No motorcycles
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No motorcycles
I've been up to Park Royal in London and noticed a road there with a no motorcycle restriction.
The only other place I can think of one off the top of my head is the centre of the A38(M), due to the slip hazards.
How common are these, and what are the usual reasons?
The only other place I can think of one off the top of my head is the centre of the A38(M), due to the slip hazards.
How common are these, and what are the usual reasons?
Re: No motorcycles
The nearest ones I know of are on public footpaths where anti-social behaviour orders are in place.
They're naturally 0% effective.
They're naturally 0% effective.
Bryn
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She said life was like a motorway; dull, grey, and long.
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Terminally cynical, unimpressed, and nearly Middle Age already.
She said life was like a motorway; dull, grey, and long.
Blog - https://showmeasign.online/
X - https://twitter.com/ShowMeASignBryn
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Re: No motorcycles
I think most of those are in places where all motorised vehicles are banned, but there are things like posts which would physically prevent cars, vans and HGVs using the path but you can't block motorbikes without blocking pushbikes.
I think the OP is mainly referring to roads where motorbikes are not allowed but other motorised vehicles are.
Re: No motorcycles
Yes, and that will be extremely rare to find because there's little reason to ban them from roads unless it's a unique situation like the death drain on the Aston Expressway.trickstat wrote: ↑Sat Dec 19, 2020 11:49I think most of those are in places where all motorised vehicles are banned, but there are things like posts which would physically prevent cars, vans and HGVs using the path but you can't block motorbikes without blocking pushbikes.
I think the OP is mainly referring to roads where motorbikes are not allowed but other motorised vehicles are.
Bryn
Terminally cynical, unimpressed, and nearly Middle Age already.
She said life was like a motorway; dull, grey, and long.
Blog - https://showmeasign.online/
X - https://twitter.com/ShowMeASignBryn
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@BrynBuck
Terminally cynical, unimpressed, and nearly Middle Age already.
She said life was like a motorway; dull, grey, and long.
Blog - https://showmeasign.online/
X - https://twitter.com/ShowMeASignBryn
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@BrynBuck
Re: No motorcycles
I remember once someone shows be a residential street with a motorcycle prohibition, which came about due to anti-social behavior. Cannot remember where it is though.
On the flipside, how many cycle tracks in the UK permit mopeds? - I know in some countries in Europe it is very common, but not so much here (mostly because its rare to find a road designed only for two wheels).
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.15865 ... 384!8i8192
On the flipside, how many cycle tracks in the UK permit mopeds? - I know in some countries in Europe it is very common, but not so much here (mostly because its rare to find a road designed only for two wheels).
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.15865 ... 384!8i8192
Re: No motorcycles
The older cycle tracks around Manchester permitted mopeds.
In particular on the Princess Parkway and around Trafford Park.
In particular on the Princess Parkway and around Trafford Park.
Bryn
Terminally cynical, unimpressed, and nearly Middle Age already.
She said life was like a motorway; dull, grey, and long.
Blog - https://showmeasign.online/
X - https://twitter.com/ShowMeASignBryn
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@BrynBuck
Terminally cynical, unimpressed, and nearly Middle Age already.
She said life was like a motorway; dull, grey, and long.
Blog - https://showmeasign.online/
X - https://twitter.com/ShowMeASignBryn
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@BrynBuck
Re: No motorcycles
Stevenage's cycle tracks permit mopeds. A privilege I remember being abused a lot by trials bikes in the '80s.
Re: No motorcycles
Yes, I was thinking specifically of No Motorcycles, rather than No Motor Vehicles or No Vehicles (except pedal cycles being pushed)
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Re: No motorcycles
I thought I saw one on the Chiswick fly-over in the 90s, just as I flew past it and went over it on my bike. Just looked on GSV and seen a blue 'car and motorcycle' only sign now though, so maybe I am mistaken.
Re: No motorcycles
I've found this sign not far from the hospital:
https://www.google.com/maps/@51.9225595 ... 312!8i6656
and this about a mile to the east:
https://www.google.com/maps/@51.9209766 ... k%3Fpanoid
However, this one is not far south of the first one:
https://www.google.com/maps/@51.91694,- ... 312!8i6656
I think mopeds tend to be allowed on the main arteries of the network but not so much on the branches or those parts shared with pedestrians.
Re: No motorcycles
Yeah, with Stevenage, I think that you'd probably need to trawl the legal orders - I suspect it's a real mess - I'd expect that mopeds are allowed on most of the segrated network that isn't shared space, but that much of that has lost its signage. And also that the newer paths might not have the same legislative permissions.
Given the standard of the Stevenage network, having a large amount of grade separation fro the roads, with separate foot and cycle lanes, I think it is right that mopeds and cyclists should share their part of the network.
Given the standard of the Stevenage network, having a large amount of grade separation fro the roads, with separate foot and cycle lanes, I think it is right that mopeds and cyclists should share their part of the network.
