Interesting arrangement. You are correct in saying there is no prescribed mandatory U-turn sign or signal aspect, however somewhere on this forum I remember someone posting one. Think it was for a bus lane, but can't quite remember as it was a few years ago.tom66 wrote: ↑Mon Jul 18, 2022 19:27 Can't recall if I've posted it before... but there aren't that many u-turn traffic signals are there?
https://www.google.com/maps/@53.8065619 ... 384!8i8192
No u-turn aspect for the light - but I guess there isn't a proscribed one. Is the road marking legal though?
Unique Traffic Signals
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals
- MotorwayGuy
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals
I guess you mean the one near Waterloo, it's very strange but is probably clearer than nothing like the Leeds example, which is a horrible layout in general.jervi wrote: ↑Mon Jul 18, 2022 22:41Interesting arrangement. You are correct in saying there is no prescribed mandatory U-turn sign or signal aspect, however somewhere on this forum I remember someone posting one. Think it was for a bus lane, but can't quite remember as it was a few years ago.tom66 wrote: ↑Mon Jul 18, 2022 19:27 Can't recall if I've posted it before... but there aren't that many u-turn traffic signals are there?
https://www.google.com/maps/@53.8065619 ... 384!8i8192
No u-turn aspect for the light - but I guess there isn't a proscribed one. Is the road marking legal though?
Re: Unique Traffic Signals
Yeah, that one!MotorwayGuy wrote: ↑Tue Jul 19, 2022 14:06I guess you mean the one near Waterloo, it's very strange but is probably clearer than nothing like the Leeds example, which is a horrible layout in general.jervi wrote: ↑Mon Jul 18, 2022 22:41Interesting arrangement. You are correct in saying there is no prescribed mandatory U-turn sign or signal aspect, however somewhere on this forum I remember someone posting one. Think it was for a bus lane, but can't quite remember as it was a few years ago.tom66 wrote: ↑Mon Jul 18, 2022 19:27 Can't recall if I've posted it before... but there aren't that many u-turn traffic signals are there?
https://www.google.com/maps/@53.8065619 ... 384!8i8192
No u-turn aspect for the light - but I guess there isn't a proscribed one. Is the road marking legal though?
Re: Unique Traffic Signals
AFAIK the reason for the bizarre layout at this junction in Leeds is because there were grand plans to have a dual carriageway here that would go all the way up to Headingley and possibly beyond - you can see the bridge near Beckett University now used as a car park. Not sure if Woodhouse Lane was built early on before the scheme was scrapped - always thought the dual carriageway here is a bit of an aberration.
You can see a larger concrete pad where a different slip may have been positioned for joining this carriageway - it would probably go about where Broacasting House is right now and would probably be traffic-light controlled with routes into and out of the city.
I imagine even in the 70's when Leeds was pushing to have "more motorway! more roads! more car!" demolishing period properties along the University area would have been quite difficult politically so the whole thing died, and we end up with bizarre layouts like this making use of incomplete slips and junctions.
You can see a larger concrete pad where a different slip may have been positioned for joining this carriageway - it would probably go about where Broacasting House is right now and would probably be traffic-light controlled with routes into and out of the city.
I imagine even in the 70's when Leeds was pushing to have "more motorway! more roads! more car!" demolishing period properties along the University area would have been quite difficult politically so the whole thing died, and we end up with bizarre layouts like this making use of incomplete slips and junctions.
- MotorwayGuy
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals
This junction in Binley has had the signal heads replaced at some point between 2010-2012 and this approach was converted from a permissive right turn with filter to having two phases, but for some reason this lone Mellor was retained and had the green ball masked into an arrow.
Re: Unique Traffic Signals
That's a proper bodge! How on earth does that happen?
"Oi Dave, did you remember to order 11 new signals and the filter aspects?" "Nah, I ordered 10 signals. I thought we'd just try bodging the last one together for fun."
"Oi Dave, did you remember to order 11 new signals and the filter aspects?" "Nah, I ordered 10 signals. I thought we'd just try bodging the last one together for fun."
- MotorwayGuy
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals
The lamp columns have also been replaced, but the one that head is attached to has just been cut down. Maybe it's a listed signal head or something that can't be touched?
Re: Unique Traffic Signals
Maybe the plan was to put the new signal on the new lamp post but they never got around to doing it, so this "temporary" situation has endured.
