Wonky arrow signs - when were they phased out?

[Stevie D]

There's a copy-cat wonky sign on the A3 S/B approaching the A31 junction HERE

There's a good reason for that one though ... the diverge is pretty much straight ahead, and "straight ahead" is a clear bend to the right.

[Berk]

That’s what I assumed was behind the original motorway designs.

[mubd1234]

Another NSW wonky fork sign. This one probably validates the fact that these were copies of the British signs, as it also has the stubby straight-on arrow.



Looks like this one was originally designed with imperial measurements in mind, as this section of road was opened in December 1972 - 18 months prior to the metric conversion. That '2 km' legend at the bottom looks like it's a modification to the sign (it looks poorly aligned).

It makes sense because the sign in the photo is approximately 1.6km from the exit.

For those who are interested, the equivalent sign now looks like...

[Bryn666]

Great find, by the way.

[Robert Kilcoyne]

This fork sign still exists on the northbound A77 near Symington:-

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@55.56769 ... 6656?hl=en

[Chris Bertram]

This fork sign still exists on the northbound A77 near Symington:-

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@55.56769 ... 6656?hl=en

Not a classic wonky arrow, though, it's a much more modern sign indicating that the main carriageway curves somewhat to the right through the junction.

[Darren]

A bit of a bump, but as I mentioned the signs earlier in the thread - I've found a video on YouTube showing all the original M2 J5 coastbound signs, just as I remembered them from the 80s.

The video was taken in 1964, not long after the M2 opened, and aside from there being barely any traffic (unlike today), the red hard shoulder, the very thick line dividing the shoulder from the road, and the complete lack of crash barriers really stand out! I think within 20 years those features had all gone. It's also interesting to see no junction numbers on the signs. I can only presume that the names of the junctions (e.g. "Stockbury Interchange") were used instead? Or maybe people just said "The Sittingbourne junction"...
Numbers had been added to those wonky signs by the time they were replaced.

The signs were replaced twice in a relatively short time. Once when the "wonky" signs went, then again once the Channel Tunnel opened. That was when the special "ports" signs were added both to the M2 and the M20... and they became outdated immediately, as the Sheerness car ferry service stopped in the same year.

m2-1.jpg (9.43 KiB) Viewed 1052 times

m2-3.jpg (10.43 KiB) Viewed 1052 times

Video link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2zReK7gVIw

[Steven]

It's also interesting to see no junction numbers on the signs. I can only presume that the names of the junctions (e.g. "Stockbury Interchange") were used instead? Or maybe people just said "The Sittingbourne junction"...
Numbers had been added to those wonky signs by the time they were replaced.

There were no junction numbers in 1964, so yes, they wouldn't have been shown on the signage at that time.

They were added in 1966 - 1966 Route Planning Map on SABRE Maps compared to the 1967 edition.

And yes, they were generally referred to as "the XYZ junction".


There's a whole article about Junction numbers on the SABRE Wiki.

[Darren]

There were no junction numbers in 1964, so yes, they wouldn't have been shown on the signage at that time.

They were added in 1966

And yes, they were generally referred to as "the XYZ junction".

There's a whole article about Junction numbers on the SABRE Wiki.

Thank you for the links - I'd (naively) assumed that all the motorways came with junction numbers right at the start.

That 1967 map you linked was very optimistic, wasn't it? Not only is there an A2(M) extending west of the M2, it shows a spur of the M2 towards Gillingham! (The A2(M) crops up many a time on here, but the Gillingham spur raised an eyebrow...)

[Steven]

That 1967 map you linked was very optimistic, wasn't it? Not only is there an A2(M) extending west of the M2, it shows a spur of the M2 towards Gillingham! (The A2(M) crops up many a time on here, but the Gillingham spur raised an eyebrow...)

Yeah, Route Planning Maps do have a bit of a habit of assuming anything built on a motorway alignment, or as part of a motorway contract, would be a motorway.

[Bryn666]

I say it a lot, but the simplicity of early motorway signs was its selling point. We've made motorway signing very cluttered and cramped now and that charm has been lost.

[MotorwayGuy]

It's also interesting that Margate was used as a forward destination instead of Canterbury, I wonder how far away it appeared then? It's now first mentioned at Junction 7 but back then it was obviously a more important destination, also indicated by the freeflow onto the A299 instead of the A2 there.

[wallmeerkat]

M2(NI) Ballymena Bypass has a wonky sign veering to the left.

