Gogar roundabout grade seperation document

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Gav
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Gogar roundabout grade seperation document

Post by Gav » Thu Jan 14, 2021 21:03

http://scottwilsonscotlandhistory.co.uk ... 201993.pdf

saw this and thought it would be worth a share.

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c2R
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Re: Gogar roundabout grade seperation document

Post by c2R » Thu Jan 14, 2021 22:56

Thanks for this - I shall link it to the wiki.
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Re: Gogar roundabout grade seperation document

Post by Hdeng16 » Fri Jan 15, 2021 15:39

Why was it never extended northwards (before they built the tram stuff in the way it looks a fairly flat run.

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Re: Gogar roundabout grade seperation document

Post by c2R » Fri Jan 15, 2021 15:49

I've never really understood that either. While the new bridge and approach roads are great, driving from Edinburgh to the bridge via the A720/M8/M90 definitely feels a very round the houses trip..
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Re: Gogar roundabout grade seperation document

Post by Bryn666 » Fri Jan 15, 2021 16:31

c2R wrote:
Fri Jan 15, 2021 15:49
I've never really understood that either. While the new bridge and approach roads are great, driving from Edinburgh to the bridge via the A720/M8/M90 definitely feels a very round the houses trip..
Cammo estate probably, even if it followed the railway.

Much like Dundas Castle was in the way of the M9 spur extension, hence why that follows the railway.
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Re: Gogar roundabout grade seperation document

Post by Gav » Fri Jan 15, 2021 19:26

DcrohI4XkAACA4Y.jpg
could have ended up with this !

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Re: Gogar roundabout grade seperation document

Post by Bryn666 » Sun Jan 17, 2021 18:18

Gav wrote:
Fri Jan 15, 2021 19:26
DcrohI4XkAACA4Y.jpg

could have ended up with this !
Follows the railway too! Adds weight to my "posh house said no" theory then.
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Re: Gogar roundabout grade seperation document

Post by Truvelo » Sun Jan 17, 2021 18:38

I prefer the 1970s option of having the city bypass freeflow directly onto Maybury Road. That might have been more useful than an A8 underpass.
How would you like your grade separations, Sir?
Big and complex.

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Re: Gogar roundabout grade seperation document

Post by Hdeng16 » Sun Jan 17, 2021 22:11

It’s a long way from me but whenever I’ve used it, the entire area seems to grind to a halt at rush hour anyway... it’s an underpass to nowhere really... losing a lane eastbound etc.

I’m sure it’s better than a flat roundabout but has it been worth it given the lack of further progression.

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Re: Gogar roundabout grade seperation document

Post by A72 » Sun Jan 17, 2021 23:13

Hdeng16 wrote:
Sun Jan 17, 2021 22:11
It’s a long way from me but whenever I’ve used it, the entire area seems to grind to a halt at rush hour anyway... it’s an underpass to nowhere really... losing a lane eastbound etc.

I’m sure it’s better than a flat roundabout but has it been worth it given the lack of further progression.
I agree. All the underpass does, is increase congestion towards Maybury, as vehicles attempt to merge for the start of the S2 section, on top of the hold-ups at Maybury itself. Westbound, it snarls-up anyway, despite being D2. The whole area is a disaster, and the underpass doesn't help at all during busy times, in my opinion.
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Re: Gogar roundabout grade seperation document

Post by Uncle Buck » Tue Jan 19, 2021 00:17

I know many road nerds like to complain about poor planning but Edinburgh really does take the biscuit. The whole city is a horror to drive both around and past.

The M8 eastbound has a slip road at Hermiston onto the A720 northbound, leading to Gogar. This means that the near-permanent jams at Gogar back onto the M8 as it approaches Hermiston- which is, of course, light-controlled (screams) and therefore itself, usually jammed.

So, if you’re heading from the M8 eastbound to northern and western Edinburgh, you usually have to contend with a queue as you approach Hermiston, then another queue on the A720 as you approach Gogar, usually a hairy moment as you go round the roundabout itself, before being spat onto a rickety old street (Corstorphine and Maybury Roads), where you slog your way down past an insane number of traffic lights.

This is of course not helped by the fact that the A720 just dies a death at Gogar and so some orbital traffic heading to the bridge has to slog round Maybury Road. A good friend lived in Leith and it invariably took me longer to get from the M8 to his house than it did to get from north-west Glasgow to the end of the M8.

If we were starting over the A720 should run to the A90, Gogar and Hermiston should be grade-separated, and, I would argue, the A8 could be upgraded to completely free-flowing, to increase resilience and improve access to the M9 from northern Edinburgh. But the location of the tram depot immediately next to Gogar makes this difficult.