Re: Unique Traffic Signals
Or possibly one of the heads got dropped while the contractors were trying to mount it, or otherwise damaged. And they bodged this and no one has noticed until now.
Re: Unique Traffic Signals
Rare installation here mellors with countdown timers retrofitted which I've never seen. I don't know why they didn't just change the pedestrian heads though to modular or refurbish the whole site. Also notice how they've used multiple types of countdown heads.
Re: Unique Traffic Signals
This setup with left and right only signs as part of the lights are so infuriatingly bad.
Side note: Rare use of an ahead only sign! And that's a lot of yellow boxes in a row (click down the road to see).
Side note: Rare use of an ahead only sign! And that's a lot of yellow boxes in a row (click down the road to see).
- traffic-light-man
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals
One of the requirements for the initial contracts to supply TfL with PCaTS was that there must be an option to retrofit them to Mellor-type signal heads. I suspect the TSL ones are original, the two Helios ones being casual maintenance replacements, but the one that's mounted to the Mellor seems to be struggling a bit.
There's a lovely old GEC cabinet on the corner there worth noting there, too!
Simon
Re: Unique Traffic Signals
Also, what have they done to the poles at that intersection? Bottom half has some weird material (anti-flyer?), then there's black terminal caps (the modern tall type)z whilst the top half of the poles are the standard "Mellor grey". Looks scruffy.
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals
In Russia, we have this sign for these cases.Skipsy wrote: ↑Sat Jul 23, 2022 18:30 This setup with left and right only signs as part of the lights are so infuriatingly bad.
Side note: Rare use of an ahead only sign! And that's a lot of yellow boxes in a row (click down the road to see).
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals
This traffic light junction, in the middle of a town, with pavements on all sides, doesn't have pedestrian signals or buttons.
https://www.google.com/maps/@53.1536094 ... 384!8i8192
https://www.google.com/maps/@53.1536094 ... 384!8i8192
Re: Unique Traffic Signals
Yeah there tends to be cases like this even in London like here which is a very dangerous place to cross. I have experience since this is near me.WhiteBlueRed wrote: ↑Tue Jul 26, 2022 13:12 This traffic light junction, in the middle of a town, with pavements on all sides, doesn't have pedestrian signals or buttons.
https://www.google.com/maps/@53.1536094 ... 384!8i8192
- MotorwayGuy
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals
I posted that one a while ago, the whole junction is a mess in an attempt to stop people from using the off slip and rejoining to skip the queue on the overpass.Skipsy wrote: ↑Sat Jul 23, 2022 18:30 This setup with left and right only signs as part of the lights are so infuriatingly bad.
Side note: Rare use of an ahead only sign! And that's a lot of yellow boxes in a row (click down the road to see).
That high-build paint seemed to be common in London in the 90s, presumably to make it harder to put stickers on them.
This used to be somewhat common with older Mellor sites. Sometimes the sites get upgraded on the cheap so everything is replaced like for like.WhiteBlueRed wrote: ↑Tue Jul 26, 2022 13:12 This traffic light junction, in the middle of a town, with pavements on all sides, doesn't have pedestrian signals or buttons.
https://www.google.com/maps/@53.1536094 ... 384!8i8192
Re: Unique Traffic Signals
Henlys Corner on the North Circular was like that for decades it was absolutely horrendous to cross over and outright dangerous. I'm surprised it lasted like that into the 2010s. Luckily its been sorted now.
Re: Unique Traffic Signals
Yeah its quite common on junctions where the crossing(s) would necessitate an 'all walk' phase like here and here. They're probably concerned with the efficiency of the motor traffic.
- traffic-light-man
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals
It's primarily a legacy from when pedestrian crossings were a luxury (to the pedestrian) generally only found in the busiest pedestrian areas. I don't think it's uncommon at all, though you'll seldom see it with new installations or proper site upgrades.
I can think of tons of sites in urban areas without pedestrian facilities. Liverpool is still riddled with four pole, eight head cross roads that are prime candidates for this, though admittedly those are dwindling in numbers as sites are upgraded.
Here's one that has somehow managed to last this long despite being on the high street.
I can think of tons of sites in urban areas without pedestrian facilities. Liverpool is still riddled with four pole, eight head cross roads that are prime candidates for this, though admittedly those are dwindling in numbers as sites are upgraded.
Here's one that has somehow managed to last this long despite being on the high street.
Simon