Botched Roadsigns

[the cheesecake man]

Given the correct prescribed legend today is Manchester (C), and some signs do say this

There are other "M'cr city centre" signs. I'm not sure how many drivers would join the M60 to look for the city centre rather than staying on the radial road they were on.

[nowster]

There is some perverse pleasure in knowing that this sign (on a private driveway) still exists.

[Bryn666]

Given the correct prescribed legend today is Manchester (C), and some signs do say this

There are other "M'cr city centre" signs. I'm not sure how many drivers would join the M60 to look for the city centre rather than staying on the radial road they were on.

Yes, in 1998 when the M60 was created the decision was taken to signpost "M'cr city centre" to avoid confusion with Salford which is its own city centre next door. I personally don't see the point as to most people outside the region Salford and Manchester city centres are in the same place to begin with (just on opposite banks of the Irwell).

All the "M'cr city centre" signs should always have said either "Manchester (C)" or "Central Manchester" in line with LTN 1/94 but I believe there were political reasons for the unusual approach. It certainly had nothing to do with the airport - "M'cr" has been an abbreviation from when the airport was still Ringway and in any case the IATA 3 letter code for it is MAN.

[Bryn666]

There is some perverse pleasure in knowing that this sign (on a private driveway) still exists.

Glad to know that's still there! I spotted in 2010 on a trip down that way.

[SteelCamel]

There are other "M'cr city centre" signs. I'm not sure how many drivers would join the M60 to look for the city centre rather than staying on the radial road they were on.

I think it's more about confirming that the junction is full access, and you can join the A62 in either direction - it's equivalent to "inbound" and "outbound". There are junctions where there are separate exit slips for the two directions, or ones where one direction can't be accessed at all - this sign makes it clear that this isn't the case here.

[SouthWest Philip]

There are other "M'cr city centre" signs. I'm not sure how many drivers would join the M60 to look for the city centre rather than staying on the radial road they were on.

I think it's more about confirming that the junction is full access, and you can join the A62 in either direction - it's equivalent to "inbound" and "outbound". There are junctions where there are separate exit slips for the two directions, or ones where one direction can't be accessed at all - this sign makes it clear that this isn't the case here.

The "M'cr" abbreviation has always irritated me, likewise "B'ham".

In the case of "M'cr city centre" I personally think "Manchester (C)" would be more elegant, and fit just as easily on the sign.

[the cheesecake man]

Yes, in 1998 when the M60 was created the decision was taken to signpost "M'cr city centre" to avoid confusion with Salford which is its own city centre next door. I personally don't see the point as to most people outside the region Salford and Manchester city centres are in the same place to begin with (just on opposite banks of the Irwell).

In theory yes. In practice as far I've been able to spot Salford City Centre no longer seems to exist. Is it the cathedral (where there's not much else looking like a city centre)? Is it the university area around Crescent station (this being Crescent station rather than Central would suggest not)? Is it "Salford Shopping City" which sounds like it should be the city centre but is just a neglected precinct in Pendleton?

[Bryn666]

Yes, in 1998 when the M60 was created the decision was taken to signpost "M'cr city centre" to avoid confusion with Salford which is its own city centre next door. I personally don't see the point as to most people outside the region Salford and Manchester city centres are in the same place to begin with (just on opposite banks of the Irwell).

In theory yes. In practice as far I've been able to spot Salford City Centre no longer seems to exist. Is it the cathedral (where there's not much else looking like a city centre)? Is it the university area around Crescent station (this being Crescent station rather than Central would suggest not)? Is it "Salford Shopping City" which sounds like it should be the city centre but is just a neglected precinct in Pendleton?

Officially it's Chapel Street/Greengate, hence why I said for most intents and purposes it's the same place as Manchester city centre which is across the river.

In terms of what feels like Salford city centre though, all three of your suggestions could be passed off as it if from certain points of view. Salford Shopping City is actually in Pendleton (which was demolished to make way for it), and Crescent Station only opened in 1989 when the Windsor rail link was added.

