Bad speed limits

[punyXpress]

From Roavin: " It was revealed that there were zero tickets given out in one year to drivers exceeding 20mph limits in York. What a bloody joke. "
Probably York's idea to offset the vast amount of 'fines' levied some time ago. They were proved illegal, but York wriggled like eels to avoid repayment. Having used number plate recognition to identify and punish the miscreants, they claimed they couldn't identify them to make the reimbursement!
Methinks there's summat rotten in the state of Yorvik.

[Duncan macknight]

That 50 limit (enforced by cameras!) on the A77 dual carriageway heading to the Ayr Bypass. It Was put there for the at grade tunings which are all gone now...

[Chris Bertram]

That 50 limit (enforced by cameras!) on the A77 dual carriageway heading to the Ayr Bypass. It Was put there for the at grade tunings which are all gone now...

There is a 60 limit on A45 between Canley and the NEC junction, which was justified by at-grade crossings. These have now all been stopped up, but the 60 remains on what is a good quality road that would be a no-brainer for NSL anywhere else.

[Roavin]

Suprisingly, the A64 Barton Hill section is still NSL, despite all the junctions being at-grade.

[NICK 647063]

Suprisingly, the A64 Barton Hill section is still NSL, despite all the junctions being at-grade.

I don’t think they will ever reduce the speed limit there they have already completely rebuilt the Junction and staggered it and still accidents are often but a flyover gets mentioned more than putting a reduced speed limit in place, I know further along at Welburn after 4 pedestrians were killed in 2 separate accidents only a month apart residents asked about having a 50 limit installed as cars come off the dual carriageway onto the single section fast and its a Crossroads on the brow of a hill but again they don’t want to lower the limit, instead new crossings are proposed but I don’t think that will help.

I was around north Leeds today and was avoiding the roadworks on the ring road so cut across through Wike towards Harewood and noticed even the roads out in the country have 30 limits now, surely this is against the criteria set out which does say 30 limits should be in built up areas also I really think it waters down the effectiveness of the 30 limit in the villages as very few can take it seriously when it’s a blanket limit out in the middle of nowhere.

[Stevie D]

I agree with you about the A64 between the A1(M) and A6210. It's funny how HE refused to even put 50 limits in villages with houses on both sides, yet agrees to put a 50 and even a 40 limit on an almost completely rural sect of literally the same trunk road.

The A64 is only trunk between the A1(M) and Scarbados ... the section between the A1(M) and Leeds is non-trunk, so that road is nothing to do with Highways England but is the responsibility of Leeds City Council – and like all five of the West Riding councils, they have a fetish for putting in absurdly low speed limits that remove all credibility.

[Roavin]

I agree with you about the A64 between the A1(M) and A6210. It's funny how HE refused to even put 50 limits in villages with houses on both sides, yet agrees to put a 50 and even a 40 limit on an almost completely rural sect of literally the same trunk road.

The A64 is only trunk between the A1(M) and Scarbados ... the section between the A1(M) and Leeds is non-trunk, so that road is nothing to do with Highways England but is the responsibility of Leeds City Council – and like all five of the West Riding councils, they have a fetish for putting in absurdly low speed limits that remove all credibility.

Ah. Sorry, that was my bad.

[NICK 647063]

The A64 is only trunk between the A1(M) and Scarbados ... the section between the A1(M) and Leeds is non-trunk, so that road is nothing to do with Highways England but is the responsibility of Leeds City Council – and like all five of the West Riding councils, they have a fetish for putting in absurdly low speed limits that remove all credibility.

Yes it was detrunked in the late 2000’s as were the Leeds outer ring road and many others, it left a slightly strange situation where it’s trunk road at the Bramham Roundabout then the first 200 metres or so are in North Yorkshire County Council’s control still left at 70mph then as soon as you see the 50 sign you are into Leeds City Councils control, the 50 limit as I say was added to reduce accidents as it had a bad accident rate although I would love to know how many were speed related! The fact is rather than slap 50 limits on why not deal with the real issue, that part of the A64 is going to be horrendous in a few years with the extra 10,000 new homes on that edge of Leeds not to mention the new ring road, it’s basically going to be 4 miles of single carriageway linking Leeds to the north and east as it also now takes most of the A58 traffic too as that road is all 50 and 30 with all A1(M) north traffic signed away from it towards the A64.

[skiddaw05]

I wonder if anyone has managed to exceed this one (it's 30 before here).

[Berk]

I wonder if anyone has managed to exceed this one (it's 30 before here).

Only if you're Alex deLarge racing a Durango95...

[Euan]

I'd be a bit concerned if any driver exiting the 20mph school zone were to take this speed limit seriously:

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@55.69713 ... 312!8i6656

[Berk]

I'd be a bit concerned if any driver exiting the 20mph school zone were to take this speed limit seriously:

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@55.69713 ... 312!8i6656

Nowt wrong with that. It’s only reminding drivers that the restricted road limit applies - including around the junction itself.

[danfw194]

This 30 to NSL near me just before a level crossing seems a little silly, in a sensible world the NSL should come after the crossing.

[RichardB]

I wonder if anyone has managed to exceed this one (it's 30 before here).

Or this one. Also 30 up to here and that's the end of the road just ahead.

