Northern M11 extension into the Fens is to be quietly allowed to die

[Euan]

This probably belongs as well here as anywhere - the Cambridge News has come up with seventeen - yes, seventeen - things it doesn't like about driving in Cambridge.

That the A14 only makes it to number five gives some idea how bad things are...

https://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/c ... 4-16197976

Can the lack of city centre parking and abundance of cyclists really be worse than heavy congestion on one of England's most important routes for freight traffic?

Maybe the current roadworks are only being viewed as a short term inconvenience rather than potholes and parking in the city which will most likely be longer term problems with more complicated solutions.

[KeithW]

This probably belongs as well here as anywhere - the Cambridge News has come up with seventeen - yes, seventeen - things it doesn't like about driving in Cambridge.

That the A14 only makes it to number five gives some idea how bad things are...

https://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/c ... 4-16197976

Can the lack of city centre parking and abundance of cyclists really be worse than heavy congestion on one of England's most important routes for freight traffic?

Maybe the current roadworks are only being viewed as a short term inconvenience rather than potholes and parking in the city which will most likely be longer term problems with more complicated solutions.

If you have to drive in to the city every day and dont use the A14 very often the answer is yes.

The times when cyclists worried most were
1) After dark - on more than one occasion I have only seen a cyclist at the last minute as they were wearing dark clothes and had no lights.
2) In summer - when the hordes of students are replaced by hordes of tourists who normally proceed on the right hand side of the road, wouldnt dream of cycling at home in Milwaukee (I had to pick her up off the road) and last rode a bike before they learned to drive.
3) When using their phone - I watched one fall off on the Madingley Road as he was using both hands to send a text and steering with his elbows.

Its not that parking is hard to find its just so darned expensive, in any of the big central multi storey car parks staying more than 5 hours is going to cost more than £28 which is why I always drove to Bedford to do my shopping.

The roadworks being complained of are not the A14 but internal roads. The Madingley Road seems to have eternal roadworks, they had the road up for the best part of 2 years replacing a sewer, then it was reopened for cables and for the last 5 years or so the University West new town has been causing chaos.

The root cause of course is that you have what was essentially a sleepy medieval city and university that has become the English equivalent of silicon valley but without the Freeways, wide roads and parking lots.

Palo Alto
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@37.44209 ... 6656?hl=en

Cambridge Science Park - note the presence of cyclists, road works and poor access.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@52.23216 ... 8192?hl=en

[KeithW]

This probably belongs as well here as anywhere - the Cambridge News has come up with seventeen - yes, seventeen - things it doesn't like about driving in Cambridge.

That the A14 only makes it to number five gives some idea how bad things are...

https://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/c ... 4-16197976

Blimey, if they think the cloverleaf at Girton is bad they should try driving in the built-up parts of America or Germany.

The problem with the cloverleaf is the amount of weaving that has to be done in a short length of road. If you are heading up the M11 N and want to take the A14 East you have to get over to the left weaving in turn with the westbound A14 traffic which has to get over to the right after having to TOTSO at Girton.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@52.23003 ... 6656?hl=en

This can be very unnerving when the road is busy especially when you have only 150 m in which to complete it and a considerable volume of traffic. I got pretty good at it but it was rather worrying the first 3 or 4 times.

[crb11]

Can the lack of city centre parking and abundance of cyclists really be worse than heavy congestion on one of England's most important routes for freight traffic?

Maybe the current roadworks are only being viewed as a short term inconvenience rather than potholes and parking in the city which will most likely be longer term problems with more complicated solutions.

It reflects the regular prejudices of what was once a decent local paper but has now sunk to sub-tabloid standards. (A recent article started by describing the A1 as a road linking "Buckden to places like St Neots".)

[camflyer]

The times when cyclists worried most were
1) After dark - on more than one occasion I have only seen a cyclist at the last minute as they were wearing dark clothes and had no lights.
2) In summer - when the hordes of students are replaced by hordes of tourists who normally proceed on the right hand side of the road, wouldnt dream of cycling at home in Milwaukee (I had to pick her up off the road) and last rode a bike before they learned to drive.
3) When using their phone - I watched one fall off on the Madingley Road as he was using both hands to send a text and steering with his elbows.

Most of the cyclists in Cambridge are sensible, especially those who commute by bike, but I go out of my way to avoid Mill Rd on dark evenings as there are so many students on bikes without any lights or reflective clothing wobbling home from the pub.

The beginning of October is the worst time of the year - dark nights and a new batch of Fresher students arriving, many of whom have never cycled in public roads in their lives thinking that they own the roads.

[Berk]

This probably belongs as well here as anywhere - the Cambridge News has come up with seventeen - yes, seventeen - things it doesn't like about driving in Cambridge.

That the A14 only makes it to number five gives some idea how bad things are...

https://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/c ... 4-16197976

Can the lack of city centre parking and abundance of cyclists really be worse than heavy congestion on one of England's most important routes for freight traffic?

