Pre-Hixon Disaster Signage.

[exiled]

I swear I replied and said that before I even saw your reply, even though you posted yours first!

Well, it does look like a caterpillar. One that is trying to show a bird that it is poisonous.

[KeithW]

Not operated by BR or ScotRail. The regular service is a diesel DMU. The Jacobite is a heritage train operating on the WHL from An Gearasdan to Malaig. It does not operate over winter either.

BR hasn't run any services anywhere since 1997 when it ceased to exist. The Jacobite is a timetabled service run by West Coast Railways , as with other routes such as the ECML other companies including Scotrail also operate this route.

Winter and summer timetables are of course quite common on many tourist routes, see the Winter Timetable for Northern Rail here.
https://www.northernrailway.co.uk/december22

[Helvellyn]

Not operated by BR or ScotRail. The regular service is a diesel DMU. The Jacobite is a heritage train operating on the WHL from An Gearasdan to Malaig. It does not operate over winter either.

BR hasn't run any services anywhere since 1997 when it ceased to exist. The Jacobite is a timetabled service run by West Coast Railways , as with other routes such as the ECML other companies including Scotrail also operate this route.

Winter and summer timetables are of course quite common on many tourist routes, see the Winter Timetable for Northern Rail here.
https://www.northernrailway.co.uk/december22

It's more like a railtour, albeit one running regularly. It's ticketed separately and does not appear in the national timetables, you can't get on the Jacobite with an open Fort William - Mallaig ticket.

There were some runs a little while ago on the Settle - Carlisle with Tornado which were described as timetables steam-hauled services, so presumably a standard ticket was valid on those.

[Bristol]

They (wig-wags) are also used for swing bridges. Rather important that they should stop for those.

In Bristol, the A3029 Plimsoll swing bridge has wig-wags installed, and I've seen them operating in the past, but for a couple of years they've been inactive and replaced with temporary traffic lights instead. I'm not sure why this is, but it doesn't make sense from an emergency vehicles perspective. Google map: https://www.google.com/maps/@51.4499349 ... 384!8i8192

In the old days of wig-wags, the flashing reds were certainly ignored by a lot of drivers, who drove past them on the ramp and then queued up in front of the gate further on. Not sure how compliance with the current lights is.

[jnty]

They (wig-wags) are also used for swing bridges. Rather important that they should stop for those.

In Bristol, the A3029 Plimsoll swing bridge has wig-wags installed, and I've seen them operating in the past, but for a couple of years they've been inactive and replaced with temporary traffic lights instead. I'm not sure why this is, but it doesn't make sense from an emergency vehicles perspective.

Emergency drivers should be able to use local knowledge and signage to make appropriate decisions when passing the temporary lights. Even passing normal temporary lights is presumably a quite carefully considered decision for emergency drivers given the possibility of causing a deadlock, so it's hard to imagine this setup would result in an ambulance flying off the bridge.

[tom66]

In Bristol, the A3029 Plimsoll swing bridge has wig-wags installed, and I've seen them operating in the past, but for a couple of years they've been inactive and replaced with temporary traffic lights instead. I'm not sure why this is, but it doesn't make sense from an emergency vehicles perspective. Google map: https://www.google.com/maps/@51.4499349 ... 384!8i8192

How odd. Those are battery powered units, so presumably someone is going out every week or so to swap the batteries over (there doesn't seem to be an obvious mains connection.) That can't be cheap. If this is intended as a permanent solution, why not install real traffic heads?

[KeithW]

It's more like a railtour, albeit one running regularly. It's ticketed separately and does not appear in the national timetables, you can't get on the Jacobite with an open Fort William - Mallaig ticket.

There were some runs a little while ago on the Settle - Carlisle with Tornado which were described as timetables steam-hauled services, so presumably a standard ticket was valid on those.

None of which contradicts my statement that it is a timetabled service, here is the timetable for 2023.
https://westcoastrailways.co.uk/jacobite/timetables

Their Rail tours are here
https://westcoastrailways.co.uk/railtours

[exiled]

It's more like a railtour, albeit one running regularly. It's ticketed separately and does not appear in the national timetables, you can't get on the Jacobite with an open Fort William - Mallaig ticket.

There were some runs a little while ago on the Settle - Carlisle with Tornado which were described as timetables steam-hauled services, so presumably a standard ticket was valid on those.

None of which contradicts my statement that it is a timetabled service, here is the timetable for 2023.
https://westcoastrailways.co.uk/jacobite/timetables

Their Rail tours are here
https://westcoastrailways.co.uk/railtours

It is timetabled so that it does not interfere with the ScotRail schedules. It is a heritage train on public rails and if WHL was used more at that point by ScotRail it probably would not be able to operate.

[Helvellyn]

It's more like a railtour, albeit one running regularly. It's ticketed separately and does not appear in the national timetables, you can't get on the Jacobite with an open Fort William - Mallaig ticket.

There were some runs a little while ago on the Settle - Carlisle with Tornado which were described as timetables steam-hauled services, so presumably a standard ticket was valid on those.

None of which contradicts my statement that it is a timetabled service, here is the timetable for 2023.
https://westcoastrailways.co.uk/jacobite/timetables

Their Rail tours are here
https://westcoastrailways.co.uk/railtours

Every train running on the network, apart from emergencies, is timetabled because paths have to be worked out months in advance.

One-off specials are timetabled. No train runs just when someone feels like it.

[exiled]

One-off specials are timetabled. No train runs just when someone feels like it.

Damn, there goes my plan for my own Royal Train. To be fair there were a couple of other reasons why it was not working.

