The state of our road network

[Brenley Corner]

I see endless moaning on Facebook (other social media is available) about this pothole or that pothole but more often than not these people would rather moan in public than report the fault to their council.

They seem to believe that councils can detect potholes remotely/automatically, or perhaps via extra sensory perception - or that it is not their role to report things.
In my experience when I report a pothole to our county council (Kent) via their portal, they do attend site and make a temporary repair if required, with a more permanent solution often following. I have even had the inspecting engineer ring me up to let me know what's happening.

[Runwell]

The obsession over using stone mastic asphalt hasn’t helped the decline either. I’ve seen a lot of stretches of road where stone mastic asphalt surfacing has been replaced more than once, and other stretches with hot rolled asphalt which have been there for over thirty years.

I've noticed it doesn't seem to last as long, and it often feels less smooth as well.

One thing this isn't helping with the current situation (at least in Notts) is that they're reacting to the bigger and more dangerous potholes by simply tamping a load of tarmac into the hole. No attempts to tidy the hole up prior to patching, and almost never sealed around the edges. This means the repairs last a month or so before needing doing again, therefore taking up more time that could be spent patching other areas. They filled in a series of quite deep potholes down the bottom of my street. It's not a mega busy bit of road but it serves a good chunk of my estate. The holes were awfully patched about a month ago, and they're starting to reappear already. I wonder if VIA get paid per pothole filled or something.

It's no wonder it feels like progress isn't being made.

At this time of year, or more so in the earlier part of winter, they will usually carry out a quick repair, with the intention of permanently repairing it at a later date (I guess if some temporary repairs last, especially on minor roads or residential streets, they will leave them as they are to preserve what funds they have). In Winter, there are so many defects for the staff and resources councils have, that they are struggling to keep up and deal with.

[Runwell]

I guess the dire situation with funding means defects that would normally be fairly high on the list for sorting out, are not even seen as a priority these days, if this is anything to go by? https://twitter.com/deneuk12/status/177 ... QUG-A&s=19

[Helvellyn]

I see endless moaning on Facebook (other social media is available) about this pothole or that pothole but more often than not these people would rather moan in public than report the fault to their council.

They seem to believe that councils can detect potholes remotely/automatically, or perhaps via extra sensory perception - or that it is not their role to report things.
In my experience when I report a pothole to our county council (Kent) via their portal, they do attend site and make a temporary repair if required, with a more permanent solution often following. I have even had the inspecting engineer ring me up to let me know what's happening.

I suppose there's a perception that yes, they should indeed know. If you're responsible for something part of that job is to monitor its condition. So the council should keep an eye on the state of council-maintained roads, just as Network Rail should keep an eye on the state of the rail network. The bins get emptied (every now and then) which means they go over just about every road, so there's a source of reporting. If they hadn't sold all of that off...

[FosseWay]

I see endless moaning on Facebook (other social media is available) about this pothole or that pothole but more often than not these people would rather moan in public than report the fault to their council.

They seem to believe that councils can detect potholes remotely/automatically, or perhaps via extra sensory perception - or that it is not their role to report things.
In my experience when I report a pothole to our county council (Kent) via their portal, they do attend site and make a temporary repair if required, with a more permanent solution often following. I have even had the inspecting engineer ring me up to let me know what's happening.

I suppose there's a perception that yes, they should indeed know. If you're responsible for something part of that job is to monitor its condition. So the council should keep an eye on the state of council-maintained roads, just as Network Rail should keep an eye on the state of the rail network. The bins get emptied (every now and then) which means they go over just about every road, so there's a source of reporting. If they hadn't sold all of that off...

I can see both sides of that. If an isolated pothole opens up in an otherwise reasonable surface then yes, if you want it fixed then bringing it to someone's attention is not the daftest idea, and we can't expect every inch of every road to be checked every week or whatever.

On the other hand, cases like the road in Sheffield I linked to upthread consist of large areas of clearly substandard surface that have been like that for years. Ignorance is no excuse for inaction in these cases, though shortage of resources may be.

Compare what we as car owners are expected to do. We are obliged to get our cars tested once a year, and that test should pick up anything that we as non-automotive experts can't be expected to find out for ourselves. But that doesn't absolve us of the duty to do really obvious things like checking tyre tread and fluids much more regularly and fixing them off our own bat without prompting from the system.

[Brenley Corner]

The bins get emptied (every now and then) which means they go over just about every road, so there's a source of reporting. If they hadn't sold all of that off...

Also falls down to the many different councils. Here our bins are emptied by the District Council and the roads are maintained by the County Council

[trickstat]

The bins get emptied (every now and then) which means they go over just about every road, so there's a source of reporting. If they hadn't sold all of that off...

