It looks like the A120 pre-dated HE's "expressway" no-show propaganda by about 20 years. What an excellent piece of infrastructure.JohnnyMo wrote: ↑Thu Jun 10, 2021 19:36The one I showed on the A120 is the only one (pair?) I know about signed as Rest Area
Wikipedia has incorrect figure for UK Expressway length
Moderator: Site Management Team
Re: Wikipedia has incorrect figure for UK Expressway length
Bryn
Terminally cynical, unimpressed, and nearly Middle Age already.
She said life was like a motorway; dull, grey, and long.
Blog - https://showmeasign.online/
X - https://twitter.com/ShowMeASignBryn
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@BrynBuck
Terminally cynical, unimpressed, and nearly Middle Age already.
She said life was like a motorway; dull, grey, and long.
Blog - https://showmeasign.online/
X - https://twitter.com/ShowMeASignBryn
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@BrynBuck
Re: Wikipedia has incorrect figure for UK Expressway length
Although not quite up to "rest area" credentials, the ones on the A46 Brough Bypass are fairly substantial. https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.11789 ... a=!3m1!1e3
Fully setback from the carriageway, and allows parking on either side of the layby. Also has benches in the grassy area. Maybe these were some sort of pilot into rest areas on HQDC, but was never really followed through on? The rest of the A46 upgrade between Newark and Lincoln is very sub-par for being built post 2000, except these laybys it seems.
If our Trunk Road network (inc motorways) had these every 10-15 minutes/miles it would be very nice, providing limited facilities such as water, telephones/wifi & vending machines & maybe toilets too. And then have a full MSA every 4th one (i.e. 40-60 mins/miles)
Re: Wikipedia has incorrect figure for UK Expressway length
I guess what I was thinking was (and yes I know this is a bit of a ridiculous "what if" scenario) if 2 people in a car with a bicycle on a bicycle rack pulled into the rest area, and then one of them decided to use the bike and cycle on - how would he know he was breaking the law? Since there is no sign to signal "end of TRO restriction"...JohnnyMo wrote: ↑Thu Jun 10, 2021 19:42Motorway's have no stopping except in an emergency, TRO have no such restrictions, so nothing to suspend.JRN wrote: ↑Thu Jun 10, 2021 18:39
The French one is so much better TBH. Ideally we would get rid of traditional laybys and replace them with these off-carriageway rest areas with proper facilities.
Note that in the French example you gave, the Expressway restrictions are explicitly cancelled as you enter it, then re-instated before traffic re-enters the road, just like in a Motorway service area.
Whereas on the example you gave on the A120, even though that section has a TRO in place banning cyclists etc., there is no explicit signing of where the TRO restrictions end and start.
- MSAs have Motorway signs before you re-enter the Motorway.
- The French Expressway example had the Expressway "car" sign.
- Non-motorway special roads like the A720 Edinburgh don't have traditional laybys AFAIK
- Normal AP roads it doesn't matter.
Re: Wikipedia has incorrect figure for UK Expressway length
I didn't think it was that old as I remember crawling along the old A120 to the zoo when my daughter were younger. I think the road was part financed by Stanstead Airport to allow it to expand.Bryn666 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 10, 2021 19:51It looks like the A120 pre-dated HE's "expressway" no-show propaganda by about 20 years. What an excellent piece of infrastructure.JohnnyMo wrote: ↑Thu Jun 10, 2021 19:36The one I showed on the A120 is the only one (pair?) I know about signed as Rest Area
“The simple step of a courageous individual is not to take part in the lie" - Aleksandr I. Solzhenitsyn
Johnny Mo
Johnny Mo
Re: Wikipedia has incorrect figure for UK Expressway length
It was planned in the late 90s and opened around 2003 along with the new M11 junction.JohnnyMo wrote: ↑Thu Jun 10, 2021 21:38I didn't think it was that old as I remember crawling along the old A120 to the zoo when my daughter were younger. I think the road was part financed by Stanstead Airport to allow it to expand.Bryn666 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 10, 2021 19:51It looks like the A120 pre-dated HE's "expressway" no-show propaganda by about 20 years. What an excellent piece of infrastructure.JohnnyMo wrote: ↑Thu Jun 10, 2021 19:36
The one I showed on the A120 is the only one (pair?) I know about signed as Rest Area
The DMRB made provision for proper picnic areas like these around that time, the idea being that laybys weren't deemed safe enough for high volume routes and would not be used by people in the same way as a fully off-carriageway facility would.
Bryn
Terminally cynical, unimpressed, and nearly Middle Age already.
She said life was like a motorway; dull, grey, and long.
Blog - https://showmeasign.online/
X - https://twitter.com/ShowMeASignBryn
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@BrynBuck
Terminally cynical, unimpressed, and nearly Middle Age already.
She said life was like a motorway; dull, grey, and long.
Blog - https://showmeasign.online/
X - https://twitter.com/ShowMeASignBryn
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@BrynBuck
Re: Wikipedia has incorrect figure for UK Expressway length
That is quite a good one, we really should have more like that
Re: Wikipedia has incorrect figure for UK Expressway length
I don’t think it’s a well known bit of road outside that part of the south east, but the A120 between the M11 and Braintree is an astonishingly good bit of road - extraordinarily well specified, seems adequate for the traffic it carries, has rest areas and junctions that would put most trunk roads to shame, and a proper free-flowing connection to the M11 at the end. It’s a well kept secret.
