Font or Typeface

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JamesGBmilestones
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Font or Typeface

Post by JamesGBmilestones »

Hi, I’m new here so I hope I don’t commit any faux pas.
I’m hoping to restore a few of the milestones and finger posts near me in West Dorset.
To start with, I’ve got permission from the Highways Agency (who don’t seem to care or be interested) and from the Parish Council (who care but have no money available in their budget) to restore the milestone in West Street, Broadwindsor, which is in a very sorry state.
76AE503F-D79C-45CC-A6E6-D3E3E7DBAE63.jpeg
I was just going to use the Old Road Sign font from roads.org.uk, but noticed that the R on the milestone
E9BB92B1-2C69-452A-B95E-26FECE8098CD.jpeg
looks different and wondered if anyone could point me in the direction of the correct Font to use?
Many thanks.
James
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Steven
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Re: Font or Typeface

Post by Steven »

Welcome to SABRE!

I hate to say this, but that looks like a replacement plate to me rather than the original - it has a relatively "modern" feel to it - 1970s maybe? I suspect the font is whatever the then-local authority used as it doesn't look to be anything specifically road-related.
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Bryn666
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Re: Font or Typeface

Post by Bryn666 »

Steven wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 07:42 Welcome to SABRE!

I hate to say this, but that looks like a replacement plate to me rather than the original - it has a relatively "modern" feel to it - 1970s maybe? I suspect the font is whatever the then-local authority used as it doesn't look to be anything specifically road-related.
I agree with Steven, it has a whiff of Helvetica to it. If you are able to source a copy of "AES Ministry" this may be a more true to original typeface than the 'Old Sign Font' which, whilst good, was recreated by eye by enthusiasts here.

I'm sure someone will say it's not a restoration if you replace the plate, but if you're going to the trouble to repairing the stone, repainting it, putting an authentic, albeit modern, plate is not going to ruffle any feathers.

Milestone preservation is a positive thing, it's not a faux pas to ask about it!
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JamesGBmilestones
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Re: Font or Typeface

Post by JamesGBmilestones »

Hi Steven and Bryn,

Thank you for your replies, which are very helpful.

I agree that the aluminium plate must be a recent addition. I intend to see if I can carefully unscrew the plate to see the stone behind. It may be that the stone is eroded or that the places and distances were removed during the war, which happened to a number of milestones in this area.

I’ve contacted the milestone society for their help and advice too. They said:
“Our records show this as DO_AXBE10, the only surviving milestone on the route from Axminster to Beaminster, controlled by the Chard Turnpike Trust. The trust was set up by Act of Parliament in the 1750s, but the milestone is thought to be a 19th century stone. Originally it would have been just stone, with the inscription cut into the front face. Limestone is subject to weathering and it appears that the original inscription has been lost. The metal plate is a late 20th century attachment to give the milestone a meaning, and it does seem to carry the correct wording and distances, according to the 1907 Ordnance Survey 25 inch map.
What to do?
Restoring the milestone to its original condition with the inscription re-cut in the stone would be difficult without an example of the style of inscription from another milestone in the series. It would be wrong to cut the stone with an incorrect inscription.
Replacing the plate with a more durable cast metal plate with the lettering either incised or standing proud would be a long term solution, but would not reflect the history of the milestone. There is a risk of damage to the stone in removing the old plate and fitting a new plate.
Repainting the existing plate, following the style of painting in the older photographs is the most straightforward option. This would be the least intrusive and would not prevent another solution being adopted in the future if more was learned about the milestone and its neighbours.”


My intention is to clean up the stone and paint it with a suitable whitewash and to repaint the aluminium plate with Humbrol enamel paint, using a stencil that I will make.

Bryn, would the AES Ministry at https://www.roads.org.uk/fonts be what you are referring to?

The B and R seem to me to be more ‘curvy’ than any of the fonts on https://www.roads.org.uk/fonts and I was wondering if I should be trying to replicate the 1970s(?) “restoration” of the milestone or just use the nearest font/typeface I can find, or use one of the ones from https://www.roads.org.uk/fonts ?
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Matthew
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Re: Font or Typeface

Post by Matthew »

JamesGBmilestones wrote: Wed Jul 21, 2021 23:14 To start with, I’ve got permission from the Highways Agency (who don’t seem to care or be interested)...
They're called Highways England now, but they probably won't be interested as it's not part of the strategic road network. It's more a point for your local highway authority.
Opinion is purely my own and all those other exceptions and excuses.
JamesGBmilestones
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Re: Font or Typeface

Post by JamesGBmilestones »

Matthew,
Thanks for the correction.
In fact, my mistake, it was Highways England (not Highways Agency) who referred me to Dorset Council and I got written permission from their Mr B Turner, Community Highways Officer, Dorset Council, so I hope I’ve covered all bases???
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Matthew
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Re: Font or Typeface

Post by Matthew »

Excellent. It sounds as if you've given due diligence to proceed at least.
Opinion is purely my own and all those other exceptions and excuses.
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Bryn666
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Re: Font or Typeface

Post by Bryn666 »

AES Ministry is available from Chris' site, yes.

If there's a hand drawn engraving under the panel then try and restore that but if all else fails a new plate is the best way forward. Good luck!
Bryn
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Chris5156
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Re: Font or Typeface

Post by Chris5156 »

JamesGBmilestones wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 13:50The B and R seem to me to be more ‘curvy’ than any of the fonts on https://www.roads.org.uk/fonts and I was wondering if I should be trying to replicate the 1970s(?) “restoration” of the milestone or just use the nearest font/typeface I can find, or use one of the ones from https://www.roads.org.uk/fonts ?
The lettering on the metal plate is almost certainly Helvetica - the uppercase R is distinctive enough to give it away. Helvetica is a commercial typeface first created in the 1950s and very widely used for corporate branding and typesetting purposes.

It’s up to you whether you replicate that or change the lettering to something else - I’d only offer the observation that, as the metal plate dates from the late 20th century, it doesn’t use a style of lettering that has any connection to the original milestone or even the era in which the milestone was created, and using some variation of AES Ministry wouldn’t have any connection either since it too is a creation of the 20th century, and was used on metal signs, not milestones. You’d be swapping one inauthentic font for another equally inauthentic font.

If you want to restore the plate to its original condition, I would restore it in Helvetica. If you want the plate to reflect the style of lettering the milestone would have originally had, you will need something that resembles serif lettering from the Victorian era, since sans serif lettering didn’t gain much popularity until the 20th century and a stonecutter in the 19th century was likely to use serifs.
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