Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

The study of British and Irish roads - their construction, numbering, history, mapping, past and future official roads proposals and general roads musings.

There is a separate forum for Street Furniture (traffic lights, street lights, road signs etc).

Registered users get access to other forums including discussions about other forms of transport, driving, fantasy roads and wishlists, and roads quizzes.

Moderator: Site Management Team

User avatar
KeithW
Member
Posts: 19205
Joined: Thu Dec 04, 2014 13:25
Location: Marton-In-Cleveland North Yorks

Re: Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

Post by KeithW »

JRN wrote: Sat Jun 05, 2021 17:38 There seems to be a little disagreement upthread as to whether places that are bypassed by major strategic routes should count. For instance with Clevedon, or the Garden Cities as mentioned by others.

I would say they don't really count.

For instance in Clevedon's case, it sits on a relatively narrow strip of land between the M5 and the coast. Any through traffic along the coast is going to take the M5, while any traffic travelling the perpendicular axis to or from the coast is almost by definition not through traffic.
Pre M5 the only roads into Clevedon were B3124, B3130 and B3133. The main road at the time was the A370 between Congresbury and Bristol. Clevedon was a on branch line from the GWR which was a victim of the Beeching Axe.
User avatar
jackal
Member
Posts: 7549
Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2008 23:33
Location: M6

Re: Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

Post by jackal »

skiddaw05 wrote: Sat Jun 05, 2021 23:16 Stockport (136k)? Those with local knowledge can advise on whether the A6 does what it always did here
There's also the small matter of the M60...
Glenn A
Member
Posts: 9776
Joined: Fri Apr 15, 2005 19:31
Location: Cumbria

Re: Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

Post by Glenn A »

Guiseley and Yeadon, with a population of over 20,000, has the A65 going through the middle. I know most long distance traffic to Leeds turns on to the A650, but the A65 is a fairly important local route.
User avatar
trickstat
Member
Posts: 8737
Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2014 14:06
Location: Letchworth Gdn City, Herts

Re: Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

Post by trickstat »

JRN wrote: Sat Jun 05, 2021 17:38
KeithW wrote: Sat Jun 05, 2021 17:28
JackieRoads wrote: Sat Jun 05, 2021 17:08 Does Clevedon count?
Given that its just off J20 of the M5 I would have to say not.
There seems to be a little disagreement upthread as to whether places that are bypassed by major strategic routes should count. For instance with Clevedon, or the Garden Cities as mentioned by others.

I would say they don't really count.

For instance in Clevedon's case, it sits on a relatively narrow strip of land between the M5 and the coast. Any through traffic along the coast is going to take the M5, while any traffic travelling the perpendicular axis to or from the coast is almost by definition not through traffic.
I agree that Clevedon has been bypassed by the M5. As for the Garden Cities, in both cases neither of them were on the A1/Great North Road in the first place, so the "bypass" predates their existence.
James1978
Member
Posts: 438
Joined: Fri Apr 14, 2006 18:12
Location: Darlington

Re: Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

Post by James1978 »

I was going to say Northallerton (the A1(M) and A19 are too far away to count surely?) but I think Scarborough trumps it!
Glenn A
Member
Posts: 9776
Joined: Fri Apr 15, 2005 19:31
Location: Cumbria

Re: Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

Post by Glenn A »

The A596 goes through Workington, Flimby and Maryport, with a combined population of 47,000, but as building by passes of the three settlements would be difficult and expensive, and traffic levels are not particularly high, this will never happen. The only significant settlement on the A596 to be by passed was Wigton due to its very narrow main street and tourist traffic for Silloth.
jabbaboy
Member
Posts: 358
Joined: Sun Jul 16, 2006 09:25
Location: Newcastle

Re: Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

Post by jabbaboy »

James1978 wrote: Sun Jun 06, 2021 09:10 I was going to say Northallerton (the A1(M) and A19 are too far away to count surely?) but I think Scarborough trumps it!
I was going to mention Northallerton aswell but it has East Road where Tesco is missing the main street off so it doesn't count.
User avatar
Steven
SABRE Maps Coordinator
Posts: 19168
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2002 20:39
Location: Wolverhampton, Staffordshire
Contact:

Re: Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

Post by Steven »

skiddaw05 wrote: Sat Jun 05, 2021 23:16 Stockport (136k)? Those with local knowledge can advise on whether the A6 does what it always did here
Well, there's always the MoT maps available on SABRE Maps to tell anyone definitively!
Steven
Motorway Historian

Founder Member, SABRE ex-Presidents' Corner

Add your roads knowledge to the SABRE Wiki today!
Have you browsed SABRE Maps recently? Try getting involved!