Also falls down to the many different councils. Here our bins are emptied by the District Council and the roads are maintained by the County Council

Same with me and the bin collections are contracted out.

[deadly]

I see endless moaning on Facebook (other social media is available) about this pothole or that pothole but more often than not these people would rather moan in public than report the fault to their council.

In Staffordshire, before road repairs were outsourced, reporting a pothole via the council website would often see a repair the following day. Now outsourced, it's gradually got to the point that there's no point in reporting them any more - they are eventually assessed and always deemed to be non-urgent, and then never fixed.

So you can't blame people for moaning on social media.

[RichardA35]

I see endless moaning on Facebook (other social media is available) about this pothole or that pothole but more often than not these people would rather moan in public than report the fault to their council.

In Staffordshire, before road repairs were outsourced, reporting a pothole via the council website would often see a repair the following day. Now outsourced, it's gradually got to the point that there's no point in reporting them any more - they are eventually assessed and always deemed to be non-urgent, and then never fixed.

So you can't blame people for moaning on social media.

The point is they are wailing into an empty echo chamber. The relevant authorities do not have people monitoring random social media pages in the remote expectation that a relevant issue arises.
In the time spent typing out their post, the user could have filled in the council's reporting form and submitted the report but that doesn't get the approbation of their peers and start "a conversation". It does bring the issue to the council's attention, however, which surely should be the point of the person's actions rather than getting "likes" for their posts.

[fras]

I see endless moaning on Facebook (other social media is available) about this pothole or that pothole but more often than not these people would rather moan in public than report the fault to their council.

In Staffordshire, before road repairs were outsourced, reporting a pothole via the council website would often see a repair the following day. Now outsourced, it's gradually got to the point that there's no point in reporting them any more - they are eventually assessed and always deemed to be non-urgent, and then never fixed.

So you can't blame people for moaning on social media.

The point is they are wailing into an empty echo chamber. The relevant authorities do not have people monitoring random social media pages in the remote expectation that a relevant issue arises.
In the time spent typing out their post, the user could have filled in the council's reporting form and submitted the report but that doesn't get the approbation of their peers and start "a conversation". It does bring the issue to the council's attention, however, which surely should be the point of the person's actions rather than getting "likes" for their posts.

Cheshire East use the FixMyStreet facilities for highway defect reporting and it generally works quite well with the odd hiccup. Of course with central government ruthlessly cutting council grants for roads maintenance for 20 years, the roads have got worse and worse, although dangerous defects do get fixed fairly promptly, but the general state of the roads here is absolutely dire now. All over the place, the top wearing surfaces are spalling leaving shallow pits that arfen't considered a hazard by the council.

[fras]

In Staffordshire, before road repairs were outsourced, reporting a pothole via the council website would often see a repair the following day. Now outsourced, it's gradually got to the point that there's no point in reporting them any more - they are eventually assessed and always deemed to be non-urgent, and then never fixed.

So you can't blame people for moaning on social media.

The point is they are wailing into an empty echo chamber. The relevant authorities do not have people monitoring random social media pages in the remote expectation that a relevant issue arises.
In the time spent typing out their post, the user could have filled in the council's reporting form and submitted the report but that doesn't get the approbation of their peers and start "a conversation". It does bring the issue to the council's attention, however, which surely should be the point of the person's actions rather than getting "likes" for their posts.

Cheshire East use the FixMyStreet facilities for highway defect reporting and it generally works quite well with the odd hiccup. Of course with central government ruthlessly cutting council grants for roads maintenance for 20 years, the roads have got worse and worse, although dangerous defects do get fixed fairly promptly, but the general state of the roads here is absolutely dire now. All over the place, the top wearing surfaces are spalling leaving shallow pits that aren't considered a hazard by the council. Anywhere one goes now at night means risking pothole damage as they cannot be seen.

[deadly]

In Staffordshire, before road repairs were outsourced, reporting a pothole via the council website would often see a repair the following day. Now outsourced, it's gradually got to the point that there's no point in reporting them any more - they are eventually assessed and always deemed to be non-urgent, and then never fixed.

So you can't blame people for moaning on social media.

The point is they are wailing into an empty echo chamber. The relevant authorities do not have people monitoring random social media pages in the remote expectation that a relevant issue arises.
In the time spent typing out their post, the user could have filled in the council's reporting form and submitted the report but that doesn't get the approbation of their peers and start "a conversation". It does bring the issue to the council's attention, however, which surely should be the point of the person's actions rather than getting "likes" for their posts.