I think "Manchester (C)" and "Salford" being signed separately where appropriate is the best signing compromise here. This is done on the M602, and Salford is signed off up Albion Way where it then is never mentioned again - the next sign is "Crescent and Chapel St Area A6"...

[tom66]

There is some perverse pleasure in knowing that this sign (on a private driveway) still exists.

National speed limit - for vehicles travelling 45 degrees rolled to the carriageway axis. Does not apply if they are accessing the property.

It's very clear. I don't see what's confusing at all!

[Bfivethousand]

To demonstrate that the botching of roadsigns is by no means exclusively a recent phenomenon... this is from an upcoming Pre-Warboys signs auction.

I don't think it's ever been formally known as the ELAIN VALLEY? Certainly not in its Anglicised form which would explain the whited-out letter 'I', <edit> however I gather the word Elan actually derives from the Welsh Elain - hind or fawn.

[Gareth Thomas]

Yes, in 1998 when the M60 was created the decision was taken to signpost "M'cr city centre" to avoid confusion with Salford which is its own city centre next door. I personally don't see the point as to most people outside the region Salford and Manchester city centres are in the same place to begin with (just on opposite banks of the Irwell).

In theory yes. In practice as far I've been able to spot Salford City Centre no longer seems to exist. Is it the cathedral (where there's not much else looking like a city centre)? Is it the university area around Crescent station (this being Crescent station rather than Central would suggest not)? Is it "Salford Shopping City" which sounds like it should be the city centre but is just a neglected precinct in Pendleton?

Officially it's Chapel Street/Greengate, hence why I said for most intents and purposes it's the same place as Manchester city centre which is across the river.

In terms of what feels like Salford city centre though, all three of your suggestions could be passed off as it if from certain points of view. Salford Shopping City is actually in Pendleton (which was demolished to make way for it), and Crescent Station only opened in 1989 when the Windsor rail link was added.

I think "Manchester (C)" and "Salford" being signed separately where appropriate is the best signing compromise here. This is done on the M602, and Salford is signed off up Albion Way where it then is never mentioned again - the next sign is "Crescent and Chapel St Area A6"...

When we visited Greater Manchester in 2018, I had a stroll through Salford for an hour or so, looking for any "City centre" signs. I was disappointed but not surprised not to find any.

[Skermington]

I'm sure there's a more efficient way of signing this

[Jonathan24]

I saw this one recently and thought of this thread - seems a bit unnecessary to have a 30MPH advisory max speed for a bend in a 30MPH limit (with the repeater underneath).

This one maybe isn't a botch as such. But spinning around to the reverse (it seems they like recycling), that's going to be one tricky diversion route...

[Chris5156]

url=https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@52.52920 ... 384!8i8192]This[/url] one maybe isn't a botch as such.

The top line is in Helvetica, not Transport, so it is a botch in that sense!

[Big L]

….spinning around to the reverse[/url] (it seems they like recycling), that's going to be one tricky diversion route...

I’ve seen a similar one elsewhere in Shropshire, on the B4364 heading towards Bridgnorth. I’ll have a hunt on the street view later.

[jnty]

Was reminded of this classic as I passed it near Peebles yesterday

https://goo.gl/maps/WhL9H26jraVGxeZo8

It's repeated at least once further down the road as well.

[MotorwayGuy]

A few oddities around the Tilbury area:

Double set of 30 signs.
Pretty sure this isn't the right sign for that plate.
Through road for buses?
Which way?
Aren't we already on one?
Advisory no right turn.

[jnty]

Through road for buses?

Do we assume the narrowing just down the road was once, or was planned to be a bus gate?

Advisory no right turn.

Not actually a bad idea for junctions nearby a roundabout where turning right can be difficult at busy times.

[orudge]

'Interesting' pair of end of dual carriageway signs on this short S2 link road built as part of the A90 Balmedie - Tippery project, as it goes down to S1.

[swissferry]

I'm sure there's a more efficient way of signing this

Could compliance be better with prohibition signs than ahead only?

I agree both are regularly broken. However it is hard to compare as ahead only is more common where the road design makes it difficult to make a prohibited turn. I suspect some drivers don't understand ahead only prohibits turns.