Upgrading the A66 and A69

[jackal]

I don't think a J43a is viable as it would increase traffic on the residential Brampton Road, Carlisle.

[Helvellyn]

Playing around with trunking and directions is less likely to have much effect now than it might once have done, with people just blindly following satnavs.

A 43a could be eastbound only.

[jabbaboy]

I don't think a J43a is viable as it would increase traffic on the residential Brampton Road, Carlisle.

Ignoring the park issues (tried to keep the alignment on the current road as best as it can be), I always think it's not a shame that it could be a bigger scheme which continues all the way into Carlisle and acts as a bypass for the A7 to the North aswell.



Something like that, would've massively speed up journeys into Carlisle from the North and East.

[Mapper89062]

Alternatively if the new junction is only intended for movements between A689 and M6 south, you could make it an M5 J10-type layout with just a freeflow loop in the northwest corner and a left turn sliproad in the southeast one. This also has the bonus effect of deterring infill development popping up to take advantage of the new junction.

[jackal]

Alternatively if the new junction is only intended for movements between A689 and M6 south, you could make it an M5 J10-type layout with just a freeflow loop in the northwest corner and a left turn sliproad in the southeast one. This also has the bonus effect of deterring infill development popping up to take advantage of the new junction.

The problem is that Carlisle traffic would U-turn to access the slip roads. This could be removed by dualling up to Linstock Rbt, with accesses LILOed, though this would add to costs significantly. The money might be better spent on a Warwick Bridge bypass.

[Mark Hewitt]

. The money might be better spent on a Warwick Bridge bypass.

Considering the costs of making an entirely new motorway junction, this is almost certainly true.

[Glenn A]

Alternatively if the new junction is only intended for movements between A689 and M6 south, you could make it an M5 J10-type layout with just a freeflow loop in the northwest corner and a left turn sliproad in the southeast one. This also has the bonus effect of deterring infill development popping up to take advantage of the new junction.

The problem is that Carlisle traffic would U-turn to access the slip roads. This could be removed by dualling up to Linstock Rbt, with accesses LILOed, though this would add to costs significantly. The money might be better spent on a Warwick Bridge bypass.

Hell might freeze over first, but by passing Warwick Bridge is the answer as the Brampton- Carlisle section of the A69 is the only section that is largely the same as it was 50 years ago. It's still busy as traffic from North East England has to use it to access Carlisle city centre and there is a huge industrial estate and auction mart just to west of jct 43 of the M6.

[jabbaboy]

Been a lot of discussion about Warwick Bridge, but wonder if one way to reduce the traffic through there might to build a bypass of Kirkby Steven and sort out the low bridge instead.

Once the A66 dualling is complete, for anyone heading South down the M6, it would be quicker head down to Scotch Corner then across the A66 then down the A685 instead. Even for the lakes, anywhere South of the Tyne would be quicker via the A66.

Would give HGV's an alternative aswell since they can't use it at all currently and give much better links from the North West to the North East.

[Owain]

Been a lot of discussion about Warwick Bridge, but wonder if one way to reduce the traffic through there might to build a bypass of Kirkby Steven and sort out the low bridge instead.

Once the A66 dualling is complete, for anyone heading South down the M6, it would be quicker head down to Scotch Corner then across the A66 then down the A685 instead. Even for the lakes, anywhere South of the Tyne would be quicker via the A66.

Would give HGV's an alternative aswell since they can't use it at all currently and give much better links from the North West to the North East.

I was under the impression that the A685 was already the default option for M6(S) traffic. Other than Kirkby Stephen, it's a pretty good road.

Anybody know how long the HGV ban has been in place? I wasn't aware that there was one!

[Mark Hewitt]

Been a lot of discussion about Warwick Bridge, but wonder if one way to reduce the traffic through there might to build a bypass of Kirkby Steven and sort out the low bridge instead.

Once the A66 dualling is complete, for anyone heading South down the M6, it would be quicker head down to Scotch Corner then across the A66 then down the A685 instead. Even for the lakes, anywhere South of the Tyne would be quicker via the A66.

Would give HGV's an alternative aswell since they can't use it at all currently and give much better links from the North West to the North East.

I was under the impression that the A685 was already the default option for M6(S) traffic. Other than Kirkby Stephen, it's a pretty good road.

Anybody know how long the HGV ban has been in place? I wasn't aware that there was one!

Yes this is the route we always take when headed for the South Lakes. As beyond this point the A66 kicks North, which is fine if you consider the A66 a Scotland-bound road. A685 is mostly fine, I especially like the steep hill you have to climb. Kirkby Stephen is not too much of an issue, I just wish it was a nicer place to stop en-route, we have tried a few places there but none of them are that nice, even Costa was disappointing.

[Helvellyn]

Yes this is the route we always take when headed for the South Lakes. As beyond this point the A66 kicks North, which is fine if you consider the A66 a Scotland-bound road. A685 is mostly fine, I especially like the steep hill you have to climb. Kirkby Stephen is not too much of an issue, I just wish it was a nicer place to stop en-route, we have tried a few places there but none of them are that nice, even Costa was disappointing.

That's a pity, I've never actually stopped off in the middle of Kirkby Stephen (it's usually a bit outside for model railway research), although I've been through it numerous times. It's a town I've always liked the look of.

