Botched Roadsigns

[Nicholas]

There's this random speed sign in Ince, Wigan - no sign on the other side of the road, or one of a different speed on the other side of the lamp post:

[Gram587]

There's this random speed sign in Ince, Wigan - no sign on the other side of the road, or one of a different speed on the other side of the lamp post

In my area where there are 20mph speed limit signs there are never 30mph signs on the other side. Is it not a legal requirement to put a 30 sign up when entering a zone where 30 is higher than the previous speed then?

[TS]

There's this random speed sign in Ince, Wigan - no sign on the other side of the road, or one of a different speed on the other side of the lamp post

In my area where there are 20mph speed limit signs there are never 30mph signs on the other side. Is it not a legal requirement to put a 30 sign up when entering a zone where 30 is higher than the previous speed then?

I think possibly not, if they have the "20 Zone ends" sign with the grey circle ... ?? but I'm no expert!

[J--M--B]

They put a 40 mph on the main road but left a short narrow road into a car park and feeding a few houses National Speed Limit. It could possibly be some grand plan to save a couple of seconds going into the car park but it seems much likely that someone forgot about the side road when they changed the speed limit on the main road. Then, rather than keep quiet about it until things could be straightened out, some muppet used tax payers money to put NSL signs on this very minor short road. That is what most people would call a cock-up.

I doubt the road into the houses and car park is a trunk road, therefore any RTO on it would be separate from the one on the trunk road - and would be done be a different authority.
Transport Scotland couldn't have "forgotten" about it when doing the trunk road speed limit as it had nothing to do with them as it's not their road.

Maybe Highland Council didn't have it top priority of things to do so didn't get the order in place at the same time as TS, but TS wanted to get their new speed limit in place as soon as they could. And are you suggesting they should have not put up any terminal signs between the two different limits therefore making them both unenforceable?

But someone ordered and placed new NSL signs on the road, a bit of common sense was needed but it's only taxpayers' money so why should they bother.

[Gram587]

I think possibly not, if they have the "20 Zone ends" sign with the grey circle ... ?? but I'm no expert!

Well I have seen some areas that have the above signs but I`m pretty sure there are quite a few that don`t. Thinking about it, are my local 20 signs a legal limit or a suggestion as the signs that carry the limit have a green circle rather than a red 'prohibited' one?

[Big Nick]

Harlow is getting a new Leisure Centre! They're installing a set of crossing lights just 30m from the Crown Gate roundabout to mess up the traffic flow in a town known for numerous pedestrian underpasses.

The centre will open in 2010. Today I spotted a nice new brown sign pointing to the sea of mud, digger trucks and half-finished buildings telling me it's actually a Leisure Centre.....

[Gram587]

Harlow is getting a new Leisure Centre! They're installing a set of crossing lights just 30m from the Crown Gate roundabout to mess up the traffic flow in a town known for numerous pedestrian underpasses.

The centre will open in 2010. Today I spotted a nice new brown sign pointing to the sea of mud, digger trucks and half-finished buildings telling me it's actually a Leisure Centre.....

Unusual to see that, a sign which is installed over a year before the place it`s directing you to is built! People will be disappointed when they unpack their gym shorts to find themselves in the middle of a building site!

[orudge]

In my area where there are 20mph speed limit signs there are never 30mph signs on the other side. Is it not a legal requirement to put a 30 sign up when entering a zone where 30 is higher than the previous speed then?

There's a 20 sign in Flint on the A5119 heading past a school, but there is no 30 sign (or greyed-out 20, or similar) past the school. There is a 20 sign for the other direction, but if you've not been there before, you wouldn't know about it - you would think there should certainly be a 30 sign there!

[Gram587]

There's a 20 sign in Flint on the A5119 heading past a school, but there is no 30 sign (or greyed-out 20, or similar) past the school. There is a 20 sign for the other direction, but if you've not been there before, you wouldn't know about it - you would think there should certainly be a 30 sign there!

I find things like that amusing. Slightly OT but on the tram track in Blackpool at a road junction there is a sign stating '4' (4mph). However there is no sign to tell you when the 4mph zone ends. If the drivers fancied having a work-to-rule day they could have a field day with that! The trams run late enough as it is!