Maybe the current roadworks are only being viewed as a short term inconvenience rather than potholes and parking in the city which will most likely be longer term problems with more complicated solutions.

What I would emphasise (and it took me a long time to appreciate this fact, despite having gone to school in Cambridge), the A14 was and is the only effective road into those villages (Bar Hill, Longstanton, Dry Drayton, Swavesey, Over etc.).

Any other route is far longer, and quite impractical. So by improving the A14, you are certainly screwing up a lot of people’s day-to-day lives for a medium-term period. Add to that the closures, and the lack of compliance with signed diversions, the noise, and disturbance and it’s not hard to see why people are so upset about it.

The only consolation is the pretty much 7-day working schedule should allow the project to finish much sooner.

[KeithW]

What I would emphasise (and it took me a long time to appreciate this fact, despite having gone to school in Cambridge), the A14 was and is the only effective road into those villages (Bar Hill, Longstanton, Dry Drayton, Swavesey, Over etc.).

Any other route is far longer, and quite impractical. So by improving the A14, you are certainly screwing up a lot of people’s day-to-day lives for a medium-term period. Add to that the closures, and the lack of compliance with signed diversions, the noise, and disturbance and it’s not hard to see why people are so upset about it.

The only consolation is the pretty much 7-day working schedule should allow the project to finish much sooner.

I dont think most people in the region resent the A14 roadworks as they know its a necessary change. In fact the new LAR will make life a lot better for people travelling in from the northern villages in the short term. In the long run this will soon disappear as new development on the old airfields at Northstowe and Bourn shift into high gear.
http://www.bournairfield.co.uk/

As I suggested up thread its the interminable series of roadworks on roads from the M11/A14 into Cambridge which is the annoying thing. They appear to be uncoordinated at best. In recent years there was disruption along the Trumpington road with the Grand Arcade construction and the separate electric cable installation and the new housing developments at Trumpington Meadows. The Barton Road is always chocka in part due to the lack of control of on street parking.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@52.19692 ... 8192?hl=en

The Huntingdon Road and Madingley roads have been impacted by the works for the new University West development for several years. The eternal cycle of new development around the Science Park and A10 axis havent helped and neither has the expansion of the Addenbrookes campus. None of these have had accompanying infrastructure upgrades beyond the guided busway and token cycleways which are often no more than signs permitting cyclists to ride along the narrow footpath dodging trees, pedestrian and traffic from the side roads.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@52.21190 ... 6656?hl=en

[roadtester]

A bit of movement on the subject of dualling the A10 between Ely and Cambridge.

It also appears there is a separate push to get some e.g. junction improvements anyway, regardless of any dualling.

https://www.elystandard.co.uk/news/bid- ... -1-6125911

Something needs to be done. This road is already completely overloaded at the peak, and they're talking 17,000 new homes and 14,000 new jobs on the Ely/Cambridge corridor.

Everything in the area is already more or less bursting at the seams thanks to the pace of development.

[camflyer]

Personally rather than dualling the A10 between Ely and Cambridge, I would keep the current single carriage as a local access road for tractors and villagers and have a new dual A10 on a better alignment. Building a new road would also be less disruptive during construction.

[roadtester]

Personally rather than dualling the A10 between Ely and Cambridge, I would keep the current single carriage as a local access road for tractors and villagers and have a new dual A10 on a better alignment. Building a new road would also be less disruptive during construction.

Yes - the alignment is really meandering and unfavourable in places, although newer bits such as around Milton are OK from that point of view.

I'm guessing now would be the time to do something on a mainly new alignment, while we're still talking about open countryside. Once bits of it get clogged with development, it will get more difficult.

[Berk]

Personally rather than dualling the A10 between Ely and Cambridge, I would keep the current single carriage as a local access road for tractors and villagers and have a new dual A10 on a better alignment. Building a new road would also be less disruptive during construction.

Yes - the alignment is really meandering and unfavourable in places, although newer bits such as around Milton are OK from that point of view.

I'm guessing now would be the time to do something on a mainly new alignment, while we're still talking about open countryside. Once bits of it get clogged with development, it will get more difficult.

I was thinking about this yesterday. If you only focus on Ely-Cambridge (which is fine as a Stage 1, but if you don’t move forward with plans for Stage 2), what about the section between Trumpington and Royston?? A road doesn’t usually exist in isolation - it has to connect somewhere.

My time in Cambridge tells me that the A10/A505 corridor is a well-sought and quick (or used to be) route to the A1. And gets a fair amount of use from commuters coming from the south.

You could even argue a case for Stage 3 (extending dialling along the A505 to the M11).

[owen b]

My time in Cambridge tells me that the A10/A505 corridor is a well-sought and quick (or used to be) route to the A1. And gets a fair amount of use from commuters coming from the south.

You could even argue a case for Stage 3 (extending dialling along the A505 to the M11).

There's probably a case for dualling from Royston to the M11 along either the A10 or the A505 but not both. In any event, the Foxton level crossing surely needs a flyover. For longer distance traffic the Milton Keynes to Cambridge expressway improvements should slightly alleviate Luton / Royston to Cambridge area routes.

