A272 may lose its Primary Route Status

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jervi
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A272 may lose its Primary Route Status

Post by jervi »

In the draft plan for the West Sussex Transport Plan it mentions a few times about removing the A272 West of the A24 from the PRN, this is as a result of the route not being very suitable for large vehicles at some chokepoints and it being unlikely of any significant improvements in the future due to being in the South Downs National Park.
https://yourvoice.westsussex.gov.uk/986 ... ents/13943

I've been in contact with WSCC over the past few years about the classification of the A272, due to it almost exclusively using non-primary signs between the A24 and A3. Although my response from them is never clear as they seem to be confused about what the Primary Route Network is, and instead confusing it with other networks such as "SRN", "CSRN", "MRN" & "LRN". I don't know why CSRN and LRN need to exist since MRN and PRN is enough.
SRN - Stratgic Road Network (HE)
CSRN - County Strategic Road Network
MRN - Major Road Network
LRN - Lorry Route Network

Changing the A272 to non-primary would also fix this oddity at Billingshurst where the A272 (primary) multiplexes with A29 (non-primary) for a short distance.
https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=14/51.0236/-0.4674

If the A272 does become non-primary West of the A24, then the short part in Hampshire would likely also need to be demoted. The A272 would still remain primary between the A24 and A22, and really ought to be dualed between the A24 and A23 IMO, but unfortunately there is no mention of that :(
Phil
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Re: A272 may lose its Primary Route Status

Post by Phil »

jervi wrote: Sun Jul 18, 2021 11:24
If the A272 does become non-primary West of the A24, then the short part in Hampshire would likely also need to be demoted. The A272 would still remain primary between the A24 and A22, and really ought to be dualed between the A24 and A23 IMO, but unfortunately there is no mention of that :(
Dualling isn't necessary.

On the other hand by-passes for the villages of Cowfold and Ansty would be of great benefit to inhabitants and vehicles alike. A spot of carriageway widening / right turn filer lanes would do wonders in improving safety at some of the minor road junctions too.
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jervi
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Re: A272 may lose its Primary Route Status

Post by jervi »

Phil wrote: Mon Jul 19, 2021 13:39
jervi wrote: Sun Jul 18, 2021 11:24
If the A272 does become non-primary West of the A24, then the short part in Hampshire would likely also need to be demoted. The A272 would still remain primary between the A24 and A22, and really ought to be dualed between the A24 and A23 IMO, but unfortunately there is no mention of that :(
Dualling isn't necessary.

On the other hand by-passes for the villages of Cowfold and Ansty would be of great benefit to inhabitants and vehicles alike. A spot of carriageway widening / right turn filer lanes would do wonders in improving safety at some of the minor road junctions too.
Bypassing of Cowfold and Ansty would be great places to start, however the current road is far from ideal with current traffic levels between the A24 and A23 and ought to be completely rebuilt.
Its not particularly wide with hedgerows/woods right up to the edge of the carriageway. If you breakdown and have nowhere to go.
There is lack of any parallel routes, when there is an incident then traffic diverts onto even more unsuitable roads. Most direct roads in Sussex go N-S not E-W meaning there is not really an alternative
No other routes for NMUs, at current if you want to cycle from say Haywards Heath to Billingshurst, there isn't really a good route other than the A272. And then you end up causing a major tailback which is unsafe for cyclists.
Large amount of HGVs, resulting in slower traffic. You are lucky to be going faster than 30mph at peak times.
Horrid Horizontal and Vertical alignments make overtaking opportunities rare.
Many crossroads and horrid safety record, ongoing all the time, almost every junction is sub-par, some being very dangerous and as a result the A272 has the worst safety record in Sussex.
New town planned at West Grinstead near Buck Barn. This new town would result in Buck Barn being GSJ'd, however the issues on the A272 would become even worse.

So ideally between the A24 and A23 the whole of the A272 needs to be completely rebuilt, due to its narrow width (for the levels of traffic it carries) and amount of direct accesses and side roads, IMO it would be best for the whole road to be rebuilt offline. This way Issues of width, alignment, journey times, safety would be fixed, and the old route could become a through route only for NMUs. With it carrying in nearly 20k a day it may as rather be a dual carriageway.
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Ritchie333
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Re: A272 may lose its Primary Route Status

Post by Ritchie333 »

There are no decent high quality east - west routes in Sussex, or indeed south of the M25, between the A23 and the M20. That's why I struggle to get to Brighton in under two hours, whereas a decent D2 route (or electrification and dualling of the Marshlink line) would allow me to do it in an hour.
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astondb9
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Re: A272 may lose its Primary Route Status

Post by astondb9 »

Maybe Thakeham homes will find it in their heart to dual (+ cycle lane) the section between Buck Barn and the Downslink, and then if a Cowfold bypass ever comes along they could be connected together.