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Re: No motorcycles
Be thankful that UK legislation used a logical definition of what constitutes a motor vehicle - i.e. a vehicle with a motor - and applies restrictions accordingly.
Here, the lowest category of mopeds are permitted on cycle paths, and they are also basically usable without a licence. (That's not entirely true - you have to have a licence, but you don't have to demonstrate any competence to obtain one. This means that your licence can be revoked if you misbehave, but given that enforcement is nil that is only a theoretical difference from the requirements for people on pedal cycles.)
Theoretically, such machines are limited to 25 km/h (or is it 30, can't remember). But there is virtually nothing stopping people modding their engines to achieve higher speeds, and there is nothing to stop EU class 2 mopeds (restricted to 45 km/h) using cycle paths, as there is no possible physical restriction that would stop them but not smaller mopeds or cycles, and there is not enough obvious difference to make it socially unacceptable (as driving a car there would be).
Part of my problem is that a powered vehicle doing 30 everywhere is very different from a pedal cycle that may well do more than that on specific stretches but will mostly be well below 25, never mind 30. Another part is that one of the reasons I cycle on cycle paths is to avoid the fumes of ICE vehicles on roads. If you let these two-wheel Trabis on cycle paths you more than remove that advantage, since they are far smellier than your average family car.
Personally I would like to see ICE mopeds banned altogether, but failing that, getting them off cycle/footways would be a start. I'd be prepared to compromise on electric mopeds (by which I mean vehicles with the same characteristics as Vespas and similar, not e-bikes) providing their drivers had to abide by the same licence requirements as car drivers (i.e. pass a test, no driving before you're 18). But as a basic rule, motor vehicles belong on the motor vehicle highway, not the cycle path, as far as I'm concerned.
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Re: No motorcycles
Not exactly. Neither electrically-assisted bicycles nor mobility scooters count as motor vehicles (as long as they meet the relevant regulations), despite most definitely being propelled by motors. But I don't think anything with an internal combustion engine can avoid being classed a motor vehicle.
- FosseWay
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Re: No motorcycles
You are entirely correct, of course - I was using the definition somewhat loosely. The principal problems are with vehicles that are either capable of sustaining normal urban road speeds, or which are ICE-powered, or both, being able to use road space intended for NMUs (in which category I would place e-bikes and mobility scooters).SteelCamel wrote: ↑Sun Dec 20, 2020 18:01Not exactly. Neither electrically-assisted bicycles nor mobility scooters count as motor vehicles (as long as they meet the relevant regulations), despite most definitely being propelled by motors. But I don't think anything with an internal combustion engine can avoid being classed a motor vehicle.
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Re: No motorcycles
It relates to the Ace Cafe nearby on the other side of the old North Circular. Certain nights of the week - mostly Fridays I think, there was a lot of anti-social behaviour by a small minority of motorcyclists. The police would issue dispersal orders and I think the displacement effect meant they moved to the Twyford Abbey Road area near Park Royal. The ASB included burn ups, spinning donuts, loud exhausts etc.Lockwood wrote: ↑Sat Dec 19, 2020 11:15 I've been up to Park Royal in London and noticed a road there with a no motorcycle restriction.
The only other place I can think of one off the top of my head is the centre of the A38(M), due to the slip hazards.
How common are these, and what are the usual reasons?
And yes there used to be a No Motorcycles sign for the narrow flyover crossing the Chiswick roundabout.
By the way, a few years ago I had a really nice burger for lunch at the Ace Cafe one Friday. Most of the time it's absolutely fine!
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Re: No motorcycles
No, I think your terminology was accurate enough. Mobility scooters are legally motor vehicles, but as long as they are being used properly in accordance with the invalid carriage regulations, they are not subject to the other provisions of the RTA/RTO.FosseWay wrote: ↑Sun Dec 20, 2020 19:19You are entirely correct, of course - I was using the definition somewhat loosely. The principal problems are with vehicles that are either capable of sustaining normal urban road speeds, or which are ICE-powered, or both, being able to use road space intended for NMUs (in which category I would place e-bikes and mobility scooters).SteelCamel wrote: ↑Sun Dec 20, 2020 18:01Not exactly. Neither electrically-assisted bicycles nor mobility scooters count as motor vehicles (as long as they meet the relevant regulations), despite most definitely being propelled by motors. But I don't think anything with an internal combustion engine can avoid being classed a motor vehicle.
Ebikes had to be explicitly excepted in the same way as ride-on lawnmowers.
Re: No motorcycles
Are you thinking of the Hogarth Roundabout? The only flyover that’s ever existed at Chiswick is the one carrying the M4.
The Hogarth Flyover is now signposted with a blue “motorcycles and cars only” sign but I could easily believe that motorbikes weren’t always allowed.
Chris
Roads.org.uk
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Re: No motorcycles
You're probably right - the Hogarth roundabout. I just saw the word Chiswick in the yen powell post and repeated it. I haven't lived in London for nearly 19 years now. "Somewhere in west London" would have covered it with enough ambiguity!