Cheshire East use the FixMyStreet facilities for highway defect reporting and it generally works quite well with the odd hiccup. Of course with central government ruthlessly cutting council grants for roads maintenance for 20 years, the roads have got worse and worse, although dangerous defects do get fixed fairly promptly, but the general state of the roads here is absolutely dire now. All over the place, the top wearing surfaces are spalling leaving shallow pits that arfen't considered a hazard by the council.

Staffordshire stopped accepting submissions via FixMyStreet - presumably because FixMyStreet makes it too easy to see the extent of unresolved reports. It's a shame, because FixMyStreet is so much easier to use than the abomination of a website provided by the council.

Regarding an echo chamber, if the ranting is made in one of the local Facebook groups, these tend to be followed by local councillors. To that extent, submitting a form to a council website seems more the echo chamber.

[Brenley Corner]

I see endless moaning on Facebook (other social media is available) about this pothole or that pothole but more often than not these people would rather moan in public than report the fault to their council.

In Staffordshire, before road repairs were outsourced, reporting a pothole via the council website would often see a repair the following day. Now outsourced, it's gradually got to the point that there's no point in reporting them any more - they are eventually assessed and always deemed to be non-urgent, and then never fixed.

So you can't blame people for moaning on social media.

Well, they DEFINITELY aren't going to be fixed if nobody reports them; bit of a vicious circle there. If they aren't fixed after a while then remind them politely.

Its exactly what RichardA35 says, moaning into social media is no more than a collective wringing of hands and saying how bad things are these days with nil hope of anything being fixed - absolutely futile. No organisation has the resources to cover the whole of every social media site on the off chance than someone has moaned in a small village group about a pothole.

[Runwell]

The point is they are wailing into an empty echo chamber. The relevant authorities do not have people monitoring random social media pages in the remote expectation that a relevant issue arises.
In the time spent typing out their post, the user could have filled in the council's reporting form and submitted the report but that doesn't get the approbation of their peers and start "a conversation". It does bring the issue to the council's attention, however, which surely should be the point of the person's actions rather than getting "likes" for their posts.

Cheshire East use the FixMyStreet facilities for highway defect reporting and it generally works quite well with the odd hiccup. Of course with central government ruthlessly cutting council grants for roads maintenance for 20 years, the roads have got worse and worse, although dangerous defects do get fixed fairly promptly, but the general state of the roads here is absolutely dire now. All over the place, the top wearing surfaces are spalling leaving shallow pits that arfen't considered a hazard by the council.

Staffordshire stopped accepting submissions via FixMyStreet - presumably because FixMyStreet makes it too easy to see the extent of unresolved reports. It's a shame, because FixMyStreet is so much easier to use than the abomination of a website provided by the council.

Essex also hasn't used FMS for a long time, if ever. They signpost people to the Essex Highways page.

[Runwell]

I see endless moaning on Facebook (other social media is available) about this pothole or that pothole but more often than not these people would rather moan in public than report the fault to their council.

In Staffordshire, before road repairs were outsourced, reporting a pothole via the council website would often see a repair the following day. Now outsourced, it's gradually got to the point that there's no point in reporting them any more - they are eventually assessed and always deemed to be non-urgent, and then never fixed.

So you can't blame people for moaning on social media.

Well, they DEFINITELY aren't going to be fixed if nobody reports them; bit of a vicious circle there. If they aren't fixed after a while then remind them politely.

Essex make a point of asking people NOT to keep posting about the same issue(s), as it will not ensure a faster response. They only ask people to report the same issue again if the defect has worsened significantly since the last report/inspection.

There was a large defect on a very busy roundabout that was a real hazard near me by early Autumn. It was marked out for repair, but unlike two issues a few yards away, it wasn't repaired. Inevitably the defect got worse and expanded so badly that it went beyond all the original spray markings! Only in the last week has it been marked out again for repair, so let's hope it does get done this time, especially as the defect has become virtually impossible to avoid hitting in recent weeks.

[rhyds]

I've reported the same gaping chasm in the road outside my front door twice in the last two months. Its still "on the works programme" with Gwynedd CC, and is presently depositing gravel all over the pavement and splashing my front door every time a car hits it on a wet day.

I've raised the issue with my local county councillor, and the next step will be social media, mainly to let everyone know that if they have any vehicle damage as a result of the potholes I'm more than happy to share the acknowledgements for my reports so they can initiate claims against the council.

[RichardA35]

I've reported the same gaping chasm in the road outside my front door twice in the last two months. Its still "on the works programme" with Gwynedd CC, and is presently depositing gravel all over the pavement and splashing my front door every time a car hits it on a wet day.

