New Mersey Crossing

[Bendo]

Out of interest, how hard is it for signage with distances to be placed accurately, approaching the bridge from at least 3 directions, the distance to toll is incorrect, on 2 of those on the runcorn side it isn't a major problem (although I question the one that says toll 2 miles ahead despite the bridge being half a mile away)as it ends as there is a daft roundabout so you aren't likely to end up on the bridge by mistake. but there is one on Speke road stating 2 miles to toll when in reality, it is about 1 mile. I wonder if anyone has committed to an overtake and then been unable to take the exit. Seems like it would be an easy appeal point for someone to avoid the toll.

On a serious note though, why is it so hard to put the signs in the wrong place?

[nowster]

If a car park payment machine at a Park and Ride can do ANPR and let you pay by entering the last three characters of your reg number, then display a grid of pictures to let you select yours, then accept cash/card payment, I can't see how MerseyToll might not have a lay-by with such a machine... Yes, it might cost £10k per machine and would require someone to empty it every few days. That's a tiny cost compared to the capital cost of the whole scheme.

[trigpoint]

The onus is on you to know what your journey entails, that isn't entrapment. That is basic route planning.

The issue is that the signage is vague and as I said previously not everyone is online.

The signs simply say pay by midnight tomorrow at Mersey Flow which you then have to remember, no mention of a phone number or a way to pay cash if you don't have a bank account.

According to online maps the bridge is called Mersey Gateway, so where did Mersey Flow come from?

Whilst before committing to the bridge I had seen signs for a £2 toll, the obscure payment method was not clear until I was passed the point of no return.

Whilst I use the internet and through sabre was aware of the Dartford system, many I know would not have a clue what it meant. Also the lack of clarity of the actual web address leaves room for scam sites.

[Bendo]

Not going to well for the council at the moment, seems that the order for the tolls may not have been compliant - https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/li ... y-14507681

[haymansafc]

The BBC have also picked up on this story. I'm going to be very interested to see how this one develops...

Mersey Gateway Bridge toll charges 'illegal'

I'll be due a £4 refund (one trip each way) if that's the case!

My brother was up from Ipswich the other week and whilst he was back in our area he fancied going to the Gemini Retail Park. He remembers years ago we used to take the old Runcorn/Widnes Bridge to get there and whilst he was aware of the new crossing, he seemed genuinely surprised there was a toll on it. In the end, he went through the centre of Warrington on the way there and then M62/M6/M56 on the way back. If me or my father hadn't have warned him, he'd have likely been just another one to end up with a hefty fine.

[Jeni]

If me or my father hadn't have warned him, he'd have likely been just another one to end up with a hefty fine.

Why, does he not look at roadsigns?

[Hdeng16]

I'll claim my £2 toll back for the sake of it, partly to make a point against the inept council, partly to make a point against tolling in general.

Then I'll spend the £2 either by giving it to charity, or more likely, buying 2 bags of sweets.

[nowster]

Why, does he not look at roadsigns?

Britain is very bad at signing primary routes that are tolled. Back roads usually have "(via toll)" on their signs, but primary routes, never.

eg. A57 into Lincoln: toll bridge with no advance warning.

[haymansafc]

I'll claim my £2 toll back for the sake of it, partly to make a point against the inept council, partly to make a point against tolling in general.

Then I'll spend the £2 either by giving it to charity, or more likely, buying 2 bags of sweets.

If it gets to the stage where we can get a refund, I'll be claiming my £4 back and putting it into my fuel fund. It'll go towards taking an alternative route to avoid the bridge the next time I'm in the area. That's basically through Warrington or over the Thelwell Viaduct, as the there was no foresight to keep a nearby free alternative route... Something I and others have been going on about right from day one of conception of the new crossing.

They've done it to themselves.

[Hdeng16]

Why, does he not look at roadsigns?

Britain is very bad at signing primary routes that are tolled. Back roads usually have "(via toll)" on their signs, but primary routes, never.

eg. A57 into Lincoln: toll bridge with no advance warning.

Interestingly, Dunham has had the gates removed - the lights remain, and the toll is still taken, but no more barriers.

[Hdeng16]

I'll claim my £2 toll back for the sake of it, partly to make a point against the inept council, partly to make a point against tolling in general.

Then I'll spend the £2 either by giving it to charity, or more likely, buying 2 bags of sweets.

If it gets to the stage where we can get a refund, I'll be claiming my £4 back and putting it into my fuel fund. It'll go towards taking an alternative route to avoid the bridge the next time I'm in the area. That's basically through Warrington or over the Thelwell Viaduct, as the there was no foresight to keep a nearby free alternative route... Something I and others have been going on about right from day one of conception of the new crossing.

They've done it to themselves.

Exactly.

[Berk]

The fact that some people can’t hack it (with the tolls), is starting to sound a lot like the Skye Bridge all over again.

Trouble (for them) is our government isn’t socialist enough to want to do anything about it.

[nowster]

The fact that some people can’t hack it (with the tolls), is starting to sound a lot like the Skye Bridge all over again.

My SatNav (Google Maps) now warns me that the route across the New BRIDGE is tolled. Many people won't have noticed until they're already committed to crossing the bridge.

It doesn't help things if the councils involved have botched up the statutory notices needed to implement their intended charging. I can't imagine (sic) John Lennon airport is pleased about the situation, either, but that's in a different authority which may not have had the opportunity to speke (sic) out.

(I'm a sic individual. )

[Johnathan404]

I can't imagine (sic) John Lennon airport is pleased about the situation, either, but that's in a different authority which may not have had the opportunity to speke (sic) out.

If they have an issue with unreasonable charges for drivers they can speak to their own parking department!

[Berk]

Let’s be real about this - this affects mainly Runcorn people. But a lot of the argument in here would suggest some people used to use Jubilee Bridge as a ‘back door’ route into Liverpool.

But surely “this is SABRE, and we only drive on motorways, because that’s what local people do”?? Rather than pay some crummy toll and add 15 miles on to the journey to Liverpool.

[vlad]

Let’s be real about this - this affects mainly Runcorn people. But a lot of the argument in here would suggest some people used to use Jubilee Bridge as a ‘back door’ route into Liverpool.

Depending on where you're starting from and where in Liverpool you're after, the crossing from Runcorn to Widnes is an obvious route choice.

This sign, for example, advises you to use it to get to Speke.

[fras]

Up to around a 1/4 of a million PCNs issued so far, so the bridge should be paid off in about 3 years, I reckon !

[Berk]

Let’s be real about this - this affects mainly Runcorn people. But a lot of the argument in here would suggest some people used to use Jubilee Bridge as a ‘back door’ route into Liverpool.

Depending on where you're starting from and where in Liverpool you're after, the crossing from Runcorn to Widnes is an obvious route choice.

This sign, for example, advises you to use it to get to Speke.

I can see that, but I think it be mainly people from Crewe and East Cheshire trying to do that. Or maybe if you were trying to get to the M57 from south of the Mersey.

The road network between north and south isn’t that well integrated, so you can understand why people would rather use the M6.

[rhyds]

There's a similar sign on the M53 just outside Chester as well.

[Berk]

There's a similar sign on the M53 just outside Chester as well.

But in Chester it would be easier to go up the Wirral to Kings- or Queensway tunnels, wouldn’t it?? And they’re tolled anyway.