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@59.12621 ... 312!8i6656

[DB617]

As much as I hate to say it (because it's white knuckle fun and on the route to our traditional West Wales family holiday) the A48/A40 D2 between Ammanford and St Clears with right turns across the carriageway and steep descents to at-grade roundabouts which are heavily congested is absurd and should be 60 instead of NSL at least. The line of the road is not too bad but turning across the gaps is damn near impossible and if a tractor gets caught in the short central island, the unfortunate cars behind hang out into a lane 2 which is flowing at 70-80. Lots of horrendous accidents up that way, less so on the M4 it feeds into between Ammanford and Swansea.

[Euan]

I'd be a bit concerned if any driver exiting the 20mph school zone were to take this speed limit seriously:

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@55.69713 ... 312!8i6656

Nowt wrong with that. It’s only reminding drivers that the restricted road limit applies - including around the junction itself.

There is a similar transition from 20mph to 30mph right in front of the roundabout coming from the B7048 as well:

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@55.69735 ... 312!8i6656

The speed limits themselves are okay as long as it is assumed by drivers that they could only be realistically and safely achieved once leaving the roundabout via an exit which does not pass through the school zone. I suppose keeping the roundabout out of the 20mph zone eliminates the need for extra speed restriction signage at the other exits. That would also explain the pedestrian barrier running all the way round the corner between the 20mph zones on the B782 and B7048, preventing anyone from crossing the road near the roundabout.

Obviously it's worth remembering that the 20mph speed limit only applies at the start and end of the day for the nearby school, so most of the time the speed limit signage will not be hugely significant to drivers.

[ajuk]

What are the worst speed limits you've seen on roads in the UK or Ireland?
Eg: 60km/h on rural dual carriageway
70mph single carriageway motorway
etc.

Most 20mph limits. Maybe with the exception of *part-time* limits around school gates (i.e. not 24/7/365 limits).

I don't even see the point of them, I was driving around Clevedon recently after school finish time and I was struggling to even do 20mph, who is prepared to go what is obviously too fast around a load of school kids who is also likely to pay any attention to a lower posted speed limit, who drives like that?

[ajuk]

I do wish the AA, RAC or some other motoring organisation would do an award for this, would be good to name and shame councils for doing this.

My nomination would be for the 30mph section of the Stoke Gifford bypass in Bristol or maybe the 30mph speed limit along Over Lane or the road between Yate and Westerleigh, but I think the award for worst speed limit has to go to this. I already thought 30 there was pretty stupid it should either be 40 or derestricted, although I'd lean towards derestricted and there shouldn't be signs telling people that 40mph is a safe speed to go down a road like that. When the limit in the village was reduced to 20mph they included the section of the route to the village from the bypass, it almost comes across like a mistake, and no one thought "hang on, that bit shouldn't be 20" or maybe effort is being made by South Gloucestershire Council to bring speed limits into disrepute, obviously it also means traffic entering the village doesn't encounter a drop in speed limit when entering it, it's also less than 2 miles away from a 40 limit like this, so you can add in non-uniformity in the extreme also.

[Owain]

A 20 limit in a town/city on a residential street is also not rare, unusual or absurd.

Neither rare nor unusual nowadays. But many *are* absurd, being applied to lengthy stretches of road where hazard density is not unusually high - the "blanket limit" approach. If 20 limits were restricted to areas of high hazard density - and preferably applied only during the hours where higher risk levels were in place - then they would command much more respect than they currently do. As it is, when the local cops can't be bothered to obey them, then ordinary motorists might be forgiven for questioning the purpose of those limits.

An absurd 20 limit has appeared in my road. A single 20 sign appeared a few months ago at the entrance to the street. A 20 was also painted in a circle on the road surface. Considering that it is a twisty, new-build residential dead-end where (a) it is hardly possible to do 20, let alone exceed it, (b) the police are never going to wield a radar gun in it, and (c) nobody is ever going to put a speed camera on it, the measure seems to be an absurd waste of money.

The cash spent on the sign, the paint, and the wages of the people who installed them would probably have been better directed at filling in the forty thousand holes in Blackburn, Lancashire Leeds. And the attention of the police would be better directed at lying in wait for the idiots who blast along the main road at the end of the street at anything up to 50, even though it has a 30 limit and several speed bumps. A few weeks ago I witnessed what was very nearly a head-on collision when a chav in a Golf overtook a UPS delivery van who had slowed to allow a car to turn out of my road! There's no point putting a 20 limit on it, because it would never slow down drivers like him.

[lefthandedspanner]

I think the best solution to this general problem is to give warning of a future speed ilmit decrease, without actually reducing the limit. Place a "the limit will be 30 in 300 yards" sign, likewise for 200 and 100 yards, and then place the speed limit reduction in the expected place, which should be just where the houses start. (If you're worried about compliance, you can place a speed camera at the very start of the limit; given the amount of warning, there's no excuse for still going too fast by the time you ge there.) This means that drivers can do the buffer-zoning themself in a reasonable way, and yet aren't forced to go too slowly while they're still a long way from the built up area.

This system is used widely in rural areas of Scotland. I can't think of any examples in England and Wales, and I have no idea why it is not used here, as it makes far more sense than the alternatives.

Some councils, e.g. Oldham, have adopted it on rural roads. They're particularly useful on hilly, twisty routes like the northern end of A672 where it's not at all obvious there's a village coming up.

Kirklees have tried something similar, except they do it at 50 yard intervals and put "150 yards", "100 yards" etc. instead of countdown markers, leading to signage clutter.