Unique Traffic Signals

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traffic-light-man
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals

Post by traffic-light-man »

They are indeed early vandal-resistant 'buttons'. They're meant to be terrible to try and use with gloves on, though I've never used one myself.
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals

Post by OliverH »

never seen a Mellor like this before: https://www.google.com/maps/@55.0261605 ... 312!8i6656
it has now been replaced with a LED traffic light
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L.J.D
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals

Post by L.J.D »

I always found this junction to be unique even before it was quite a unique shaped signal junction but then they added the gyratory onto it and you got warnings like this before it had so many split phases and lights but you never got warnings like that. Before the gyratory was added on you always had weird signal movements there and when the gyratory got added on it got even more strange.
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals

Post by MotorwayGuy »

Never seen this style of arrow in 300mm before:
https://www.google.com/maps/@52.6260136 ... 384!8i8192
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traffic-light-man
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals

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OliverH wrote: Tue May 10, 2022 15:11 never seen a Mellor like this before: https://www.google.com/maps/@55.0261605 ... 312!8i6656
it has now been replaced with a LED traffic light
It looks like it was the subject of vandalism with red paint at some stage. The replacement is also halogen, not LED.
MotorwayGuy wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 12:28 Never seen this style of arrow in 300mm before:
https://www.google.com/maps/@52.6260136 ... 384!8i8192
Those are Varitext fibre optic aspects with the diagram 3001.1 type arrow design, as seen in L.J.D's avatar above! They were also seen in a standard masked version as well, but those were incredibly rare and far more unusual than the fibre optic type and I'm not sure any of those survive on the street these days.
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals

Post by pjr10th »

https://www.google.com/maps/@54.9851407 ... 312!8i6656

Not sure why these lights in Derry have two amber aspects. It seems to be a green ball with an early cutoff. So not sure what the right one is supposed to do?
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals

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pjr10th wrote: Sat May 28, 2022 17:53 https://www.google.com/maps/@54.9851407 ... 312!8i6656

Not sure why these lights in Derry have two amber aspects. It seems to be a green ball with an early cutoff. So not sure what the right one is supposed to do?
It's a closing amber for the right turn indicative arrow, which have been permitted in Northern Ireland since the 70s, if I recall correctly. I believe they're generally used to terminate indicative arrows in late start arrangements, whereas where they are used in GB, they simply extinguish.

RoI use an identical set up, which I assume was the inspiration for these.

I quite like the idea, and I'd like to see them permitted in the UK (with arrow masks in the amber, of course). It'd primarily allow two things to happen. Firstly, it'd allow for flexible filter type arrangements with the ability to 'cancel' the arrow without needing to go through the full green of the parent phase. Secondly, it'd possibly encourage more use of late start arrangements across the country. There's flexibility for designers in that they can be used back-to-back with early cut offs, but the fact they are seldom seen outside the North West limits the use of this arrangement quite substantially.
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals

Post by L.J.D »

traffic-light-man wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 20:09
OliverH wrote: Tue May 10, 2022 15:11 never seen a Mellor like this before: https://www.google.com/maps/@55.0261605 ... 312!8i6656
it has now been replaced with a LED traffic light
It looks like it was the subject of vandalism with red paint at some stage. The replacement is also halogen, not LED.
MotorwayGuy wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 12:28 Never seen this style of arrow in 300mm before:
https://www.google.com/maps/@52.6260136 ... 384!8i8192
Those are Varitext fibre optic aspects with the diagram 3001.1 type arrow design, as seen in L.J.D's avatar above! They were also seen in a standard masked version as well, but those were incredibly rare and far more unusual than the fibre optic type and I'm not sure any of those survive on the street these days.


There was a few masked versions at this junction and the one with two arrows on it had a normal arrow mask and a split arrow mask which made it look unique. They have recently been removed now though :(
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals

Post by WhiteBlueRed »

traffic-light-man wrote: Sat May 28, 2022 19:12
pjr10th wrote: Sat May 28, 2022 17:53 https://www.google.com/maps/@54.9851407 ... 312!8i6656

Not sure why these lights in Derry have two amber aspects. It seems to be a green ball with an early cutoff. So not sure what the right one is supposed to do?
It's a closing amber for the right turn indicative arrow, which have been permitted in Northern Ireland since the 70s, if I recall correctly. I believe they're generally used to terminate indicative arrows in late start arrangements, whereas where they are used in GB, they simply extinguish.