Perhaps signifying that the mainline veers to the left, perhaps a relic of when the motorway was intended to go straight on (you can see some abandoned tarmac to the right)

https://www.google.com/maps/@54.8952972 ... ?entry=ttu

[Bryn666]

M2(NI) Ballymena Bypass has a wonky sign veering to the left.

Perhaps signifying that the mainline veers to the left, perhaps a relic of when the motorway was intended to go straight on (you can see some abandoned tarmac to the right)

https://www.google.com/maps/@54.8952972 ... ?entry=ttu

Think what staggers me more is NI still has concrete sign legs without any barrier protection!

[wallmeerkat]

M2(NI) Ballymena Bypass has a wonky sign veering to the left.

Perhaps signifying that the mainline veers to the left, perhaps a relic of when the motorway was intended to go straight on (you can see some abandoned tarmac to the right)

https://www.google.com/maps/@54.8952972 ... ?entry=ttu

Think what staggers me more is NI still has concrete sign legs without any barrier protection!

To be fair the M2 Ballymena Bypass is the motorway that time forgot, with it's kerbed hard shoulders etc. and only fairly recent years was the median grass mound replaced with a wire barrier.

Most signage like this is being phased out with the collapsible metal legs - https://www.google.com/maps/@54.645383, ... ?entry=ttu

[swissferry]

M2(NI) Ballymena Bypass has a wonky sign veering to the left.

Perhaps signifying that the mainline veers to the left, perhaps a relic of when the motorway was intended to go straight on (you can see some abandoned tarmac to the right)

https://www.google.com/maps/@54.8952972 ... ?entry=ttu

Think what staggers me more is NI still has concrete sign legs without any barrier protection!

To be fair the M2 Ballymena Bypass is the motorway that time forgot, with it's kerbed hard shoulders etc. and only fairly recent years was the median grass mound replaced with a wire barrier.

Most signage like this is being phased out with the collapsible metal legs - https://www.google.com/maps/@54.645383, ... ?entry=ttu

I have a memory from the late 90s of people selling something, maybe strawberries, on its hard shoulder. Anyone else recall this, or should I be concerned about my memory?

[Bryn666]

It's also interesting that Margate was used as a forward destination instead of Canterbury, I wonder how far away it appeared then? It's now first mentioned at Junction 7 but back then it was obviously a more important destination, also indicated by the freeflow onto the A299 instead of the A2 there.

Back in the day the M2/A299 was the main route because of the importance of Thanet as a tourist destination so Canterbury got ignored somewhat. Channel ports traffic was mainly routed along the A20 - there's a reason Ashford and Maidstone were bypassed just before Medway and also why Canterbury wasn't bypassed until 1980

[wallmeerkat]

Think what staggers me more is NI still has concrete sign legs without any barrier protection!

To be fair the M2 Ballymena Bypass is the motorway that time forgot, with it's kerbed hard shoulders etc. and only fairly recent years was the median grass mound replaced with a wire barrier.

Most signage like this is being phased out with the collapsible metal legs - https://www.google.com/maps/@54.645383, ... ?entry=ttu

I have a memory from the late 90s of people selling something, maybe strawberries, on its hard shoulder. Anyone else recall this, or should I be concerned about my memory?

I can recall this on the hard shoulder of the old WS2 A1 near Newry, I don't remember on the Ballymena M2 but it wouldn't surprise me

[AndyB]

M2(NI) Ballymena Bypass has a wonky sign veering to the left.

Perhaps signifying that the mainline veers to the left, perhaps a relic of when the motorway was intended to go straight on (you can see some abandoned tarmac to the right)

https://www.google.com/maps/@54.8952972 ... ?entry=ttu

Think what staggers me more is NI still has concrete sign legs without any barrier protection!

We certainly do. Most concrete legs have now been barriered off, to be fair, but of course the one thing we didn’t have at any time was concrete prongs. I remember floodlights standing in the verge pointing up at the signs in the days before retroreflectivity.

[wallmeerkat]

M2(NI) Ballymena Bypass has a wonky sign veering to the left.

Perhaps signifying that the mainline veers to the left, perhaps a relic of when the motorway was intended to go straight on (you can see some abandoned tarmac to the right)

https://www.google.com/maps/@54.8952972 ... ?entry=ttu

Think what staggers me more is NI still has concrete sign legs without any barrier protection!

We certainly do. Most concrete legs have now been barriered off, to be fair, but of course the one thing we didn’t have at any time was concrete prongs. I remember floodlights standing in the verge pointing up at the signs in the days before retroreflectivity.

Still the occasional concrete legged lit sign that hasn't been phased out, especially in the outer wilds of the motorway network

https://www.google.com/maps/@54.4828525 ... &entry=ttu