[Berk]

The trouble is, if you only dual the A505, a lot of people will use the M11 to get into Cambridge. Which may be counter-productive.

[camflyer]

My time in Cambridge tells me that the A10/A505 corridor is a well-sought and quick (or used to be) route to the A1. And gets a fair amount of use from commuters coming from the south.

You could even argue a case for Stage 3 (extending dialling along the A505 to the M11).

There's probably a case for dualling from Royston to the M11 along either the A10 or the A505 but not both. In any event, the Foxton level crossing surely needs a flyover. For longer distance traffic the Milton Keynes to Cambridge expressway improvements should slightly alleviate Luton / Royston to Cambridge area routes.

A few years back I spent a couple of months commuting between east Cambridge and Stevenage. It's not that far on the map and on a clear day you can do it in no time at all but at peak times the delays on the single carriage sections of the A10 and A505 sent me insane (and that was before you hit the traffic nightmare which is Stevenage at 8am). In the end I changed jobs as I couldn't cope with it any more.

Once the A14 is finally finished it and the A428 upgrade starts it will the then time to look at north-south routes in the region. The M11 (north of Stansted), A10 and A505 all need urgent work

[roadtester]

I was thinking about this yesterday. If you only focus on Ely-Cambridge (which is fine as a Stage 1, but if you don’t move forward with plans for Stage 2), what about the section between Trumpington and Royston?? A road doesn’t usually exist in isolation - it has to connect somewhere.

My time in Cambridge tells me that the A10/A505 corridor is a well-sought and quick (or used to be) route to the A1. And gets a fair amount of use from commuters coming from the south.

You could even argue a case for Stage 3 (extending dialling along the A505 to the M11).

I’ve often thought this too. Quite often, just for the sake of variety, I’ll strike out from the M25 home to Cambs along the A10 rather than the A1(M). It’s quite a varied and interesting drive if the traffic isn’t too heavy.

Much of the existing dualling at the southern end is to a high standard - I think there was a plan for the dualling to be extended northwards at one time that got dropped.

[KeithW]

I’ve often thought this too. Quite often, just for the sake of variety, I’ll strike out from the M25 home to Cambs along the A10 rather than the A1(M). It’s quite a varied and interesting drive if the traffic isn’t too heavy.

Much of the existing dualling at the southern end is to a high standard - I think there was a plan for the dualling to be extended northwards at one time that got dropped.

The major sources of frustration along the A10 are north of Royston. Outside of rush hour the A10 is quite a pleasant drive from the M25 to Royston but from the A505 I would take the A1198 and A603 due to congestion and the thrice dammed level crossing in Foxton

[Tater]

I think that the A1 should be prioritised for A1(M) motorway all the way from London to Newcastle and an upgrade A46 to Lincoln to D2 standard or even A46(M) motorway should be considered. This would mean the new road would provide access to Lincoln without using local B roads or terrible standard A roads and provide access to the ports at Immingham via M18 and M180 and access to Hull toll free via the M18 and M62 instead of having to use the expensive Humber Bridge.

[c2R]

I think that the A1 should be prioritised for A1(M) motorway all the way from London to Newcastle and an upgrade A46 to Lincoln to D2 standard or even A46(M) motorway should be considered. This would mean the new road would provide access to Lincoln without using local B roads or terrible standard A roads and provide access to the ports at Immingham via M18 and M180 and access to Hull toll free via the M18 and M62 instead of having to use the expensive Humber Bridge.

I don't quite follow your thoughts on how that would work, given there's already a motorway route around the Humber that avoids the Humber Bridge if you don't want to pay for it... The A46 is also currently D2 to Lincoln from the A1.

I also wouldn't say that the totality A1 between Alconbury and Blyth really is the highest priority in the country for a massive amount of new investment or for being made a motorway. Certainly improvements would be better spent elsewhere and other schemes would provide a much higher BCR.

[Peter350]

I think that the A1 should be prioritised for A1(M) motorway all the way from London to Newcastle and an upgrade A46 to Lincoln to D2 standard or even A46(M) motorway should be considered. This would mean the new road would provide access to Lincoln without using local B roads or terrible standard A roads and provide access to the ports at Immingham via M18 and M180 and access to Hull toll free via the M18 and M62 instead of having to use the expensive Humber Bridge.

Surely it would be much better to dual the A15 north of Lincoln for that purpose.

[alans]

I think that the A1 should be prioritised for A1(M) motorway all the way from London to Newcastle and an upgrade A46 to Lincoln to D2 standard or even A46(M) motorway should be considered. This would mean the new road would provide access to Lincoln without using local B roads or terrible standard A roads and provide access to the ports at Immingham via M18 and M180 and access to Hull toll free via the M18 and M62 instead of having to use the expensive Humber Bridge.

The roads around Lincoln and to the Humber ports have been discussed extensively here

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=39645&hilit=m11+extension