humber Bridge.
Connections South/South West from Grimsby ,an A46 upgrade Grimsby to Lincoln would be an excellent start,plus an upgrade at A46 /A1 Newark.

North of the Humber, an upgrade of the A1079 would be of great benefit ,but I think they will first concentrate on improvements to the congested A64 around York and towards Scarborough

As far as the A1 is concerned South Yorkshire to A1M at Peterborough,it really needs to brought up to full motorway standard ,plus of course the remaining A1 D2 sections south of Brampton

If any, or all these upgrades are delivered,it would greatly help to connect the Lincolnshire area to the national trunk road network,much of this has already been covered recently in this thread, including improvements to the south of Lincolnshire ie.A17 and A47

[KeithW]

Hi Guys sorry for the previous ' rushed post's but back to my question about the ' M11', rather than call the new ' Bypass' A14(M) it must be simpler to just extend the M11 and multiplex it witb the A1(m) , leaving the old road is the A14 but using ' white signage ' ensuring they adjust access so it's not easily reached from the new A2(M) interchange).

The major traffic flow is along the A14 from Felixstowe to Catthorpe so renaming the section from Cambridge to Brampton M11 makes no real sense.
Leaving the old road in place is NOT an option. The Huntingdon viaduct is deteriorating and the people and council of Huntingdon want it gone.

The poster who spoke of the upgrades to Lincolnshire roads including Dualling thevA15 was spot on, that needs a HQDC from wherever it starts with a fully Dualled ' Ring road of the same spec around Lincoln , A full Grade seperate interchange at the Lincoln Bypass, keeping the existing route as an 'LAR' , ( ensure that from The far south to the Humber.Brudge it has Hard shoulders ), there is ample empty land and a lot of ' abandoned properties alongside the current S2 , North on Lincoln .
As the road approaches the M180 there need to be a split , with D2 heading on the current alignment to the M180.
Plus a route going ' cross country ' perhaps parrallell to the M180 until it meets the road to the Humber Bridge , Again a fully grade seperated free flow interchange there , with hard shoulders added to the Bridge, North of there , A flyover At the ' Hull side' and a HQDC of the road ,bringing upto and upgrading the A1079 to an upgraded junction at York, But again leaving the old road as an Lar.
This should NOT stop the upgrade of the current A1 to motorway or expressway standards , because Lincolnshire is so poorly served by road and rail.
And there is a huge amount of HBV traffic using the A15.
Causing hair raising manouvers.

A Lincoln bypass would of course be needed , the A46 pretty much makes a western bypass so a new eastern bypass would pretty much do the job. The M180 is far from overloaded with an AADF of around 35k so I dont think its really possible to justify a parallel route although the intersections with the A15 would need to be looked at, You cannot add hard shoulders to the Humber bridge as lane 1 is a route designated for non motorised traffic and there is no reasonable alternative and even more importantly the deck suspension cables are in the way

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.71661 ... 6656?hl=en

Upgrading the A1079 to York seems even harder to justify, AADF is around 10k and the York ring road is overloaded while the A19 north of York and A59 NW are S2. Unless heading to the Yorkshire coast through traffic will either be going west along the A63/M62 to access the M62, A1(M) or M1 with the eastbound traffic heading into Hull. There is a flyover on the Hull side but you would want to review the roundabouts on the A15-A63 link.

[Berk]

The Lincoln Eastern Bypass is in progress - has been for the last 2 years.

The A1079 I would recommend looking at - some more D2 sections in particular would be good. It’s one of those roads that’s absolutely solid all day (so why it’s only recorded as having 10k AADT is beyond me).

You’re lucky to do 50, even in NSL sections (of which there aren’t many).

[Robert Kilcoyne]

Hi Guys sorry for the previous ' rushed post's but back to my question about the ' M11', rather than call the new ' Bypass' A14(M) it must be simpler to just extend the M11 and multiplex it witb the A1(m) , leaving the old road is the A14 but using ' white signage ' ensuring they adjust access so it's not easily reached from the new A2(M) interchange).

The major traffic flow is along the A14 from Felixstowe to Catthorpe so renaming the section from Cambridge to Brampton M11 makes no real sense.
Leaving the old road in place is NOT an option. The Huntingdon viaduct is deteriorating and the people and council of Huntingdon want it gone.

I could see a case for renumbering the A14(M) as the M11 if the A14 between Ellington and Catthorpe is ever upgraded to D2M/D3M (it would then get rid of the anomalous situation west of the A5199 junction, where the A14 leads inescapably to a motorway). The A14 would then terminate either at Girton, or be extended over the A428/A421 to meet the M1 at Junction 13.

A continuous M11 between Redbridge and Catthorpe could then be signed for London (E and SE) from the M1/M6, so that traffic on the southbound M6 would then pass two junctions where it would split for London; junction 4A where traffic for west and southwest London would join the M42 (M40) and then at Catthorpe, where traffic for north and northwest London would join the M1 with traffic for east and southeast London continuing straight ahead on the renumbered M11.