RoI use an identical set up, which I assume was the inspiration for these.

I quite like the idea, and I'd like to see them permitted in the UK (with arrow masks in the amber, of course). It'd primarily allow two things to happen. Firstly, it'd allow for flexible filter type arrangements with the ability to 'cancel' the arrow without needing to go through the full green of the parent phase. Secondly, it'd possibly encourage more use of late start arrangements across the country. There's flexibility for designers in that they can be used back-to-back with early cut offs, but the fact they are seldom seen outside the North West limits the use of this arrangement quite substantially.
These amber arrows, for example, allow left turners to be given a green arrow during a right turn stage, with the next stage not being the left-turners road.
IMO they should've been introduced to mainland UK due to their usefulness.
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traffic-light-man
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals

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L.J.D wrote: Sat May 28, 2022 22:22 There was a few masked versions at this junction and the one with two arrows on it had a normal arrow mask and a split arrow mask which made it look unique. They have recently been removed now though :(
Do you know if there any others left knocking around? I'd really like to try and get hold of one of those masked aspects but I thought they were all long gone.
WhiteBlueRed wrote: Sun May 29, 2022 12:53 These amber arrows, for example, allow left turners to be given a green arrow during a right turn stage, with the next stage not being the left-turners road.
IMO they should've been introduced to mainland UK due to their usefulness.
The Irish ones don't have amber arrows, they're full aspects. I'm not sure if they've started deploying them with amber arrows in RoI following the introduction of red and amber arrows a few years back, though I've got a feeling indicative and filter arrows still just have full ambers.

I'm not sure they generally get used in the way you describe in NI, I've only seen them used in late start arrangements, but the flexibility of them operating in the way you mention is what I was alluding to in my last post. They definitely do get used like that in RoI, though.
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals

Post by L.J.D »

traffic-light-man wrote: Sun May 29, 2022 18:03 Do you know if there any others left knocking around? I'd really like to try and get hold of one of those masked aspects but I thought they were all long gone.
Damn it! If you'd have asked that question not that long back I'd have been able to tell you there were a few at that location that were bagged up and ready to be removed i think it had 5 or more in total. I've not seen anymore those were the last ones I saw and knew were left in West Yorkshire. Bradford had some but I'm guessing they are also long gone with the LED upgrades.
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals

Post by Bryn666 »

I have photos on an external HDD of some masked 300mm new style arrows in Kirklees somewhere but would need to dig it out tonight.
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals

Post by Jonathan24 »

traffic-light-man wrote: Sun May 29, 2022 18:03
L.J.D wrote: Sat May 28, 2022 22:22 There was a few masked versions at this junction and the one with two arrows on it had a normal arrow mask and a split arrow mask which made it look unique. They have recently been removed now though :(
Do you know if there any others left knocking around? I'd really like to try and get hold of one of those masked aspects but I thought they were all long gone.
WhiteBlueRed wrote: Sun May 29, 2022 12:53 These amber arrows, for example, allow left turners to be given a green arrow during a right turn stage, with the next stage not being the left-turners road.
IMO they should've been introduced to mainland UK due to their usefulness.
The Irish ones don't have amber arrows, they're full aspects. I'm not sure if they've started deploying them with amber arrows in RoI following the introduction of red and amber arrows a few years back, though I've got a feeling indicative and filter arrows still just have full ambers.