Seriously, yes, timetables have been part of railway life as long as there have been railways.

[SouthWest Philip]

In Bristol, the A3029 Plimsoll swing bridge has wig-wags installed, and I've seen them operating in the past, but for a couple of years they've been inactive and replaced with temporary traffic lights instead. I'm not sure why this is, but it doesn't make sense from an emergency vehicles perspective. Google map: https://www.google.com/maps/@51.4499349 ... 384!8i8192

How odd. Those are battery powered units, so presumably someone is going out every week or so to swap the batteries over (there doesn't seem to be an obvious mains connection.) That can't be cheap. If this is intended as a permanent solution, why not install real traffic heads?

I would have thought a level crossing style barrier would be a more effective solution, alongside the wigwags?

[Lockwood]

Emergency drivers should be able to use local knowledge and signage to make appropriate decisions when passing the temporary lights. Even passing normal temporary lights is presumably a quite carefully considered decision for emergency drivers given the possibility of causing a deadlock, so it's hard to imagine this setup would result in an ambulance flying off the bridge.

You are assuming all emergency drivers stay in areas they know.

General rule for temporary lights is "go if you can see your exit". There were some by Chertsey years ago that were ridiculously long and had marshals that would set both sides to red and wave through when clear.


Double bend signs... Seen a set near me, but far enough I always forget where and often forget seeing them... One side is mirrored to the other. "Double bend or series of bends, first bend to left (right if symbol reversed)". I guess that means the road enters a quantum state on the first bend?

[Barkstar]

No train runs just when someone feels like it.

That is how it feels currently. TPE gave advanced notice on Tuesday that over 60 services would be cancelled on Wednesday. Chaos.

[Chris5156]

It's more like a railtour, albeit one running regularly. It's ticketed separately and does not appear in the national timetables, you can't get on the Jacobite with an open Fort William - Mallaig ticket.

There were some runs a little while ago on the Settle - Carlisle with Tornado which were described as timetables steam-hauled services, so presumably a standard ticket was valid on those.

None of which contradicts my statement that it is a timetabled service, here is the timetable for 2023.
https://westcoastrailways.co.uk/jacobite/timetables

Their Rail tours are here
https://westcoastrailways.co.uk/railtours

The buses that run past my house are timetabled services too. That doesn't make them National Rail services, and nor does the existence of a timetable make the Jacobite a National Rail service. It is, as has been pointed out in another thread recently, a charter service for tourists, just one that happens to run very often to a regular schedule. There are no steam-hauled public rail services in the UK.

[rhyds]

It's more like a railtour, albeit one running regularly. It's ticketed separately and does not appear in the national timetables, you can't get on the Jacobite with an open Fort William - Mallaig ticket.

There were some runs a little while ago on the Settle - Carlisle with Tornado which were described as timetables steam-hauled services, so presumably a standard ticket was valid on those.

None of which contradicts my statement that it is a timetabled service, here is the timetable for 2023.
https://westcoastrailways.co.uk/jacobite/timetables

Their Rail tours are here
https://westcoastrailways.co.uk/railtours

The buses that run past my house are timetabled services too. That doesn't make them National Rail services, and nor does the existence of a timetable make the Jacobite a National Rail service. It is, as has been pointed out in another thread recently, a charter service for tourists, just one that happens to run very often to a regular schedule. There are no steam-hauled public rail services in the UK.

Or, to put it another way, you can't buy a steam train ticket on National Rail Enquiries or The Trainline.

[JohnnyMo]

No train runs just when someone feels like it.

That is how it feels currently. TPE gave advanced notice on Tuesday that over 60 services would be cancelled on Wednesday. Chaos.

Then claims it doesn't need to refund passengers as the cancelled train was never scheduled (thankfully it did eventually pay up)

[JohnnyMo]

It's more like a railtour, albeit one running regularly. It's ticketed separately and does not appear in the national timetables, you can't get on the Jacobite with an open Fort William - Mallaig ticket.

There were some runs a little while ago on the Settle - Carlisle with Tornado which were described as timetables steam-hauled services, so presumably a standard ticket was valid on those.

None of which contradicts my statement that it is a timetabled service, here is the timetable for 2023.
https://westcoastrailways.co.uk/jacobite/timetables

Their Rail tours are here
https://westcoastrailways.co.uk/railtours

The buses that run past my house are timetabled services too. That doesn't make them National Rail services, ...

I assume those buses are pseudo rail services such as LNER Kings Lynn Service rather that simply timetabled by Arriva Hampshire or whoever the local bus company is.

[Helvellyn]

No train runs just when someone feels like it.

That is how it feels currently. TPE gave advanced notice on Tuesday that over 60 services would be cancelled on Wednesday. Chaos.

That's all too true. Work Christmas meal in town tomorrow, I'm wondering how many trains before the last one it's worth risking just so that I can get home.

[Chris5156]

The buses that run past my house are timetabled services too. That doesn't make them National Rail services, ...

I assume those buses are pseudo rail services such as LNER Kings Lynn Service rather that simply timetabled by Arriva Hampshire or whoever the local bus company is.

No, they're just buses. My point is that the existence of a timetable doesn't prove that something is a National Rail service. Anything can have a timetable.

[Glen]

Note that the new signage for user worked crossings is used at the crossing, as part of the instructions for use, the advance warning on the road is still the picket gate symbol.
The purpose of the new warning diagram is to convey to a driver stopped at the gate is that the gate in front of them is to cross a railway line and forms part of the new, clearer, instructions to use the crossing.