[Vierwielen]

The Lincoln Eastern Bypass is in progress - has been for the last 2 years.

The A1079 I would recommend looking at - some more D2 sections in particular would be good. It’s one of those roads that’s absolutely solid all day (so why it’s only recorded as having 10k AADT is beyond me).

You’re lucky to do 50, even in NSL sections (of which there aren’t many).

Was that 50 mph or 50 km/h?

[Berk]

Miles. I’m not obsessed with k’s unlike some here.

Although yes, sometimes even 50km/h is more likely...

[Mattptb]

To be honest shifting the M11 to head towards Norwich makes more sense to me from Gt Chesterford, whether it makes it beyond the Newmarket merge with the a14 is another matter.
The Cambridge west stretch of motorway could be given the M45 status and could run to Catthorpe or even terminate it at Birmingham with the M6 beginning from where the M6 toll starts. The old m45 could be given a three digit number and the a45 east of the m1 could be changed to the A605 which it meets at the a14 junction.
As for the east coast route, surely a d2 route is enough, probably using some of the a47/A17 from kings lynn and possible some of either the a15 or a16 to head northwards to the Humber. The initial route probably should branch off the current A11 east of Cambridge and head parallel to the a10 albeit further east. Possibly a new allignment of the a47 south of kings lynn would be possible with the two routes multiplexing before the a47 heads towards Wisbech on the dualled section south west of Kings Lynn.

[Peter350]

Hi Guys sorry for the previous ' rushed post's but back to my question about the ' M11', rather than call the new ' Bypass' A14(M) it must be simpler to just extend the M11 and multiplex it witb the A1(m) , leaving the old road is the A14 but using ' white signage ' ensuring they adjust access so it's not easily reached from the new A2(M) interchange).

The major traffic flow is along the A14 from Felixstowe to Catthorpe so renaming the section from Cambridge to Brampton M11 makes no real sense.
Leaving the old road in place is NOT an option. The Huntingdon viaduct is deteriorating and the people and council of Huntingdon want it gone.

I could see a case for renumbering the A14(M) as the M11 if the A14 between Ellington and Catthorpe is ever upgraded to D2M/D3M (it would then get rid of the anomalous situation west of the A5199 junction, where the A14 leads inescapably to a motorway). The A14 would then terminate either at Girton, or be extended over the A428/A421 to meet the M1 at Junction 13.

A continuous M11 between Redbridge and Catthorpe could then be signed for London (E and SE) from the M1/M6, so that traffic on the southbound M6 would then pass two junctions where it would split for London; junction 4A where traffic for west and southwest London would join the M42 (M40) and then at Catthorpe, where traffic for north and northwest London would join the M1 with traffic for east and southeast London continuing straight ahead on the renumbered M11.

Or how about this?

Existing M11 is diverted north of J9 onto an upgraded A11 towards Newmarket (and possibly Norwich).
The existing section of M11 north of J9 and the A14/A14(M) between Girton and Catthorpe becomes M14.
The A14 between Girton and Feixstowe becomes M41 as a continuation of the Oxford - Cambridge expressway.

This would remove the awkward TOTSO at Girton, although it would create another one at M11 J9.

[Glenn A]

The major traffic flow is along the A14 from Felixstowe to Catthorpe so renaming the section from Cambridge to Brampton M11 makes no real sense.
Leaving the old road in place is NOT an option. The Huntingdon viaduct is deteriorating and the people and council of Huntingdon want it gone.

I could see a case for renumbering the A14(M) as the M11 if the A14 between Ellington and Catthorpe is ever upgraded to D2M/D3M (it would then get rid of the anomalous situation west of the A5199 junction, where the A14 leads inescapably to a motorway). The A14 would then terminate either at Girton, or be extended over the A428/A421 to meet the M1 at Junction 13.

A continuous M11 between Redbridge and Catthorpe could then be signed for London (E and SE) from the M1/M6, so that traffic on the southbound M6 would then pass two junctions where it would split for London; junction 4A where traffic for west and southwest London would join the M42 (M40) and then at Catthorpe, where traffic for north and northwest London would join the M1 with traffic for east and southeast London continuing straight ahead on the renumbered M11.

Or how about this?

Existing M11 is diverted north of J9 onto an upgraded A11 towards Newmarket (and possibly Norwich).
The existing section of M11 north of J9 and the A14/A14(M) between Girton and Catthorpe becomes M14.
The A14 between Girton and Feixstowe becomes M41 as a continuation of the Oxford - Cambridge expressway.

This would remove the awkward TOTSO at Girton, although it would create another one at M11 J9.

Sounds a lot better than extending the M11 to the Humber Bridge, as a motorway link to Norwich makes a lot of sense as this a part of the country that is economically buoyant and the A11 isn't very good.