In the short term, a roundabout instead of a T junction at the A23 junction would make quite a difference too.
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jervi
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Re: A272 may lose its Primary Route Status

Post by jervi »

astondb9 wrote: Mon Jul 19, 2021 14:44 Maybe Thakeham homes will find it in their heart to dual (+ cycle lane) the section between Buck Barn and the Downslink, and then if a Cowfold bypass ever comes along they could be connected together.

In the short term, a roundabout instead of a T junction at the A23 junction would make quite a difference too.
The developers and WSCC (& HDC) will definitely hear my voice often when/if that development becomes any more than a rough sketch. In the Local Transport Plan in the OP it does also mention NMU provision along the length of the A24 as well as introduce air quality measures at Cowfold, so I'll be surprised if houses start going up without any condition to introduce a cycle track along the A24 and A272. I want it to be dualled, but I'll settle online improvements and a cycle track.
It would be good to reopen the closed railway line between Christ's Hospital and the new town (and maybe even beyond) to provided actual decent inter-town public transport rather than depending on everyone having cars to make a simple journey to Horsham, Crawley & beyond.

The T junction between the A272 and A23 (A272 Spur in reality) is due to get traffic signals installed as a condition of the new houses at Burgess Hill. Although the plans there are equally as non-NMU friendly and doesn't help the former NCN20 get its designation back.
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Re: A272 may lose its Primary Route Status

Post by Phil »

jervi wrote: Mon Jul 19, 2021 15:01
It would be good to reopen the closed railway line between Christ's Hospital and the new town (and maybe even beyond) to provided actual decent inter-town public transport rather than depending on everyone having cars to make a simple journey to Horsham, Crawley & beyond.
Where do you think we are? Scotland....

England doesn't do railway rebuilds, the Bean counters in Whitehall refuse to spend money on such things (preferring to prop up their outsourcing model**). If you are very, very lucky then you might get a Freight line in the northern provinces returned to passenger use 30 years after it was first proposed*, but putting back one back in where the the land has been sold off and alignment compromised (take a look at the route through Southwater where the formation has been totally been messed around with even if the basic alignment is sort of intact) ain't going to happen.

** Don't be fooled - under Governments GBR setup the big banks will still be raking it in leasing trains and private / overseas state companies will still be making money from running services on a contract basis. All it amounts to is some minor tinkering with ticketing and fancy marketing with overall policy still being set by the dead hand of Whitehall....

*Newcastle - Blyth (ish) /Ashington
Phil
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Re: A272 may lose its Primary Route Status

Post by Phil »

jervi wrote: Sun Jul 18, 2021 11:24

So ideally between the A24 and A23 the whole of the A272 needs to be completely rebuilt, due to its narrow width (for the levels of traffic it carries)
Well if it wasn't such a slog fighting through Lancing / Worthing then at least some of the traffic might divert.

Government roads policy for the past 30 odd years across the whole South East of England seems to be for everyone to use radial roads and the M25 - so is it any surprise E-W roads get so clogged up with people trying to avoid the extra mileage or queues / congestion around London

I know at present any journey i make heading west sees me take the A272 as a start point - if its heading NW ish then its usually up the A24, A281, A31, A331, M3, A339.... so as to avoid the sodding M25 while journeys W / / SW see me heading down the A24, A283, B2139 and A29 to reach the A27.
Last edited by Phil on Mon Jul 19, 2021 17:39, edited 1 time in total.
Micro The Maniac
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Re: A272 may lose its Primary Route Status

Post by Micro The Maniac »

In many respects, this is a questionable call - especially while it remains on the Lorry Route Network... the real issue is Petworth, where it could be argued that re-routing the A272 around the lorry-diversion makes some sense, but even that diversion is not really adequate. If it remains on the LRN it needs sorting.

Of course, being in the SDNP, nothing is going to change, so why not go the who hog and downgrade to a B2xxx
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