I'm not sure they generally get used in the way you describe in NI, I've only seen them used in late start arrangements, but the flexibility of them operating in the way you mention is what I was alluding to in my last post. They definitely do get used like that in RoI, though.
I'm not too sure of the terminology so my response will be in layman's terms but the only way I've seen them used in NI is to cancel the right turn filter arrow, without turning the signal to red for all junction movements. So, for example, if the possibilities at a junction are straight ahead with a right turn filter, the right turn filter might come on when the signal turns to green (or it might illuminate later on) but if there is no traffic seeking to exit the road on the right, then the right filter arrow will be cancelled by way of the second amber and the straight ahead movement will remain at green.
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals

Post by traffic-light-man »

L.J.D wrote: Sun May 29, 2022 20:36
traffic-light-man wrote: Sun May 29, 2022 18:03 Do you know if there any others left knocking around? I'd really like to try and get hold of one of those masked aspects but I thought they were all long gone.
Damn it! If you'd have asked that question not that long back I'd have been able to tell you there were a few at that location that were bagged up and ready to be removed i think it had 5 or more in total. I've not seen anymore those were the last ones I saw and knew were left in West Yorkshire. Bradford had some but I'm guessing they are also long gone with the LED upgrades.
That's sad news, please do keep your eyes peeled for more on your travels! :lol:
Bryn666 wrote: Mon May 30, 2022 14:30 I have photos on an external HDD of some masked 300mm new style arrows in Kirklees somewhere but would need to dig it out tonight.
I thought I had photographs of some in Bradford city centre, at the Godwin St/Sunbridge Rd junction but I can't find them so I think I might be making that up! Pretty sure the arrows existed, though, even if my photos don't.

Edit: GSV to the rescue, as can be seen here and here.
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals

Post by pjr10th »

L.J.D wrote: Fri May 13, 2022 09:40 I always found this junction to be unique even before it was quite a unique shaped signal junction but then they added the gyratory onto it and you got warnings like this before it had so many split phases and lights but you never got warnings like that. Before the gyratory was added on you always had weird signal movements there and when the gyratory got added on it got even more strange.
I can see why that warnings needed. Full on saw a fiat do a left turn into a red light today and drove right through it. Even hesitated up to it, but then sped up through it.
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals

Post by L.J.D »

Speaking of Ambers and arrows.
Does anyone have any pictures or GSV images of the MSH Intelligent Amber Arrow in use ? They were quite rare and unique as they'd display amber arrow and then a full amber ball when returning to red. I'm sure I saw some pictures on this forum but I can't seem to find them. Would be nice if someone had pictures or a video link.
It's a real shame we didn't invest much into the idea as it was really good.

Also speaking of MSH this signal is quite unique as the Red and Green are LED but the Amber is a standard halogen. My guess is that they couldn't find an LED replacement for the Amber so they just put a standard spare part in.
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals

Post by traffic-light-man »

Are you after photographs and videos of an amber arrow signal head full stop or specifically one in service?

There's still a few of the hybrid LED/Halogen Microsense heads kicking around, where the green arrow aspects are LED but the rest are halogen, however I suspect your example is the result of halogen aspects making suitable maintenance spares, like you say.
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals

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traffic-light-man wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 18:24 Are you after photographs and videos of an amber arrow signal head full stop or specifically one in service?
Just pictures or videos of a Microsense intelligent Amber arrow in use like when it's displaying the Amber arrow and then an Amber ball. They are really hard to find nowadays. I know there's some standard masked ones but the intelligent ones used LED arrays.
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Re: Unique Traffic Signals

Post by traffic-light-man »

I don't believe there are any of the original ones left in service now. They were only ever used for the four (IIRC) original Mott MacDonald trial sites and I think the last ones to be removed were the Nottingham ones.

It's a rubbish and edited video from a while ago, but here's one operating.

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Re: Unique Traffic Signals

Post by L.J.D »

traffic-light-man wrote: Sun Jun 05, 2022 12:01 I don't believe there are any of the original ones left in service now. They were only ever used for the four (IIRC) original Mott MacDonald trial sites and I think the last ones to be removed were the Nottingham ones.

It's a rubbish and edited video from a while ago, but here's one operating.
They were awesome. We're they connected to the controller or did they work like the countdown timers like stand alone displaying the Amber arrow. Must of been quite complex to set up. Thanks for the video though its nice to see one in action as they are a thing of the past now like you say.
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