User avatar
Bryn666
Elected Committee Member
Posts: 35754
Joined: Thu Jun 20, 2002 20:54
Contact:

Re: Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

Post by Bryn666 »

Steven wrote: Sun Jun 06, 2021 10:44
skiddaw05 wrote: Sat Jun 05, 2021 23:16 Stockport (136k)? Those with local knowledge can advise on whether the A6 does what it always did here
Well, there's always the MoT maps available on SABRE Maps to tell anyone definitively!
And Wellington Road was built specifically to allow mail coaches to avoid the steep streets of central Stockport so is arguably one of our first ever bypasses.
Bryn
Terminally cynical, unimpressed, and nearly Middle Age already.
She said life was like a motorway; dull, grey, and long.

Blog - https://showmeasign.online/
X - https://twitter.com/ShowMeASignBryn
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@BrynBuck
User avatar
KeithW
Member
Posts: 19205
Joined: Thu Dec 04, 2014 13:25
Location: Marton-In-Cleveland North Yorks

Re: Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

Post by KeithW »

James1978 wrote: Sun Jun 06, 2021 09:10 I was going to say Northallerton (the A1(M) and A19 are too far away to count surely?) but I think Scarborough trumps it!
I think Northallerton counts as having been bypassed. In 1923 the A1 went smack through the middle of it along what is now the A167

https://www.sabre-roads.org.uk/maps/ind ... 4,-1.66696,
https://www.sabre-roads.org.uk/wiki/index.php?title=A167 wrote: Section 1: Topcliffe to Northallerton
This stretch can claim to be one of the forerunners of the A1 although the A168 and the present A1 routes were concurrent. In fact the Ministry first included the A167 in the original designation before hurriedly changing it when they realised that everyone used the more westerly route past Scotch Corner.

From the SABRE Wiki: A167 :

A long north-south route in northeast England, the A167 has been much lengthened over the years. Almost all of what is described below was at one time the A1 - and as that road has been rerouted or upgraded the A167 has taken over more of it.


This stretch can claim to be one of the forerunners of the A1 although the A168 and the present A1 routes were concurrent. In fact the Ministry first included the A167 in the original designation before hurriedly changing it

... Read More
User avatar
wrinkly
Member
Posts: 8986
Joined: Tue Mar 04, 2008 12:17
Location: Leeds

Re: Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

Post by wrinkly »

jackal wrote: Sun Jun 06, 2021 08:55
skiddaw05 wrote: Sat Jun 05, 2021 23:16 Stockport (136k)? Those with local knowledge can advise on whether the A6 does what it always did here
There's also the small matter of the M60...
...which when being planned and built was called "M63 Stockport East-West Bypass" rather than "Manchester ORR".
User avatar
Bryn666
Elected Committee Member
Posts: 35754
Joined: Thu Jun 20, 2002 20:54
Contact:

Re: Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

Post by Bryn666 »

wrinkly wrote: Sun Jun 06, 2021 13:29
jackal wrote: Sun Jun 06, 2021 08:55
skiddaw05 wrote: Sat Jun 05, 2021 23:16 Stockport (136k)? Those with local knowledge can advise on whether the A6 does what it always did here
There's also the small matter of the M60...
...which when being planned and built was called "M63 Stockport East-West Bypass" rather than "Manchester ORR".
And for those who don't know, that's because at the time the Manchester ORR was meant to follow what is now the A555 and unbuilt A6(M) with a loop back towards Sale. That bit of the M63 was never intended to be as major as it is hence the numerous D2M bits that had to be widened on the cheap in desperation in 1998/99.
Bryn
Terminally cynical, unimpressed, and nearly Middle Age already.
She said life was like a motorway; dull, grey, and long.

