National Highways signals bold new approach to roadworks

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darkcape
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Re: National Highways signals bold new approach to roadworks

Post by darkcape »

Chris5156 wrote: Sun Jul 24, 2022 01:05
darkcape wrote: Sat Jul 23, 2022 22:20Construction is evolving, structures around existing assets are getting more complex & techniques change to keep up. The railway has been doing this for years & now highways is catching up. A lot of a project's cost is time - quicker you complete the job, cheaper it is, so these options are attractive to NH.
I'm sorry but I really struggle to agree with this.

I understand that it makes things easier, cheaper and probably safer for those doing the construction work. That's fine. However, completing construction/maintenance as easily and cheaply as possible is not the only object of the exercise. Roads and railways exist to get people from A to B and shutting them down for extended periods is shutting down a public service that people rely on. The railway likes railway closures, but it seems to me that the public do not - they are an absolute pain and they drive people away from train travel. Just because Network Rail has been getting away with sticking two fingers up to the travelling public every bank holiday weekend doesn't mean this is a terrific example for National Highways to follow.

An extended closure of several days might be the right solution for a particularly difficult job where there is no reasonable alternative. I don't think I can get behind it as "business as usual". It would be a decision made entirely for the convenience of NH and their contractors.
With enough advance warning & robust plan in place the closures can go smoothly. The M42 was already shut for a week in 2021 and largely passed without incident.
Yes, one closure happening as a one-off between Christmas and New Year is survivable. But if this becomes business as usual are we looking at it happening at multiple locations nationwide every Christmas, Easter and August bank holiday. Combine that with half the railway network being switched off every weekend and bank holiday and you won't be able to get anywhere! As someone who doesn't work Monday to Friday 9 to 5, and who can't work from home, my journey to work is already screwed over by the railway companies every few weekends and I'm damned if I'm going to nod and smile while NH close off half the trunk road network too! :(

I realise that NH's press release talks about this being "considered" for some schemes where it will replace three years of lane closures and lower speed limits with a single week-long closure. That's fine. But the floodgates have already been opened with the M4 Smart Motorway works having the worst of both worlds - three years of lower speed limits and lane restrictions, plus closures of the whole motorway on what seemed like every other weekend for several years too, for work that seemed entirely routine. That was project planning totally for the benefit of the project and it's a scandal. My fear is that contractors were already likely to see that precedent as an opportunity to arrange future projects that way if it suited them, and this policy shift will only make that more likely.
All valid points Chris & perhaps my initial short comment didn't fully explain my thinking.

The industry is essentially being caught in the middle here. Highways construction has been throttled due to reduced budgets & ever-increasing safety requirements (not necessarily a bad thing) - which basically means it is difficult to throw lots of resources at, for example, a Smart Motorways upgrade where your workzone is typically only 3.5m wide.

Government, clients & industry bodies tell us to innovate, step into 21st century, embrace new technologies, BIM, off-site fabrication, modular construction, DfMA etc.

On the other hand, public & motorists are sick & fed up of 25-mile long 50mph sections that last 3-4 years, & rightly so.

So the compromise/solution here that ticks some of the boxes is longer shutdowns - e.g for bridge installations etc.

It is not going to be the right solution for every site, as others have pointed out lots of motorway stretches struggle for suitable alternative routes. But if things are done properly & competently then disruption can be kept to a minimum.

I've worked two full daytime weekend closures of the M1, hundreds of night closures, & planned & managed 4 full daytime weekend closures of a major local junction, & long-term closures of other roads. With enough advance notice, advertising, buy-in from stakeholders, mitigation measures etc - it can be done well.

The new HS2 bridge that was moved into place 2 years ago on the M42 would've required at least 3 weeks of night closures if not more, plus many other lane closures. Instead all it took was one weekend. A lot of other HS2 structures over existing highways are following similar methods, so this shift in methodology is already happening. It just needs to be executed correctly.
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Conekicker
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Re: National Highways signals bold new approach to roadworks

Post by Conekicker »

darkcape wrote: Fri Jul 29, 2022 22:49
Chris5156 wrote: Sun Jul 24, 2022 01:05
darkcape wrote: Sat Jul 23, 2022 22:20Construction is evolving, structures around existing assets are getting more complex & techniques change to keep up. The railway has been doing this for years & now highways is catching up. A lot of a project's cost is time - quicker you complete the job, cheaper it is, so these options are attractive to NH.
I'm sorry but I really struggle to agree with this.

