Advance Warning of Junctions

[nowster]

That design is the original way of signing a cloverleaf interchange, and has often been used for closely spaced junctions, for example at partially unrolled cloverleafs (eg. M6/M62) or similar (M6/M56).

[Chris Bertram]

Did someone mention a cloverleaf?

On this sign "(B4095)" should be replaced by "A4189", I will check whether it has been when I'm next around that way.

[Jeni]

Did someone mention a cloverleaf?

On this sign "(B4095)" should be replaced by "A4189", I will check whether it has been when I'm next around that way.

Hadn't been replaced a few weeks ago

[Chris Bertram]

Did someone mention a cloverleaf?

On this sign "(B4095)" should be replaced by "A4189", I will check whether it has been when I'm next around that way.

Hadn't been replaced a few weeks ago

Doesn't surprise me. For some reason former New Towns seem to have a poor record at road signing, with updates being haphazard, badly-done or left undone. I'm currently sitting in Telford, and we all know how shambolic it has been here.

[Vierwielen]

It is 1 mile for motorways, and 1/2 mile for all other roads but there are exceptions.

On a number of motorways, the distances are 2 km (disguised as 1 1/4 miles), 1 km (disguised as 2/3 mile) and 500 m (disguised as 1/3 mile).

Can you give an example of "a number of motorways" please?

Your phrasing implies more than 2 different motorways.

Here is one on the M3. I saw others on the M3 on the west-bound approach to Junction 4a and also on the eastbound approach to Juntion 2.

[Johnathan404]

Here is one on the M3. I saw others on the M3 on the west-bound approach to Junction 4a and also on the eastbound approach to Juntion 2.

I make that about 770 metres prior to the junction, so the sign ought to say 1/2 mile.

Some of the M3 ALR gantries are awkwardly placed but I'd say the tight boundary and frequent bridges are a more likely reason for that.

[Jeni]

On a number of motorways, the distances are 2 km (disguised as 1 1/4 miles), 1 km (disguised as 2/3 mile) and 500 m (disguised as 1/3 mile).

Can you give an example of "a number of motorways" please?

Your phrasing implies more than 2 different motorways.

Here is one on the M3. I saw others on the M3 on the west-bound approach to Junction 4a and also on the eastbound approach to Juntion 2.

What about the 1 1/4 example? I'm still yet to see "a number of examples"

[trickstat]

Did someone mention a cloverleaf?

On this sign "(B4095)" should be replaced by "A4189", I will check whether it has been when I'm next around that way.

Hadn't been replaced a few weeks ago

Doesn't surprise me. For some reason former New Towns seem to have a poor record at road signing, with updates being haphazard, badly-done or left undone. I'm currently sitting in Telford, and we all know how shambolic it has been here.

Stevenage had brown signs to the ice rink for what I think was nearly 10 years after it closed in the late 90s.

[Vierwielen]

Can you give an example of "a number of motorways" please?

Your phrasing implies more than 2 different motorways.

Here is one on the M3. I saw others on the M3 on the west-bound approach to Junction 4a and also on the eastbound approach to Juntion 2.

What about the 1 1/4 example? I'm still yet to see "a number of examples"

Here is one.

[Jeni]

Here is one on the M3. I saw others on the M3 on the west-bound approach to Junction 4a and also on the eastbound approach to Juntion 2.

What about the 1 1/4 example? I'm still yet to see "a number of examples"

Here is one.

Any more? Just looking to quantify "a number of examples"

[Big L]

What about the 1 1/4 example? I'm still yet to see "a number of examples"

Here is one.

Any more? Just looking to quantify "a number of examples"

I imagine a more accurate description is "I am trying to rubbish someone else's statement".

[nowster]

One is a number.

[Chris5156]

I would have thought that manoeuvre would only ever be made by someone to bypass known congestion on either the A12 near Romford/Ilford or on the M25 itself if the North Circular was expected to be quicker. I expect the latter scenario would require a major accident.

I think M11/M25 is faster than the A12 between Woodford and Brentford even when traffic is light. But the point still stands that the lane drop off the anti-clockwise M25 has been allocated to the more lightly used traffic flow.

[Octaviadriver]

This one is 1½ miles rather than 1 mile on the M50 because the road is about to pass over the River Severn.

https://goo.gl/maps/KcgJrbJ2pN9gc4xA9

This one at Port Talbot on the M4 is for 2/3 mile.

https://goo.gl/maps/DN4TivxPfbVRNYK59

[Vierwielen]

On a number of motorways, the distances are 2 km (disguised as 1 1/4 miles), 1 km (disguised as 2/3 mile) and 500 m (disguised as 1/3 mile).

Can you give an example of "a number of motorways" please?

Your phrasing implies more than 2 different motorways.

Here is one on the M3. I saw others on the M3 on the west-bound approach to Junction 4a and also on the eastbound approach to Juntion 2.

Here is the other one that I mentioned.

[Berk]

This one is 1½ miles rather than 1 mile on the M50 because the road is about to pass over the River Severn.

https://goo.gl/maps/KcgJrbJ2pN9gc4xA9

This one at Port Talbot on the M4 is for ⅔ mile.

https://goo.gl/maps/DN4TivxPfbVRNYK59

I think that should be the absolute minimum signed distance for junctions (either all-purpose roads or motorways. Perhaps round it up to 1200 yds/1100m.

½-mile simply isn’t enough. Even if you’re paying full attention to the road ahead.

[Jeni]

Can you give an example of "a number of motorways" please?

Your phrasing implies more than 2 different motorways.

Here is one on the M3. I saw others on the M3 on the west-bound approach to Junction 4a and also on the eastbound approach to Juntion 2.

Here is the other one that I mentioned.

Ok, I reject your implication that this is a common enough occurrence to suggest that we're signing at 2km etc.

[Big L]

Ok, I reject your implication that this is a common enough occurrence to suggest that we're signing at 2km etc.

Some honesty at last !

[Conekicker]

This one is 1½ miles rather than 1 mile on the M50 because the road is about to pass over the River Severn.

https://goo.gl/maps/KcgJrbJ2pN9gc4xA9

This one at Port Talbot on the M4 is for ⅔ mile.

https://goo.gl/maps/DN4TivxPfbVRNYK59

I think that should be the absolute minimum signed distance for junctions (either all-purpose roads or motorways. Perhaps round it up to 1200 yds/1100m.

½-mile simply isn’t enough. Even if you’re paying full attention to the road ahead.

That all depends on the carriageway configuration on the approach. If there's another junction in close proximity, where that junction's slip road(s) is/are will impact on where you can place the ADS for the junction under consideration and possibly how many ADS you can fit in.

In these cases then the usual 1, 1/2 or 2/3, 1/3 miles might not fit. You could easily end up with a 1 and a 1/3 or a 3/4 and 1/4 or even something with a yardage. Or possibly only one ADS at whatever distance will fit if that's all that can be shoe-horned in.

There being no legal requirement to provide one or two ADS at all of course. Not that such non-provision would be sensible in anything other than a low speed environment and even then would be frowned upon.

[Berk]

No, that’s fine. I wasn’t suggesting it should be a rigid limit, just a minimum one. Not less than ⅔-mile. So if two junctions follow, it’d have to be a minimum of that distance to the nearest one.