Blog - https://showmeasign.online/
X - https://twitter.com/ShowMeASignBryn
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@BrynBuck
User avatar
wrinkly
Member
Posts: 8986
Joined: Tue Mar 04, 2008 12:17
Location: Leeds

Re: Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

Post by wrinkly »

Bryn666 wrote: Sun Jun 06, 2021 15:01 And for those who don't know, that's because at the time the Manchester ORR was meant to follow what is now the A555 and unbuilt A6(M) with a loop back towards Sale. That bit of the M63 was never intended to be as major as it is hence the numerous D2M bits that had to be widened on the cheap in desperation in 1998/99.
One point I'm not sure of is at what date they dropped the proposed route from the present M60 (between junctions junctions 5 and 6) to M56 J5. By the time the Metrolink airport line was routed along part of it, a block of flats had carelessly been built on it.
Glenn A
Member
Posts: 9776
Joined: Fri Apr 15, 2005 19:31
Location: Cumbria

Re: Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

Post by Glenn A »

Teignmouth and Dawlish, although building a by pass would be difficult and the main concern is the threat from landslips to the railway line that cause weeks of problems.
James1978
Member
Posts: 438
Joined: Fri Apr 14, 2006 18:12
Location: Darlington

Re: Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

Post by James1978 »

For another one in Yorkshire, how about Harrogate? The A61 goes down one of the high streets for god's sake, and the A59 is torture as well. The A1(M) is surely too far away from it to count too?
Herned
Member
Posts: 1363
Joined: Thu Jul 20, 2017 09:15

Re: Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

Post by Herned »

James1978 wrote: Sun Jun 06, 2021 19:51 For another one in Yorkshire, how about Harrogate? The A61 goes down one of the high streets for god's sake, and the A59 is torture as well. The A1(M) is surely too far away from it to count too?
What about the A658?
Rob590
Member
Posts: 787
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2007 11:21

Re: Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

Post by Rob590 »

(Not the biggest but a relatively large one:) Winderemere and Bowness are between them about 12,000 and the A roads through town follow their original routes.
tom66
Member
Posts: 821
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2016 16:47

Re: Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

Post by tom66 »

I'd have to say Halifax is a contender, population 88k in 2011 census.

The roads through the town are an awful mix of partially upgraded dual-carriageway projects like Burdock Way (that goes nowhere) and some more modern bits like Huddersfield Road, but they are still well-built up sections. Perhaps the only good part is the short section of D2 through Orange St. Roundabout but I think it hardly counts as a bypass given it dissipates onto a 30 mph S2 at one end and the S2 A58 on the other end.

It's ironic given Elland, just up the hill, has a better bypass.
User avatar
trickstat
Member
Posts: 8737
Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2014 14:06
Location: Letchworth Gdn City, Herts

Re: Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

Post by trickstat »

tom66 wrote: Sun Jun 06, 2021 22:05 I'd have to say Halifax is a contender, population 88k in 2011 census.

The roads through the town are an awful mix of partially upgraded dual-carriageway projects like Burdock Way (that goes nowhere) and some more modern bits like Huddersfield Road, but they are still well-built up sections. Perhaps the only good part is the short section of D2 through Orange St. Roundabout but I think it hardly counts as a bypass given it dissipates onto a 30 mph S2 at one end and the S2 A58 on the other end.

It's ironic given Elland, just up the hill, has a better bypass.
Doesn't the M62 pass a fairly short distance south of Halifax?
User avatar
chaseracer
Member
Posts: 236
Joined: Sun Oct 05, 2014 15:46
Location: 127.0.0.1

Re: Largest settlement without any sort of bypass or relief road

Post by chaseracer »

skiddaw05 wrote: Sat Jun 05, 2021 23:16 Stockport (136k)? Those with local knowledge can advise on whether the A6 does what it always did here
Good call. Even the M60 goes pretty much through, rather than around.
Post Reply