I understand that it makes things easier, cheaper and probably safer for those doing the construction work. That's fine. However, completing construction/maintenance as easily and cheaply as possible is not the only object of the exercise. Roads and railways exist to get people from A to B and shutting them down for extended periods is shutting down a public service that people rely on. The railway likes railway closures, but it seems to me that the public do not - they are an absolute pain and they drive people away from train travel. Just because Network Rail has been getting away with sticking two fingers up to the travelling public every bank holiday weekend doesn't mean this is a terrific example for National Highways to follow.

An extended closure of several days might be the right solution for a particularly difficult job where there is no reasonable alternative. I don't think I can get behind it as "business as usual". It would be a decision made entirely for the convenience of NH and their contractors.
With enough advance warning & robust plan in place the closures can go smoothly. The M42 was already shut for a week in 2021 and largely passed without incident.
Yes, one closure happening as a one-off between Christmas and New Year is survivable. But if this becomes business as usual are we looking at it happening at multiple locations nationwide every Christmas, Easter and August bank holiday. Combine that with half the railway network being switched off every weekend and bank holiday and you won't be able to get anywhere! As someone who doesn't work Monday to Friday 9 to 5, and who can't work from home, my journey to work is already screwed over by the railway companies every few weekends and I'm damned if I'm going to nod and smile while NH close off half the trunk road network too! :(

I realise that NH's press release talks about this being "considered" for some schemes where it will replace three years of lane closures and lower speed limits with a single week-long closure. That's fine. But the floodgates have already been opened with the M4 Smart Motorway works having the worst of both worlds - three years of lower speed limits and lane restrictions, plus closures of the whole motorway on what seemed like every other weekend for several years too, for work that seemed entirely routine. That was project planning totally for the benefit of the project and it's a scandal. My fear is that contractors were already likely to see that precedent as an opportunity to arrange future projects that way if it suited them, and this policy shift will only make that more likely.
All valid points Chris & perhaps my initial short comment didn't fully explain my thinking.

The industry is essentially being caught in the middle here. Highways construction has been throttled due to reduced budgets & ever-increasing safety requirements (not necessarily a bad thing) - which basically means it is difficult to throw lots of resources at, for example, a Smart Motorways upgrade where your workzone is typically only 3.5m wide.

Government, clients & industry bodies tell us to innovate, step into 21st century, embrace new technologies, BIM, off-site fabrication, modular construction, DfMA etc.

On the other hand, public & motorists are sick & fed up of 25-mile long 50mph sections that last 3-4 years, & rightly so.

So the compromise/solution here that ticks some of the boxes is longer shutdowns - e.g for bridge installations etc.

It is not going to be the right solution for every site, as others have pointed out lots of motorway stretches struggle for suitable alternative routes. But if things are done properly & competently then disruption can be kept to a minimum.

I've worked two full daytime weekend closures of the M1, hundreds of night closures, & planned & managed 4 full daytime weekend closures of a major local junction, & long-term closures of other roads. With enough advance notice, advertising, buy-in from stakeholders, mitigation measures etc - it can be done well.

The new HS2 bridge that was moved into place 2 years ago on the M42 would've required at least 3 weeks of night closures if not more, plus many other lane closures. Instead all it took was one weekend. A lot of other HS2 structures over existing highways are following similar methods, so this shift in methodology is already happening. It just needs to be executed correctly.
And there's the problem right there. Sooner rather than later, someone is going to push for this on a scheme where it isn't practical but the full closure will go ahead anyway because "doing what the client wants". Causing disruption, delay and chaos (but hopefully not casualties), bringing the whole thing into disrepute.
Patience is not a virtue - it's a concept invented by the dozy beggars who are unable to think quickly enough.
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