Roads as county/local authority boundaries

[Chris5156]

Pleasingly, Border Road in Sydenham forms part of the border between LB Lewisham and LB Bromley. It’s managed in its entirety by Bromley.

[WHBM]

Other than a small section of West Hendon on the "wrong side" which belong to Barnet, the A5 Edgware Road (and its other names) is a major boundary in London. From north to south, starting at the London/Herts boundary where it meets the A41

Between Harrow and Barnet
Between Brent and Barnet
Between Brent and Camden
Very briefly between Westminster and Camden

Until Westminster grabs it all!

That last bit is a more recent change, from the 1965 merging of boroughs. Previously it was Paddington on the west, and St Marylebone to the east, right down to Marble Arch. It does lead to the surprising extent nowadays of Westminster stretching right out to Queens Park. One of the aims of the 1965 changes, which led to "long thin" radiating boroughs, was to give as much chance as possible to voters with different traditional support being in one borough, so it was not wholly dominated by one party or the other. It reflected this more in the early 1960s, but has been somewhat lost nowadays.

[Scratchwood]

Other than a small section of West Hendon on the "wrong side" which belong to Barnet, the A5 Edgware Road (and its other names) is a major boundary in London. From north to south, starting at the London/Herts boundary where it meets the A41

Between Harrow and Barnet
Between Brent and Barnet
Between Brent and Camden
Very briefly between Westminster and Camden

Until Westminster grabs it all!

That last bit is a more recent change, from the 1965 merging of boroughs. Previously it was Paddington on the west, and St Marylebone to the east, right down to Marble Arch. It does lead to the surprising extent nowadays of Westminster stretching right out to Queens Park. One of the aims of the 1965 changes, which led to "long thin" radiating boroughs, was to give as much chance as possible to voters with different traditional support being in one borough, so it was not wholly dominated by one party or the other. It reflected this more in the early 1960s, but has been somewhat lost nowadays.

I agree with the thinking behind this, even if the outlying area in boroughs perhaps feel a bit neglected.

It's interesting how the A5 became this long standing boundary in London, and no other roads.

[Micro The Maniac]

You still get this at Canary Wharf in London, who maintain their own network and have their contractor come and treat them when temperatures fall, well before Tower Hamlets do so (if at all). The salting of course spreads itself for half a mile or so outside.

Canary Wharf reminds me a bit of the Embassy Links Business Park in Bangalore...

Within the boundaries, the roads are perfectly maintained, the verges well manicured, and no honking allowed. You leave the site, and the first obstacle to navigate is a huge pot-hole that gets bigger each time I visit!

[WHBM]

Canary Wharf reminds me a bit of the Embassy Links Business Park in Bangalore...

Within the boundaries, the roads are perfectly maintained, the verges well manicured, and no honking allowed. You leave the site, and the first obstacle to navigate is a huge pot-hole that gets bigger each time I visit!

Your description of the pockmarked surface of Marsh Wall, main road west of South Quay DLR station, and just outside CW's area, is perfect ...

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.5011496 ... 384!8i8192

[jnty]

My interpretation of these contrasts would be that these companies obviously have a lot of cash sloshing about and could perhaps be induced to contribute a bit more to the local road network they are benefiting from so dramatically.

But perhaps that's a bit over-simplistic...

[KeithW]

I suspect they would take the view that the local authority is benefitting from the property taxes raised.

[jgharston]

To take where I live: the civil parish I'm in doesn't match the district that most people in the city would describe me as living in, because the parish boundary pre-dates the construction of a motorway. Most people I think would now identify the border between the two districts as to where you have to cross the motorway, and as a 'community' we have basically no interaction acrosst that boundary; rather, we are much more embedded in activities in the neighbouring parish, which is on the same side of the motorway as us. The motorway has basically shifted the boundary, even if the line on the map remains unchagned.

Prod the district council to do a community governance review and tidy up the boundary.

[jgharston]

Largely driven by the 1990s council changes. In this case both sides were in Glasgow City from 1975 to 1996, however Glasgow lost large suburban and semi suburban areas in 1996. South Lanarkshire, East Renfrewshire and East Dumbartonshire being recipients. IIRC South Lanarkshire was probably the big beneficiary.

So that's why there's that ridiculous bite taken out of the south-east. By any sane definition that's Glasgae.

Wow! Just look at the election results for 1984. Hard to imagine nowadays.

[Jim606]

I thought I'd post this comment in this existing thread rather than start a new one. But, with the upcoming new county / merged district unitary authorities coming into being on the 1st April 2023, there are going to (no doubt) be some changes to boundaries. One in particular is Dunmail Raise on the A591 in the Lake District. I seem to remember there being two major cairns (piles of stones) which traditionally served as markers between Cumberland and Westmorland (South Lakeland & Eden Cumbria CC districts?) at the summit.

