Bristol bans diesels

[Alderpoint]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-50292596

How's that work then? The reports says they will ban "privately owned diesel cars". Presumably this means all diesel cars apart from those publically owned, which are, what?

[trickstat]

I think by "private" they basically mean non-commercial rather than non-public as taxis are exempted.

Apparently it will need Government approval before implementation. I must admit this will be annoying for the people having to pick a visiting relative and their luggage up from the station in the small petrol hatch used as a runaround rather than the larger diesel used as a family car.

[avtur]

My interpretation of what I've picked up from the media is that a privately owned Euro 6 diesel will simply be excluded from certain places at certain times where older more polluting diesels operating in taxis, commercials etc will be allowed on payment of a charge which is variable (IIRC something like £9 to £90 per day) a charge that will inevitably be passed on to customers, be that a transport or retail business. My problem with this is that I think there should be national policies so that everyone knows where they stand.

[c2R]

There should be national policies and a joined-up national payment scheme. If this sort of thing proliferates, it's going to be really tricky to keep track of.

I'm still not sure what I'll do about this, as Bristol is one of the many destinations I regularly visit - I suspect that the solution will be to courier materials in advance by van, and then drive separately, parking outside the area and having a taxi take me in, recharging customers in the area for the additional costs incurred.

[WHBM]

It's a revenue generating scheme, pure and simple.

[roadtester]

There should be national policies and a joined-up national payment scheme. If this sort of thing proliferates, it's going to be really tricky to keep track of.

I think this is what is behind the green number plates for EVs initiative for which we have a separate thread - it’s about having agreed definitions of what constitutes a “green” car that can be used as the basis for the various local and national schemes so people don’t have to worry about whether e.g. a PHEV escapes restrictions in one city and gets clobbered by them in another.

As you say, if each authority defines its scheme differently it will be difficult to plan journeys.

That said, we are going to see more of this sort of thing - it’s inescapable.

[WHBM]

As you say, if each authority defines its scheme differently it will be difficult to plan journeys.

That's because the actual operators of such schemes, who are the usual suspects for LA/government schemes of any sort, are not sitting idly by. Fresh from their revenue successes from the various TfL and other schemes, they have sales teams with targets to meet, going around the country with all sorts of marketing collateral, identifying which officers/elected representatives to put their pitches to hardest. Having dealt with such, it's apparent they have zero, in fact less, interest in any form of co-ordinated scheme, each is for their own.

[KeithW]

At the end of the day of course they will act surprised when the retail trade in the city centre declines even faster. Lets see do you drive your car to Cribbs Causeway where there is plenty of free parking or into Bristol where not only is parking expensive but now you will be hit with an extra charge for your Euro 6 diesel. Tough choice huh !

[Ruperts Trooper]

At the end of the day of course they will act surprised when the retail trade in the city centre declines even faster. Lets see do you drive your car to Cribbs Causeway where there is plenty of free parking or into Bristol where not only is parking expensive but now you will be hit with an extra charge for your Euro 6 diesel. Tough choice huh !

It's not an extra charge for a Euro 6 diesel, it's an absolute ban during most of the daytime hours, 7am-3pm.

I'm very unlikely to want to go into Bristol - but what if a medical emergency arose and driving to A&E at Bristol Royal Infirmary was the quickest course of action, rather than wait for an ambulance?

[Micro The Maniac]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-50292596

How's that work then? The reports says they will ban "privately owned diesel cars". Presumably this means all diesel cars apart from those publicly owned, which are, what?

There so many what-ifs here, and the devil will be in the detail (as always)

Presumably my lease-hire vehicle (which is not "privately owned") will be exempt?

[Alderpoint]

Presumably my lease-hire vehicle (which is not "privately owned") will be exempt?

My thoughts exactly. Is it even possible to determine who actually owns a particular vehicle? They say it will be based on ANPR, but if they are linking this into the DVLA database, that only records the registered keeper and they are very firm that this is no evidence of the legal owner.

[rhyds]

I'd imagine "privately owned" in this instance means "not a taxi", though it is telling that the council is more worried about the vehicle's ownership than its use...

[Micro The Maniac]

On a related topic, I was listening to a Green Party spokesmanperson stating that their policy is to make all workplace car-parking chargeable, to encourage use of public transport.

I have previously described my public transport alternative to my 26 mile (sub 40 minute) commute... so am unimpressed by this suggestion!

[rhyds]

On a related topic, I was listening to a Green Party spokesmanperson stating that their policy is to make all workplace car-parking chargeable, to encourage use of public transport.

I have previously described my public transport alternative to my 26 mile (sub 40 minute) commute... so am unimpressed by this suggestion!

When they come up with stuff like this I enjoy recalling how George Monbiot moved to Machynlleth and was intent on relying on cycling and public transport. Soon after he ended up buying a Diesel Renault Clio...

[AutomaticBeloved]

It's a revenue generating scheme, pure and simple.

I'm pretty pro environment so would normally be a bit more welcoming, but when you see they've included Cumberland basin, which is the signed route for traffic heading from the M4/M5 to Bristol Airport, I wonder how many holiday makers from Wales/Gloucestershire etc they'll catch as they clip the zone going through the junction.

I also think it would be worth having a national scheme like the German Umwelt stickers or the French Crit'air so it's much clearer which vehicles all of these zones apply to, rather then having to check each scheme's website.

[Alderpoint]

I'd imagine "privately owned" in this instance means "not a taxi", though it is telling that the council is more worried about the vehicle's ownership than its use...

I had a dig around on bristol.gov.uk and in the proposals can't find any references to ownership. Seems like the ban would apply to all diesel cars, except taxis, private hire vehicles, and emergency vehicles.

See item 8 on https://democracy.bristol.gov.uk/ieList ... 3689&Ver=4

[rhyds]

It's a revenue generating scheme, pure and simple.

I'm pretty pro environment so would normally be a bit more welcoming, but when you see they've included Cumberland basin, which is the signed route for traffic heading from the M4/M5 to Bristol Airport, I wonder how many holiday makers from Wales/Gloucestershire etc they'll catch as they clip the zone going through the junction.

Cardiff airport will be happy with that news!

[Ruperts Trooper]

It's a revenue generating scheme, pure and simple.

I'm pretty pro environment so would normally be a bit more welcoming, but when you see they've included Cumberland basin, which is the signed route for traffic heading from the M4/M5 to Bristol Airport, I wonder how many holiday makers from Wales/Gloucestershire etc they'll catch as they clip the zone going through the junction.

I also think it would be worth having a national scheme like the German Umwelt stickers or the French Crit'air so it's much clearer which vehicles all of these zones apply to, rather then having to check each scheme's website.

I've seen one report that part of the M32 is included in this no-go zone!

[Micro The Maniac]

I've seen one report that part of the M32 is included in this no-go zone!

The zone map can be found here

[roadtester]

I've seen one report that part of the M32 is included in this no-go zone!

The zone map can be found here

I don't know Bristol that well, but a lot of the boundary seems a bit random, which will make it harder for people to observe.

At least the LCC zone follows easily identifiable/memorable route boundaries.