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Re: Gogar roundabout grade seperation document

Post by Truvelo » Tue Jan 19, 2021 00:37

The early 1970s proposal was for the A720 to freeflow onto Maybury Road. The piddly little roundabout halfway along Maybury Road would also have been a full blown GSJ. How planning has changed in the last 50 years :msnsad:
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How would you like your grade separations, Sir?
Big and complex.

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Re: Gogar roundabout grade seperation document

Post by Uncle Buck » Tue Jan 19, 2021 00:59

Truvelo wrote:
Tue Jan 19, 2021 00:37
The early 1970s proposal was for the A720 to freeflow onto Maybury Road. The piddly little roundabout halfway along Maybury Road would also have been a full blown GSJ. How planning has changed in the last 50 years :msnsad:
This still seems a weird route; the A720 is still ending on a local road rather than the A90; if this had been built, perhaps grumbling about Maybury would be common among Scottish Sabristi! However I don’t have any engineering expertise and don’t know what the area was like back then so maybe it’s a good route!

Incidentally this would I think result in the demolition of the Art Deco cinema (directly on the site of the roundabout northern sliproad) so would presumably meet with great opposition.

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Re: Gogar roundabout grade seperation document

Post by KeithW » Tue Jan 19, 2021 08:52

Uncle Buck wrote:
Tue Jan 19, 2021 00:59
Truvelo wrote:
Tue Jan 19, 2021 00:37
The early 1970s proposal was for the A720 to freeflow onto Maybury Road. The piddly little roundabout halfway along Maybury Road would also have been a full blown GSJ. How planning has changed in the last 50 years :msnsad:
This still seems a weird route; the A720 is still ending on a local road rather than the A90; if this had been built, perhaps grumbling about Maybury would be common among Scottish Sabristi! However I don’t have any engineering expertise and don’t know what the area was like back then so maybe it’s a good route!

Incidentally this would I think result in the demolition of the Art Deco cinema (directly on the site of the roundabout northern sliproad) so would presumably meet with great opposition.
The problem seems to be that the obvious route of going straight on at Gogar then turning north to the A90 takes you through the Cammo Estate and to the west of that is Turnhouse golf club. The route in the 1970's map was a viable at the time but now there are industrial/retail parks and housing in the way.

I recall driving through Edinburgh to the Forth Road Bridge in the 1970's and it was a real nightmare, the best way round from the A1 or A68 was a suburban road, the B701 as I recall.

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Re: Gogar roundabout grade seperation document

Post by Truvelo » Tue Jan 19, 2021 11:18

The early 70's proposal is shown in black. There was also an alternative route shown in red. Going back even earlier is the 1968 route shown in blue.

Either of these would be better than what exists now. The blue route shows the most potential in that it seems to point towards the Forth Bridge.
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gog.jpg
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Re: Gogar roundabout grade seperation document

Post by parristim » Tue Jan 19, 2021 14:03

Truvelo wrote:
Tue Jan 19, 2021 00:37
...The piddly little roundabout...
Being the junction to reach my in-laws at East Craigs... Having lived with Edinburgh's traffic foibles over the years they're pretty cross at the proposed construction of several thousand homes on land to the west of Maybury Road. I skimmed through the supporting transport reports and it's real urban-expansion stuff, e.g. Maybury Road to become urban 30mph with crossings, frontages etc. Although the mitigation for additional traffic appeared to be tweaks to signal timings at either end, which doesn't feel like it will be adequate.

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Re: Gogar roundabout grade seperation document

Post by McDanger » Tue Jan 19, 2021 14:47

I’m sure I recall reading somewhere in the past (may have been complete garbage of course) that the proximity of the threshold of Edinburgh Airport’s second runway, and corresponding Safety Zone, had some bearing on the City Bypass not running round to the A90.

The runway is no longer operational but was an active runway up until some point in the early 2000s I think. Now just used as a taxiway and for aircraft parking.

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Re: Gogar roundabout grade seperation document

Post by djw1981 » Wed Jan 20, 2021 22:03

parristim wrote:
Tue Jan 19, 2021 14:03
Truvelo wrote:
Tue Jan 19, 2021 00:37
...The piddly little roundabout...
Being the junction to reach my in-laws at East Craigs... Having lived with Edinburgh's traffic foibles over the years they're pretty cross at the proposed construction of several thousand homes on land to the west of Maybury Road. I skimmed through the supporting transport reports and it's real urban-expansion stuff, e.g. Maybury Road to become urban 30mph with crossings, frontages etc. Although the mitigation for additional traffic appeared to be tweaks to signal timings at either end, which doesn't feel like it will be adequate.
It's started, no longer proposed, with the first houses being moved into last month. 650 houses, 23 acres of park etc. At least 1, if not 2 sets of traffic lights on Maybury road.

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