[Chris Bertram]

In my area where there are 20mph speed limit signs there are never 30mph signs on the other side. Is it not a legal requirement to put a 30 sign up when entering a zone where 30 is higher than the previous speed then?

There's a 20 sign in Flint on the A5119 heading past a school, but there is no 30 sign (or greyed-out 20, or similar) past the school. There is a 20 sign for the other direction, but if you've not been there before, you wouldn't know about it - you would think there should certainly be a 30 sign there!

My understanding is that at each entrance to a 20 zone there should be paired signs, backed with zone end signs restoring the proper speed limit. If any are missing, the zone loses its enforceability, and I can think of at least 2 examples like this in Birmingham (not telling which, the City council will have to find them for itself).

[Gram587]

My understanding is that at each entrance to a 20 zone there should be paired signs, backed with zone end signs restoring the proper speed limit. If any are missing, the zone loses its enforceability, and I can think of at least 2 examples like this in Birmingham (not telling which, the City council will have to find them for itself).

Ahh, ok thanks for that. That means that NO 20 zones on the Fylde Coast (that I have seen) are legally enforceable as all of them tell you where the zone begins but none of them tell you where it ends!

[kieron]

There's a pair of 29mph signs somewhere that I need to take a snap of sometime.

Is this on a public road? There are signs like those at the entrance to Connah's Quay power station. There are 30 signs on the back of them, which I always thought was a nice touch.

There's a 20 sign in Flint on the A5119 heading past a school, but there is no 30 sign (or greyed-out 20, or similar) past the school. There is a 20 sign for the other direction, but if you've not been there before, you wouldn't know about it - you would think there should certainly be a 30 sign there!

They don't denote a 20 limit, as they don't have red borders. As such, the council are not allowed to put a real 30 sign downhill from there. I don't know whether a fake one in the same style would fall foul of the same rule.

I haven't seen anyone slow down for either those signs or the ones on the A548, so I don't think the absence of a sign cancelling them is a real problem.

[nowster]

There's a pair of 29mph signs somewhere that I need to take a snap of sometime.

Is this on a public road? There are signs like those at the entrance to Connah's Quay power station. There are 30 signs on the back of them, which I always thought was a nice touch.

Those are the ones.

[sgill77]

I think I've mentioned it before, but the main road through Rugeley Power Station has a 19 mph limit posted on it, whilst all of the side roads have 9 mph limits. Next time I'm there I'll try to remember to get a picture.

[Pleydell]

There's a pair of 29mph signs somewhere that I need to take a snap of sometime.

Is this on a public road? There are signs like those at the entrance to Connah's Quay power station. There are 30 signs on the back of them, which I always thought was a nice touch.

29 because 30 is just too much.

[Gram587]

29 because 30 is just too much.

Can anybody explain to me what exactly the point is in having a 29mph speed limit rather than plain old 30?

[sgill77]

I didn't think limits in multiples of anything other than 10 were permitted anyway, but I suppose the reasoning is that you can't legally sign a 30 limit if the street lamps are close enough together, so setting the limit to something other than 30 is a way around this.

[jcpren]

I didn't think limits in multiples of anything other than 10 were permitted anyway, but I suppose the reasoning is that you can't legally sign a 30 limit if the street lamps are close enough together, so setting the limit to something other than 30 is a way around this.

I can suggest a couple of other possible lines of reasoning (though I don't necessarily agree with them):

* The enforcement equipment has been set to trigger at 30mph, and the advertised maximum speed limit has to be lower than that.

* It is clear that a speed limit of 29mph has been set very precisely, unlike 30mph, which is a round number. There's an associated implication that the limit might be enforced very strictly.

[ziltro]

The only road traffic act enforceable speed restrictions are 20, 30, 40, 50 and 60mph. Anything else is "just a sign" or, occasionally, a reference to a bye-law. "20 zones" are a different affair.
Ok I'm sure it's possible to get a special authorisation for any other speed restriction, but I doubt they would authorise 29mph.
The law is a pile of paper which people have written on. The signs are there to show that these bits of paper exist.

[scynthius726]

Can anybody explain to me what exactly the point is in having a 29mph speed limit rather than plain old 30?

To reduce accidents by 5%?

(for the benefit of the doubt, this is a ****-take on T2K campaigns, I'm not being serious)