[NICK 647063]

Been a lot of discussion about Warwick Bridge, but wonder if one way to reduce the traffic through there might to build a bypass of Kirkby Steven and sort out the low bridge instead.

Once the A66 dualling is complete, for anyone heading South down the M6, it would be quicker head down to Scotch Corner then across the A66 then down the A685 instead. Even for the lakes, anywhere South of the Tyne would be quicker via the A66.

Would give HGV's an alternative aswell since they can't use it at all currently and give much better links from the North West to the North East.

I was under the impression that the A685 was already the default option for M6(S) traffic. Other than Kirkby Stephen, it's a pretty good road.

Anybody know how long the HGV ban has been in place? I wasn't aware that there was one!

I think the A685 weight limit was added in the late 90’s I would assume, I know the A685 appeared on a TV programme called Britains most dangerous roads, I can’t remember all the roads featured but I know the A47 at Thorney was with villagers demanding a bypass……. But the issue raised about the A685 was trucks hitting a property in the centre of Kirby Stephen, it’s since had the weight limit and signals added to allow one direction at a time.

[tibsy]

.... The money might be better spent on a Warwick Bridge bypass.

At last! For people from Tyneside wanting to go South on the M6 this (the proper A69) is the best route, not being fobbed-off with the A689 that goes right round to the North of Carlisle before it meets the M6, nor the A66 that we would have to go all the way to Scotch Corner to even start accessing (and then it goes North again!). It just needs Warwick Bridge bypassing then its a great route accross to the M6.

[jabbaboy]

At last! For people from Tyneside wanting to go South on the M6 this (the proper A69) is the best route, not being fobbed-off with the A689 that goes right round to the North of Carlisle before it meets the M6, nor the A66 that we would have to go all the way to Scotch Corner to even start accessing (and then it goes North again!). It just needs Warwick Bridge bypassing then its a great route accross to the M6.

I live in Tyneside, from where I live it's 93 mile via the A1(M)/A66/A685 vs 104 mile A69/M6 (North East of the city).

It's really not longer, the M6 heads in a SE Direction from Carlisle so going via the A69 your heading miles West to head back East.

Unless you live near the Newcastle Western Bypass it's 50/50, anywhere South of the water the A66 will be quicker.

The route to Blackpool was always via Bishop Auckland and Barnard Castle but with the improvements of the A66, 'cutting the corner' doesn't make sense anymore. It's 83 miles that way, if you're counting miles for whatever reason - by far the shortest.

[Mark Hewitt]

At last! For people from Tyneside wanting to go South on the M6 this (the proper A69) is the best route, not being fobbed-off with the A689 that goes right round to the North of Carlisle before it meets the M6, nor the A66 that we would have to go all the way to Scotch Corner to even start accessing (and then it goes North again!). It just needs Warwick Bridge bypassing then its a great route accross to the M6.

I live in Tyneside, from where I live it's 93 mile via the A1(M)/A66/A685 vs 104 mile A69/M6 (North East of the city).

It's really not longer, the M6 heads in a SE Direction from Carlisle so going via the A69 your heading miles West to head back East.

Unless you live near the Newcastle Western Bypass it's 50/50, anywhere South of the water the A66 will be quicker.

The route to Blackpool was always via Bishop Auckland and Barnard Castle but with the improvements of the A66, 'cutting the corner' doesn't make sense anymore. It's 83 miles that way, if you're counting miles for whatever reason - by far the shortest.

Yes: it can be surprisingly close.

If you start on the Tyne Bridge to get to M6 Penrith via A69 is 75 miles. Via A66 is 96 miles

However from Chester-le-Street both the A69 and A66 are exactly the same at 85 miles. So unless we are heading anywhere North of Keswick the A66 is the road we choose as it entirely avoids the A1 Western Bypass and the A66 is a faster road with more dualed sections than the A69.

[KeithW]

I was under the impression that the A685 was already the default option for M6(S) traffic. Other than Kirkby Stephen, it's a pretty good road.

Anybody know how long the HGV ban has been in place? I wasn't aware that there was one!

HGV's of 18 tons or more have been banned on that road since 2016 as I recall, there are however exceptions mainly for local agricultural vehicles. At times the queue of slow moving traffic through Kirkby Stephen used to be very long and made life in town a real pain.
https://www.cumbria.gov.uk/elibrary/Con ... 316344.pdf

[TomJ]

Another legal challenge has been started... Joy of joys.

https://penrith.town/news/environmental ... SbN8655R6k

[Chris56000]

. . .I hope one (or more!) of them, whoever they are, gets involved in a serious accident on the unimproved sections of the A66 they're trying to stop getting rebuilt to a much safer standard – it might stop all this constant nonsense once and for all!

. . .Having been involved myself in an appalling hit–and–run on the A428 at Eltisley that permanently affected my eyesight afterwards, I have no sympathy whatsoever for these people!

Chris Williams

[KeithW]

That's a pity, I've never actually stopped off in the middle of Kirkby Stephen (it's usually a bit outside for model railway research), although I've been through it numerous times. It's a town I've always liked the look of.

There is a chippy there that we used to stop at if it was open, still there it seems from GSV.