[skiddaw05]

To be fair the A11 to Norwich would work well as a D2 A road if all the at-grade junctions were GSJ'd. insetad of creating a motorway to Norwich I'd rather the M11 was upgraded to D3M up to J9

[Euan]

To be fair the A11 to Norwich would work well as a D2 A road if all the at-grade junctions were GSJ'd. insetad of creating a motorway to Norwich I'd rather the M11 was upgraded to D3M up to J9

The Junctions along the A11 are already all grade separated as far as Barton Mills, where the Fiveways Roundabout would need to be eliminated. Beyond that there are four at-grade junctions along the Thetford bypass and one further roundabout south west of Attleborough. So in actual fact there would not be a huge amount of work needed to fully GS the junctions along the A11 to Norwich, although there may also be a desire to remove some of the LILO junctions.

[KeithW]

The Lincoln Eastern Bypass is in progress - has been for the last 2 years.

The A1079 I would recommend looking at - some more D2 sections in particular would be good. It’s one of those roads that’s absolutely solid all day (so why it’s only recorded as having 10k AADT is beyond me).

You’re lucky to do 50, even in NSL sections (of which there aren’t many).

As I understand it the bypass being built is S2 with at grade junctions which would not work well if the A15 was dualled

[alans]

The Lincoln Eastern Bypass is in progress - has been for the last 2 years.

The A1079 I would recommend looking at - some more D2 sections in particular would be good. It’s one of those roads that’s absolutely solid all day (so why it’s only recorded as having 10k AADT is beyond me).

You’re lucky to do 50, even in NSL sections (of which there aren’t many).

As I understand it the bypass being built is S2 with at grade junctions which would not work well if the A15 was dualled

That is correct,and moreover, it is not even a full bypass as being built ,only about 2/3rds as I understand it , although I believe they are pushing for the remaining section to complete it , the eastern bypass was an opportunity to build what the western bypass should have been ie.fully dualled with GSJ'd junctions.


Another classic case of under provision and penny pinching

[roadtester]

The place that really needs a bypass on this general corridor is Boston (A16).

There's a certain amount of talk about it but nothing concrete so far AIUI.

https://www.lincolnshirelive.co.uk/news ... ic-1238349

[alans]

The place that really needs a bypass on this general corridor is Boston (A16).

There's a certain amount of talk about it but nothing concrete so far AIUI.

https://www.lincolnshirelive.co.uk/news ... ic-1238349

Absolutely !! This has been talked about for a very long time and nothing done,some years ago I used to make regular journeys from north Lincolnshire to Chatteris in Cambs. to visit friends and used the A16 ,Boston was always a pain,especially at the time I arrived there,later I started using the B1225 to Horncastle and thence to the A17 at Swineshead to avoid Boston.

[trickstat]

A continuous M11 between Redbridge and Catthorpe could then be signed for London (E and SE) from the M1/M6, so that traffic on the southbound M6 would then pass two junctions where it would split for London; junction 4A where traffic for west and southwest London would join the M42 (M40) and then at Catthorpe, where traffic for north and northwest London would join the M1 with traffic for east and southeast London continuing straight ahead on the renumbered M11.

The route for the final option will need some pretty serious improvements to be a truly viable alternative. Google suggests that taking the current A14 and M11 to the junction with the M25 takes 20 minutes longer than using the M1 and M25. While the current works on the A1 will be slowing things down what must be borne in mind is that from Catthorpe to Brampton the route travels almost due east.

[Mattptb]

The place that really needs a bypass on this general corridor is Boston (A16).

There's a certain amount of talk about it but nothing concrete so far AIUI.

https://www.lincolnshirelive.co.uk/news ... ic-1238349

To be honest upgrading the a16 to d2 from Peterborough to Boston and then building a new link road to the Humber bridge bypassing Boston to the west would probably be a better option than looking at the a15 between Peterborough and lincoln where the road is lower quality and harder to upgrade. You could feasibly connect the a16 to the a1m using the current road network around Peterborough and offer an alternative route for traffic heading for Lincoln and Humberside relieving traffic levels along the a1 and a46 further north.

[Fenlander]

A chance was missed there doing something At the south end of the A16. The Frank Perkins Parkway could have had an S2 flyover and a new bit of road past the entrance to van Hage, bypassing Eye village roundabout and over the A47 on to an upgraded White Post Road onto the new A16 alignment. That would have avoided the blue bridge fiasco and avoided mixing A47 & A16 & A15 traffic over 2 roundabouts.
That way A16 southbound traffic would soon be on to the A1, A16 northbound traffic would avoid 2 busy traffic light controlled roundabouts and if the A1139/A47 roundabout was kept to link the A46 to new A16 then that movement would take place at 1 existing but underused roundabout instead of having to build the new one. If that also removed some of the zig-zag route A1139-A47 traffic then it would ease pressure on the existing Parnell roundabout too.

[Berk]

Agreed. But the current A16-A47 link does allow traffic to go westbound easily (or eastbound, if coming from the A1 (north-south).

But if it’s heading for the A1(M), it’s a bit of a mess...