Has anyone seen any new signage going up for this or any of the other changes around England?

[Vierwielen]

Also, lets not forget the fun and games that is Chester FC.

https://www.google.com/maps/@53.18915,- ... a=!3m1!1e3

In short the Club claims that it is English and always has been, however its ground and three of four stands are wholly in Cymru/Sir y Fflint/Flintshire, and they apparently claimed a Covid support grant from Flintshire CC. Problem is that under welsh Covid regs they couldn't have a crowd at matches, but under the English rules they could. Now that Welsh regs are being relaxed the problem has gone away again.

AIUI the club's offices are very strategically positioned so that they are just in England.

If this field was on the Dutch/Belgian border, the entire field would be deemed to be in the country where its principal entrance was situated. That is the position in the cojoined-twin towns ofBaarle-Nassau and Baarle-Hertog.

[Vierwielen]

There is one road which, although not a county/local authority boundary, is nevertheless a huge economic boundary - the M25. Many firms have conditions that apply within the M25 (for example free delivery etc) which define this road as a major boundary.

[Scratchwood]

In the early 1990s, the border between the London boroughs of Bromley and Bexley, and then between Bromley and Kent was sensibly revised to follow the A20 which is a natural boundary.

The Bexley/Bromley borough boundary starts just before the Sidcup bypass, sticking with the 1920s route through Ruxley. Then when the Swanley bypass starts, for half its length this becomes the boundary between Bromley and Sevenoaks (Kent) until the A20 crosses the railway and both sides become Kent.

[wallmeerkat]

Belfast uses the M2 to the north as a boundary with Newtownabbey https://www.mdpi.com/ijgi/ijgi-10-00765 ... 5-g001.png

You can see the Newtownabbey-Antrim council sign under the bridge https://www.google.com/maps/@54.6487025 ... 384!8i8192

The first link also shows a stretch of M1 to the south being used as boundary with Lisburn-Castlereagh council

[exiled]

Also, lets not forget the fun and games that is Chester FC.

https://www.google.com/maps/@53.18915,- ... a=!3m1!1e3

In short the Club claims that it is English and always has been, however its ground and three of four stands are wholly in Cymru/Sir y Fflint/Flintshire, and they apparently claimed a Covid support grant from Flintshire CC. Problem is that under welsh Covid regs they couldn't have a crowd at matches, but under the English rules they could. Now that Welsh regs are being relaxed the problem has gone away again.

AIUI the club's offices are very strategically positioned so that they are just in England.

If this field was on the Dutch/Belgian border, the entire field would be deemed to be in the country where its principal entrance was situated. That is the position in the cojoined-twin towns ofBaarle-Nassau and Baarle-Hertog.

The French-Belgian border around Lille, although not as dramatic as Baarle, has a lot of places where the border runs along streets. Example here

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@50.71107 ... 384!8i8192

The border runs through the roundabout. One arm is in Belgium, one in France. Two are shared. The road the car is coming out of has French give way markings, and a Belgian weight restrictions sign. It is in one of the few officially bilingual areas, Mouscron, so the sign is in Dutch as well as Wallonia's official French.

[Chris Bertram]

In Baarle-Nassau/Hertog, the language is Dutch either side of the border so at least that is no problem.

[Tater656]

There's a country lane off the A6105 that forms the England/Scotland border for a bit

[exiled]

In Baarle-Nassau/Hertog, the language is Dutch either side of the border so at least that is no problem.

For most things now the two Baarles act as one town, though covid threw that a bit. I recall watching a video where a murder happened in the town and they had to get in a surveyor in order to decide which police force was to investigate. The police share a building.

[Vierwielen]

AIUI the club's offices are very strategically positioned so that they are just in England.

If this field was on the Dutch/Belgian border, the entire field would be deemed to be in the country where its principal entrance was situated. That is the position in the cojoined-twin towns ofBaarle-Nassau and Baarle-Hertog.

The French-Belgian border around Lille, although not as dramatic as Baarle, has a lot of places where the border runs along streets. Example here

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@50.71107 ... 384!8i8192

The border runs through the roundabout. One arm is in Belgium, one in France. Two are shared. The road the car is coming out of has French give way markings, and a Belgian weight restrictions sign. It is in one of the few officially bilingual areas, Mouscron, so the sign is in Dutch as well as Wallonia's official French.

Here is another view of the border which runs down the midddle of the. Notice the different types of parking bay on the French and the Belgian sides of the road. Not sure how they coordinate road maintenance.

[the cheesecake man]

The boundary between Sheffield and Rotherham was aligned (IIRC in 1994) with the M1 between J35A and J34N. A proposal to continue this further south, thereby moving Tinsley and Blackburn Meadows Sewage Works from Sheffield to Rotherham was strongly opposed so was rejected.