I've raised the issue with my local county councillor, and the next step will be social media, mainly to let everyone know that if they have any vehicle damage as a result of the potholes I'm more than happy to share the acknowledgements for my reports so they can initiate claims against the council.

...and that is the correct way to hold an authority to account.

If only the "instant gratification social media generation" realised that if it isn't reported on the official system, then the issue doesn't exist however many smiley faces or thumbs up a facebook post about it may have received.

[deadly]

I've reported the same gaping chasm in the road outside my front door twice in the last two months. Its still "on the works programme" with Gwynedd CC, and is presently depositing gravel all over the pavement and splashing my front door every time a car hits it on a wet day.

I've raised the issue with my local county councillor, and the next step will be social media, mainly to let everyone know that if they have any vehicle damage as a result of the potholes I'm more than happy to share the acknowledgements for my reports so they can initiate claims against the council.

...and that is the correct way to hold an authority to account.

If only the "instant gratification social media generation" realised that if it isn't reported on the official system, then the issue doesn't exist however many smiley faces or thumbs up a facebook post about it may have received.

The availability of a website for members of the public to report potholes does not diminish the council's responsibility to regularly inspect their own highways. Every pothole that is moaned about on our local social media (in groups followed by councillors) has been present and developing for several years. The highways department *will* be aware of them, but it appears they've spent their central-government-provided (and widely promoted) "pothole" fund on LED street lights that don't illuminate the road effectively.

[rhyds]

I've reported the same gaping chasm in the road outside my front door twice in the last two months. Its still "on the works programme" with Gwynedd CC, and is presently depositing gravel all over the pavement and splashing my front door every time a car hits it on a wet day.

I've raised the issue with my local county councillor, and the next step will be social media, mainly to let everyone know that if they have any vehicle damage as a result of the potholes I'm more than happy to share the acknowledgements for my reports so they can initiate claims against the council.

...and that is the correct way to hold an authority to account.

If only the "instant gratification social media generation" realised that if it isn't reported on the official system, then the issue doesn't exist however many smiley faces or thumbs up a facebook post about it may have received.

The problem is that for a while social media was a powerful tool to get companies and government agencies to do stuff. Back when companies first started creating social media presences these were managed by their publicity and/or marketing teams. That meant that when you involved their social media page your issue would be leapfrogged ahead of the usual calls/emails because effectively you were talking directly to their marketing team, who wanted to preserve their image and who had the authority to chase up problems outside of the usual scripts/responses.

Thing is, everyone soon got wise to this, and both the social media platforms and the various customer relationship management systems soon developed tools to allow social media pages to simply shunt requests in to the same call/email queue as everyone else.

[Helvellyn]

I see endless moaning on Facebook (other social media is available) about this pothole or that pothole but more often than not these people would rather moan in public than report the fault to their council.

They seem to believe that councils can detect potholes remotely/automatically, or perhaps via extra sensory perception - or that it is not their role to report things.
In my experience when I report a pothole to our county council (Kent) via their portal, they do attend site and make a temporary repair if required, with a more permanent solution often following. I have even had the inspecting engineer ring me up to let me know what's happening.

I suppose there's a perception that yes, they should indeed know. If you're responsible for something part of that job is to monitor its condition. So the council should keep an eye on the state of council-maintained roads, just as Network Rail should keep an eye on the state of the rail network. The bins get emptied (every now and then) which means they go over just about every road, so there's a source of reporting. If they hadn't sold all of that off...

I can see both sides of that. If an isolated pothole opens up in an otherwise reasonable surface then yes, if you want it fixed then bringing it to someone's attention is not the daftest idea, and we can't expect every inch of every road to be checked every week or whatever.

On the other hand, cases like the road in Sheffield I linked to upthread consist of large areas of clearly substandard surface that have been like that for years. Ignorance is no excuse for inaction in these cases, though shortage of resources may be.

Compare what we as car owners are expected to do. We are obliged to get our cars tested once a year, and that test should pick up anything that we as non-automotive experts can't be expected to find out for ourselves. But that doesn't absolve us of the duty to do really obvious things like checking tyre tread and fluids much more regularly and fixing them off our own bat without prompting from the system.

I fully agree with that. The isolated pothole in an otherwise decent surface should get picked up at some point without being reported, but that might take a little while and cause a bit of damage in the meantime, so a prompt report should get it sorted before then.

The MoT analogy is a good one.

Ignorance is no excuse, and deliberate ignorance even less so (if there's somewhere on social media that everyone except the council seems to know about where they're getting mentioned it looks even worse for the council).