Chris
Roads.org.uk
Roads.org.uk
Re: Wikipedia has incorrect figure for UK Expressway length
Essex pulling a Brittany there I think. Their network of HQDCs seems to put the trunk network to shame.Chris5156 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 10:17I don’t think it’s a well known bit of road outside that part of the south east, but the A120 between the M11 and Braintree is an astonishingly good bit of road - extraordinarily well specified, seems adequate for the traffic it carries, has rest areas and junctions that would put most trunk roads to shame, and a proper free-flowing connection to the M11 at the end. It’s a well kept secret.
Bryn
Terminally cynical, unimpressed, and nearly Middle Age already.
She said life was like a motorway; dull, grey, and long.
Blog - https://showmeasign.online/
X - https://twitter.com/ShowMeASignBryn
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@BrynBuck
Terminally cynical, unimpressed, and nearly Middle Age already.
She said life was like a motorway; dull, grey, and long.
Blog - https://showmeasign.online/
X - https://twitter.com/ShowMeASignBryn
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@BrynBuck
Re: Wikipedia has incorrect figure for UK Expressway length
I was a regular user of the A120 as a passenger and later a driver from about 83 when we moved to near the western end onwards, and progressive improvements to the route have been excellent. The only two criticisms I've got of the road, are at both ends of it - mixing airport traffic with any other traffic is never good, and Birchanger Green interchange is a dreadful example of how not to do something - allowing planning for both an offline MSA, local accesses to industrial areas and an international airport, coupled with large amounts of commuter and of course regionally strategic routes all around the same access. Sure, the free flow slips and roundabout cut through, and widening of access approaches progressively over the years have helped... but I wouldn't say that it's a good junction!Chris5156 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 10:17I don’t think it’s a well known bit of road outside that part of the south east, but the A120 between the M11 and Braintree is an astonishingly good bit of road - extraordinarily well specified, seems adequate for the traffic it carries, has rest areas and junctions that would put most trunk roads to shame, and a proper free-flowing connection to the M11 at the end. It’s a well kept secret.
Then, the other end, where the road just gives up at Braintree, and again, at a location where they've put a shopping centre, and a load of fast food and other eateries again has ended up being flooded with traffic. And I know that when it was all built, there was just a bypass around Braintree and Rayne, but the extension to the A12 has been a long time coming... And a change in circumstances means that I don't go that way very often any more to enjoy it when it eventually is resolved! Ah well..
Is there a road improvement project going on near you? Help us to document it on the SABRE Wiki - help is available in the Digest forum.
Have you browsed SABRE Maps recently? Get involved! - see our guide to scanning and stitching maps
Have you browsed SABRE Maps recently? Get involved! - see our guide to scanning and stitching maps
Re: Wikipedia has incorrect figure for UK Expressway length
Yes, and how did they get the A130 built as D3?
Minus points for still not having sorted out the nonsense at Laindon though
Re: Wikipedia has incorrect figure for UK Expressway length
This kind of thing really ought to have been the standard for all new roads, at least once it became clear that very little if any new D2M would be built.Bryn666 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 10:30Essex pulling a Brittany there I think. Their network of HQDCs seems to put the trunk network to shame.Chris5156 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 10:17I don’t think it’s a well known bit of road outside that part of the south east, but the A120 between the M11 and Braintree is an astonishingly good bit of road - extraordinarily well specified, seems adequate for the traffic it carries, has rest areas and junctions that would put most trunk roads to shame, and a proper free-flowing connection to the M11 at the end. It’s a well kept secret.
- Chris Bertram
- Member
- Posts: 15777
- Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2001 12:30
- Location: Birmingham, England
Re: Wikipedia has incorrect figure for UK Expressway length
The Fortunes of War junction? That is dreadful.
“The quality of any advice anybody has to offer has to be judged against the quality of life they actually lead.” - Douglas Adams.
Did you know there's more to SABRE than just the Forums?
Add your roads knowledge to the SABRE Wiki today!
Have you browsed SABRE Maps recently? Try getting involved!
Did you know there's more to SABRE than just the Forums?
Add your roads knowledge to the SABRE Wiki today!
Have you browsed SABRE Maps recently? Try getting involved!
Re: Wikipedia has incorrect figure for UK Expressway length
A303 Cartgate Roundabout has one - Google Mapsjervi wrote: ↑Thu Jun 10, 2021 21:34Although not quite up to "rest area" credentials, the ones on the A46 Brough Bypass are fairly substantial. https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.11789 ... a=!3m1!1e3
Fully setback from the carriageway, and allows parking on either side of the layby. Also has benches in the grassy area. Maybe these were some sort of pilot into rest areas on HQDC, but was never really followed through on? The rest of the A46 upgrade between Newark and Lincoln is very sub-par for being built post 2000, except these laybys it seems.
If our Trunk Road network (inc motorways) had these every 10-15 minutes/miles it would be very nice, providing limited facilities such as water, telephones/wifi & vending machines & maybe toilets too. And then have a full MSA every 4th one (i.e. 40-60 mins/miles)
-
- Member
- Posts: 102
- Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2006 22:41
Re: Wikipedia has incorrect figure for UK Expressway length
They’ve got a few things wrong though; they don’t show the A666 Bolton as expressway despite the fact it clearly is (pedestrians and cyclists are prohibited.).